Steve X
Senior Member
The rest of the routes (501,504,505,506,512) are all long routes. I don't see how useful it would be if they were assigning new cars for accessible service.
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DSC
Superstar
Member Bio
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- Jan 13, 2008
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- St Lawrence Market Area
As the 'old schedule" of deliveries was not met (by far) it would have been pretty silly of the TTC to have maintained their old schedule of deployment; as others have said above the Flexities offer barrier-free access and more capacity. Yes, adding a few of them to all routes would generally increase capacity (if done on one for one basis - and that's a big 'if') and would give 'spotters' the amusement/satisfaction at seeing them all over the system BUT this arrangement would be of no help to the mobility-challenged as they would never have enough on any route to be able to rely on getting one. The real problem is that Bombardier have been far too slow to meet their contractual obligations and the TTC are having to rebuild old clunkers just to keep service operating.
Steve X
Senior Member
If TTC really wanted to have accessible service, they could assign some buses to every route except for those that aren't possible (e.g. 512).
drum118
Superstar
While you have 2 good legs, you don't care about the accessiblity community who have been waiting decades to use an east-west route to use the systems that can't be done today.
Having 2 to start with will not do much, but its a startiong to the point that you keep adding 2 at a time as the car arrive. With the GPS trackers, the mobility-challenged can check to see when the next one will show up so they can use it.
If you take the next 34 cars with 10 going to 514 and 4 to the other routes, that will be a good start for mobility-challenged community, as well people with strollers/carts. With 514 been 100% new cars, it provide 504 riders in the high ridership point good quality of service with 4 cars doing the rest not covery by 514.
To make the 2-4 cars work correctly, this is where Line Managment needs to do its part to make sure there is 1-2 in each end sections at all time. We know TTC doesn't understand Line Management and don't be surprise to see both in the same end to the point of following the leader like 510 saw most of the time, as well 509.
Given how short TTC is on buses these days, not going to be easy to have them on all lines as well maintain existing service on routes they run on in the first place.
the lemur
Senior Member
I feel like the 511 is getting shortchanged in this whole process.
On another note, I keep seeing sidewalks with boxes drawn on them in spraypaint and the words 'TTC pole pocket' written inside, often near existing stops but not always. Is this something to do with changing to catenary wire?
Napoleon
Active Member
I'm going to have to politely disagree with this. I think there's very little use sticking cars haphazardly on routes all over the system. Just think about it, if there's only 2 new cars on Queen or College routes...the expected time between arrivals would be well over an hour. I don't think anyone is going to sit around and attempt to plan on the arrival of the one accessible streetcar. Also given the quality of the TTC's line management, I would not be surprised to see the two accessible cars end up following one behind the other...indeed that often happened on Spadina in the early days with the poor blending of the service branches.
Much better to convert the lines one or two at a time. Then riders can consistently have the expectation of seeing an accessible streetcar with some regularity, i.e., they're willing to wait one or two streetcars but not an hour and a half.
As for the order, I'm puzzled why the 511 is next...I would imagine the biggest bang for the buck would be to concentrate on the highest ridership lines like 504. 511 doesn't seem to have anywhere near that level of ridership.
drum118
Superstar
Find.
How would you do it to comply with the Human Rights Ruling requiring new cars be on all routes by 2018???
How does TTC deal with the hard rock place they are in to comply with not only the Human Right Requirements, but MTO as well, considering the cause is beyond TTC control in the first place??
As long there are new cars on each route by 2018 regardless if it 2-8, TTC is complying with the requirement until they can get all line 100% done. They could add more cars to routes that a longer to travel as well carrying ridership as they get them.
As to what routes should be 100% complete before other is still for debate and that is now a moving target now starting with 514.
All Ontario Transit systems had to do this phase in on low floor buses to comply with the 2011 dead line. Various systems noted what time a Low Floor Bus was to arrive at a stop on a posted schedule.
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Steve X
Senior Member
Just wait till the new car short turns. With a 3 hour long round trip on the 501, 4 cars in good placement would result in 45 minute wait for one. A bad schedule would mean a 2 hour wait.
The 514 is much shorter than the 504, 505 and 506. As I said before, if they want accessibility, just run a few buses on every route and put some new cars on the 512.
dowlingm
Senior Member
Hold up. Which ruling is this? I've had a quick look in CanLII and I can't see anything that looks like that.
EDIT:
https://www.ttc.ca/TTC_Accessibilit...ce_Transit_Plan_2015/Ongoing_Plans_2015-2.jsp
says nothing about accessible streetcars on all routes in 2018. It says all routes accessible by 2019, and it is a "commitment" which is based on LFLRVs being delivered.
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dowlingm
Senior Member
They are flipflopping 502/503 to streetcars and buses depending on what they are short of. The present shortage is buses, so back to streetcars it is and also why they wanted 514 to start now so they could take King buses too.
Steve X
Senior Member
Except they never planned it as accessible service. Given the fact that shuttle buses are very likely to be filled up, it's not very accessible. The 506 bus is horrible. They are either packed or bunched with 4 in a row. I feel sorry to those who have to endure this crappy service that TTC is offering.
W. K. Lis
Superstar
An excellent reason for keeping the 501 and 504 streetcars running even after the DRL is built. Whenever the DRL is down because of work to be done on it, or other problems (like the elevators are out-of-service), the streetcars would be able to handle more people than the buses.
EastYorkTTCFan
Senior Member
plus 511, 512 and part of 506 are using buses only for a little while. So they have all the cars that would normally be assigned to them sitting idle.
EastYorkTTCFan
Senior Member
Alos I saw 4413 in service on 514 today and rode it out to Dufferin.
cplchanb
Senior Member
So has there been anything new at the plant lately? When is the next car expected to arrive according to the schedule?