Transit City: Sheppard East Debate

[nfitz]

How do we create a thread so that update information regarding the progress of this project is available, rather than one that is arguing the benefits pro and against the project?

 

[kEiThZ]

^ You could create a construction/project updates thread. Nothing is stopping you from doing that.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

^ You could create a construction/project updates thread. Nothing is stopping you from doing that.

There's also nothing stopping anyone from posting whatever they want in that thread. Either the entire forum would have to collectively promise to not post anything unless it's a newpaper article without comment or a link to a new report or a substantiated rumour or a photo update, or it'd have to be continuously moderated.

It might be easier if moderators occasionally just scanned through other threads, extracted "updates," and placed them into a new mod-controlled thread.

 

[kEiThZ]

To whom it may concern:

The Sheppard East LRT have been planned, studied, and funded for and its first phase of construction preparations has already begun. The fact that there are a number of people on this forum who feel the zeal to progressively dismiss the merits of this project and target anyone who feels otherwise does not overcome the reality that the project will indeed go on and our infrastructure will be built.

Therefore to debate against those who will never cease to assert their discretional claims, and the same whom who are under the impression that tireless promulgation of tired opinions in pointless discussions will actually contribute to the betterment of society, is a pointless waste of everybody's time and the world's resources.

I support the Sheppard LRT and lucky for me all three levels of government support it too.

I'm happy that it is being built and I think it'll do great for Toronto.

I invite those who agree with me to exit this meaningless debate and let the other side flourish in their own opinions without costing us our most precious resource, time.

Regards,

I don't believe it's a waste of time at all. Before I joined UT I knew very little about TC and was generally supportive of the plan. The more I've learned the more I've come to oppose elements of the plan like the SELRT, particularly when I study the impact on my community (Malvern). And I have taken it outside the internet. I have begun a letter writing campaign against the SELRT and more broadly against TC in general. I resent the fact that TC has raised a technology (LRT) to the level of an ideology. It's become one size fits none. I want appropriate technologies for appropriate corridors.

For Sheppard, bus lanes east of Agincourt and a subway extension to Agincourt from the west would be fine. At some point down the road they can then end the line at Scarborough Town Centre.

I don't believe it's a waste of time to campaign for what you believe in. Suggesting other wise is highly insulting, offensive and runs against the grain of our democratic traditions.

 

[nfitz]

^ You could create a construction/project updates thread. Nothing is stopping you from doing that.

And nothing is stopping the Nimby's threadjacking it either. I think the mods have to do something ... not to stifle debate, but at least so there can be a forum just discussing the project itself.

 

[kEiThZ]

And nothing is stopping the Nimby's threadjacking it either. I think the mods have to do something ... not to stifle debate, but at least so there can be a forum just discussing the project itself.

This thread was never reserved specifically for construction updates. Obviously that makes it available to discuss the merits of the project. Civility has ruled in some threads (ie GO Service Improvments, Victoria station upgrades, etc.) where it's clear that the discussion is strictly non-political. Might take a tad bit of policing by the mods though.

Beyond that, do you really have to name call anybody who is opposed to a specific project a NIMBY? Regardless of the context of their opporsition? I am not opposed to any and every transit improvement. I just want something that's better than what's being proposed. If you've been to Malvern, you'll know that a bus lane could actually be faster than a LRT. Also, given the spur being built to STC, I am worried that service to Malvern will decline rather precipitously beyond the few meagre buses that are there today. The bulk of Sheppard's riders are located between Don Mills and McCowan. How long before the TTC decides that only one in three LRTs is heading to Malvern?

 

[UD2]

I don't believe it's a waste of time at all. Before I joined UT I knew very little about TC and was generally supportive of the plan. The more I've learned the more I've come to oppose elements of the plan like the SELRT, particularly when I study the impact on my community (Malvern). And I have taken it outside the internet. I have begun a letter writing campaign against the SELRT and more broadly against TC in general. I resent the fact that TC has raised a technology (LRT) to the level of an ideology. It's become one size fits none. I want appropriate technologies for appropriate corridors.

For Sheppard, bus lanes east of Agincourt and a subway extension to Agincourt from the west would be fine. At some point down the road they can then end the line at Scarborough Town Centre.

I don't believe it's a waste of time to campaign for what you believe in. Suggesting other wise is highly insulting, offensive and runs against the grain of our democratic traditions.

riiiiight... vive la liberté.


People find ways to agrue everything. Even about if or not to argue.


whatever...

 

[kEiThZ]

riiiiight... vive la liberté.


People find ways to agrue everything. Even about if or not to argue.


whatever...

Heaven forbid we should have citizens who are passionate and engaged in a civil discourse about the future of their communities. With attitudes like yours, no wonder we have such poor turnouts at the polls.

 

[nfitz]

Heaven forbid ...

Let's leave religion out of this.

 

[kEiThZ]

My next letter about TC and the SELRT is to Smitherman....Hopefully, it'll feed his future campaign.

Just so nobody thinks I am a luddite, I actually do support LRT in some corridors: Finch West, Waterfront West and East, north-south routes like McCowan, Warden, Kennedy, etc.

 

[Second_in_pie]

My next letter about TC and the SELRT is to Smitherman....Hopefully, it'll feed his future campaign.

Just so nobody thinks I am a luddite, I actually do support LRT in some corridors: Finch West, Waterfront West and East, north-south routes like McCowan, Warden, Kennedy, etc.

Oh man, LRT along McCowan, Warden and Kennedy?! As long as they at least hit Highway 7

I agree though. I support LRT in several routes like Finch West, Islington, Jane, and Kingston road, as well as true LRT on all the current Streetcar routes. That doesn't mean I believe that LRT is a one size fits all form of transit though. I support the Sheppard Subway because it's a needed portion of the network, that has a very concentrated ridership in an almost perfect corridor.

I sure hope Smitherman takes a serious look at TC for his campaign, and make it a true rapid transit system instead of a stupidly political LRT-centric barely plan-worthy "plan."

 

[kEiThZ]

I have even included the "Transfer City" moniker in there. Maybe it'll come in handy...

 

[GTS]

For Sheppard, bus lanes east of Agincourt and a subway extension to Agincourt from the west would be fine. At some point down the road they can then end the line at Scarborough Town Centre.
QUOTE]

You should think about making something called a deputation at the monthly public TTC meetings. They are very democratic and everyone has a voice by allowing us, the public, to make deputation. Transit is in itself a very political entity. If you made a deputation for the Sheppard line to Agincourt I am sure you would get support. That is exactly what I would prefer. If SELRT is built it will make the Malvern Bus Garage not as efficient and needed- it is near the intersection of Markham and Sheppard.

We have to support the infrastructure we have already invested in such as the Malvern bus garage and of course the Sheppard subway. If the Sheppard subway was extended to Agincourt- their could be a very good interchange between subway and commuter rail at that GO station as well as Sheppard buses and Kennedy buses.

I think a lot about this route as my wife and I used to live near Sheppard and Meadowvale when I first moved to Toronto 4 years ago, and I always hoped that the Sheppard subway would get more funding.

 

[Ansem]

My next letter about TC and the SELRT is to Smitherman....Hopefully, it'll feed his future campaign.

Just so nobody thinks I am a luddite, I actually do support LRT in some corridors: Finch West, Waterfront West and East, north-south routes like McCowan, Warden, Kennedy, etc.

I think we should all contribute to give ideas to his letter.

Don't forget to include why he should do this. He's a politician...What's in it for him?

-Well, A subway vs an LRT??? Subways is a much more popular idea espacially when there is a consensus in the city that Toronto lacks subway.

-This would give him the support from the business community who are against the project on Sheppard.

-This would give him North York and Scarborough votes on a silver plater and motivate people to go to vote. Miller was elected because the vote % was low. If the vote % is high and the suburs vote, he will be in trouble.

-He could be the mayor who ''unified the city''.
A non stop rapid transit from Downsview to STC via NYC and both subway lines.
We're talking about a whole new dynamic north of Toronto. Condo Projects, new businesses, new jobs available and the list goes on.

I live near Sheppard and Keele. Going to Scarborough would be more interestiong if I didn't have to do this.

a)Bus 106 or 108A to Downsview Stn
b)TRANSFERT***84 Bus to Sheppard-Yonge
c)TRANSFERT***Subway to don Mills
d)TRANSFER***bus 190 to STC

Students from Scarborough will have 2 unnecessary transfers to get to York univ. when the Spadina extension will be complete

-Ridership? He could order a study calculating the potential ridership of Sheppard from Downsview to STC. Yes the WHOLE line unlike miller who only took east of Don Mills.

Knowing that 5KM and 5 stations alone beats and rivals with some of Chicago's longest line and going downtown in term of ridership, imagine the whole line. Sheppard avenue West is a nightmare during peak time and addind more buses doesn't do anything...they are stuck in traffic.

-With his connections with the Ontario governemt, if Miller got his plan financed buy the liberals, he can hardly do worse...

-Main reason: He gets North York and Scarborough votes...

East of McCowan, be my guess if you want to put LRT. A year from now, they won't reach McCowan anyways and it will be election time.

 

[nfitz]

If you made a deputation for the Sheppard line to Agincourt I am sure you would get support.

You expect someone making a deputation to a TTC meeting, to reverse something that they approved unanimously way back in June 2008, have got full provincial and federal funding for, and is in the process of being tendered, would get support?

Whatever the merits be, or not be, I think that claiming that a nobody could walk into a TTC meeting and get support on such a huge reversal of a decision by the same commissioners is extremely naive.