Mississauga Hurontario-Main Line 10 LRT | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx

This whole debate with the LRT just makes me think even more that Peel should follow the lead of York and Durham Regions and upload all transit in the region under their control. That way the Mississauga-Brampton border would merely be a symbolic border like Victoria Park is for the TTC. PS: Halton should do the same thing, maybe even more so, as Oakville and Burlington are possibly even more interconnected than Brampton and Mississauga are.
 
The story has been re-written (at least in the local, Star owned, paper.........the Star's Grewal seems happy to leave it hanging ). Turns out all Fennell was proposing is running Zum buses to Port Credit until the LRT is built....not in place of LRT.

Too bad (IMO) because this LRT plan offers very little value to very few Bramptonians.

Hey, on the bright side, it does give Brampton two way, all day rail service!
 
Hey, on the bright side, it does give Brampton two way, all day rail service!

I know you are kidding.....but that is one of the things I don't like about this LRT. I fear the big move never gets fully implemented.....the GO service never gets fully implemented and Brampton is to be satisfied with a 40 minute LRT ride to all day GO......a 40 minute LRT line that stubs barely into Brampton and serves a very small portion of Brampton's population.

My position is Brampton should oppose this line until all day bi-directional 7 day GO train service is provided.
 
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.a 40 minute LRT line that stubs barely into Brampton and serves a very small portion of Brampton's population.
The vast majority of Mississauga, like Brampton, is suburban and isn't served by the LRT line either.

As for a stub...Brampton's portion of Hurontario is 12 km (Mayfield to just south of the 407). The LRT will be on approximately 6 km, half of that.

That's not a stub in any measure. A stub would be to Steeles, or Ray Lawson.

If they want to serve more of Brampton, use the rail corridor just west of downtown Brampton and get it up to Mayfield, if they want it.
 
My position is Brampton should oppose this line until all day bi-directional 7 day GO train service is provided.

Come on, TOareaFan. It's because of this kind of attitude that no transit expansion ever happens in this city.

"Oh hear that waterfall coming? I'm not going to row the boat away from it unless you row the boat first"
 
This whole debate with the LRT just makes me think even more that Peel should follow the lead of York and Durham Regions and upload all transit in the region under their control. That way the Mississauga-Brampton border would merely be a symbolic border like Victoria Park is for the TTC. PS: Halton should do the same thing, maybe even more so, as Oakville and Burlington are possibly even more interconnected than Brampton and Mississauga are.

It was supposed to happen in 1974 and die. Yes it is time for Peel Transit or what every you call it and get rid of the 2 systems.

Since one of the blocker of the one system will be gone in 2014 or sooner, the other will be gone as well if she continue her ways.

I know Halton has being talking about merging the current 3 system, but only talk so far. Burlington love to see this happen as they have no use for their current system, let alone fund it.
 
Come on, TOareaFan. It's because of this kind of attitude that no transit expansion ever happens in this city.

Not all transit expansion is good....this one (IMO) is over built/expensive for what/where it is and, from a Brampton perspective, is of very little value......certainly a loss less than full GO train service which can be delivered but we are being told we have to wait for.



"Oh hear that waterfall coming? I'm not going to row the boat away from it unless you row the boat first"

You're gonna have to explain to me how this keeps our boat from going over the falls.
 
It was supposed to happen in 1974 and die. Yes it is time for Peel Transit or what every you call it and get rid of the 2 systems.

Since one of the blocker of the one system will be gone in 2014 or sooner, the other will be gone as well if she continue her ways.

I know Halton has being talking about merging the current 3 system, but only talk so far. Burlington love to see this happen as they have no use for their current system, let alone fund it.

What would we gain from a merger?
 
It was supposed to happen in 1974 and die. Yes it is time for Peel Transit or what every you call it and get rid of the 2 systems.

Since one of the blocker of the one system will be gone in 2014 or sooner, the other will be gone as well if she continue her ways.

I know Halton has being talking about merging the current 3 system, but only talk so far. Burlington love to see this happen as they have no use for their current system, let alone fund it.

Hopefully that can happen before the Hurontario LRT is open. I can only imagine how complicated VIVA would be if the borders between Vaughan, Richmond Hill, and Markham actually mattered.

As for Halton, personally I think they should become the Guinea Pig for uploading to Metrolinx. Work out a standard formula (something like for every $1 in property taxes collected, $0.05 gets sent to Metrolinx, or whatever fixed % you want) so that the Municipality is still paying part of the cost, but the system is run and maintained by Metrolinx.

Transit usage is Halton is very small, and is heavily centred around the Lakeshore West GO line. Having all of that under the Metrolinx umbrella could boost ridership and efficiency.

This would also serve as a template for the future uploading of MiWay, Brampton Transit, YRT, DRT, HSR, and eventually the TTC. Work out the kinks in the upload process with relatively small systems, and then work up from there.
 
I think the LRT should terminate at the 407. That way the City of Brampton will have more money to spend on upgrading the Kitchener GO corridor for all-day train service.
 
What would we gain from a merger?

Stream lining of a system where you don't have to change twice on the same route, less management, better use of resources, a network, better service 7 days a week just a few things.

The LRT is not an over price or expensive since it does a number of things. It drives development a lot faster with a higher return on the investment.

It offer a smother ride with more space. You can set a headway of 5-10 minutes today and it will not change for at least 20 years since you are starting out with one car and add 2 more as needed over time. You need to add more buses and personnel to match that increase of ridership while the LRT is adding no personnel and only equipment.

The real big different between buses and LRT is operation cost.

Even though a BRT can be built cheaper than an LRT, it cannot beat the cost of operating the line as an LRT over a 30 year life cycle.

Using 5,000 riders from a single point that started off at 2,000 over 30 years, an LRT will save $250m in both operation cost as well maintenance and replacement cost. This does not take into consideration the cost of fuel as it is impossible to say what it will be over the course of the 30 year cycle.

In 2010, I did a spreadsheet using the current cost of MT new buses as well TTC buses, current MT wage cost, LRT cost and used X riders. I them determine the number of vehicles that would be be required to move X riders from a single peak point. I then used standard 40', 60' double deck hybrid buses as a well an LRT to determent the number of vehicles would be required to move X riders to get the headway. Using 3% for increase of ridership as well wage cost over 30 years along with 1% in capital cost, you start to see changing numbers for everything. As ridership increase, headway fall as well requiring more vehicles. If I follow the headway of the buses, you were seeing a bus every 30 seconds at the end of 30 years and that not going to happen without major problems. On the LRT side I looked at the different between using 1, 2 or 3 cars to the point after 30 years, you were seeing a 3 car train every 3 minutes.

I have never finalize this spreadsheet nor got around to adding in more info since 2010 and one of my many do items. The numbers don't lie nor did I try to skew things like a lot of consultants do to the point it has been backup by a peer review of planners and consultants around the world.

LRT is the way to go period even though parts of the corridor will never meet LRT numbers in the first place. TTC Subway system already shows that today after 40 years of service.
 
There aren't actually many opportunities for combining MT and BT bus routes. 5 Dixie for example already has a 55-60 minutes running time. Combining it with 18 Dixie would be a terrible idea. So I don't much point in merging the two systems. There is a limit to how long bus routes can be, and both MT and BT have reached, or even exceeded, that limit.
 
I think the LRT should terminate at the 407. That way the City of Brampton will have more money to spend on upgrading the Kitchener GO corridor for all-day train service.

How much did the Lakeshore communities contribute to the upgrades on their corridor?
 

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