SmartTrack (Proposed)

[robmausser]

Heh, exactly my thoughts.


I assume Steve meant that the TTC it nuts if they think they'll be operating on these rail corridors while sharing the track with other services (GO, UPX, CN, etc...).

More than anything, I'm surprised that the TTC would even want to operate here. It's quite a departure from their typical operating environment.

I'm sure in the 1940's everyone felt the same way about the TTC operating a subway.

 

[robmausser]

Relevant context: Positive Train Control Thread.

Specific quote of interest: from this document of Transport Canada flexibility on non-FRA trainsets (e.g. trains resembling LRTs and Trams running on GO rail):



Metrolinx has been gradually working on the latter two (along with grade separations), and eventually the day may arrive where we see lighter rail trains running on parts of the GO network, including the very possibility of tram-trains for some routes.

I think PTC would be such a huge asset to GO RER/Smarttrack anyways because it could afford extremely tight headways. We could have 5 minute frequencies during rush hour.

So PTC would be of double benefit.

 

[mdrejhon]

I'm sure in the 1940's everyone felt the same way about the TTC operating a subway.

Subways? Pie in the sky. Only when pigs can fly!

 

[dowlingm]

I think the issue with positing either a tram train or Euro/CEM train coexisting with even 1 conflicting FRA service is how soon all of the necessary pieces would be in place to allow Transport Canada to approve it. I doubt it would be in time for SmartTrack to conform to John Tory's electoral promises.

 

[cplchanb]

I would be pretty disappointed if TC actually needs more than 7 years (or whatever x years tory promised to implement) to make their minds. Its not like this is a new piece of tech, rather its north america once again lagging behind the rest of the world and not in any hurry to catch up...

 

[junctionist]

View attachment 56134


Subways? Pie in the sky. Only when pigs can fly!

It wasn't that people couldn't imagine a subway in Toronto. The idea had been around since the 1910s. Subways existed in Rochester, Cleveland, Chicago and New York--cities Torontonians would have been familiar with. They just didn't want to vote approve the necessary tax increase when the question was put on the ballot.

 

[Adjei]

So now they also want a new alignment from the railway corridor into the airport as well as an extension on Eglinton? What is this project morphing into?

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Steve posted his article regarding yesterdays meeting: http://stevemunro.ca/2015/09/29/a-frustrating-update-on-transit-expansion-plans/

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Link to yesterday's presentation: http://ttc.ca/About_the_TTC/Commiss...oTransit_Expansion_Projects_Status_Update.pdf

 

[Adjei]

Steve Munro makes an important point:

"RER is a major infrastructure plan for Ontario and its agency Metrolinx, and when completed, it will make a huge difference in travel around the GTHA. Whether and how SmartTrack actually fits into this is quite another matter. Metrolinx openly speaks of SmartTrack as if it is simply a supplementary GO service stopping at more stations, while the TTC talks of SmartTrack as its own operation with widespread integration of TTC services and SmartTrack stations."

Something is going to have to give.

 

[nfitz]

So now they also want a new alignment from the railway corridor into the airport as well as an extension on Eglinton? What is this project morphing into?

That's 2 alternative alignments for heavy rail. Neither enter the airport. If you look at the blow-up on the next page, the line stays just inside the City of Toronto boundary from Eglinton all the way up to 407. Which is truly absurd that it would run right past the edge of the runway, and not far from old terminal 2, but wouldn't serve the airport. You have to think this was thrown on the wall to be rejected.

 

[Adjei]

That's 2 alternative alignments for heavy rail. Neither enter the airport. If you look at the blow-up on the next page, the line stays just inside the City of Toronto boundary from Eglinton all the way up to 407. Which is truly absurd that it would run right past the edge of the runway, and not far from old terminal 2, but wouldn't serve the airport. You have to think this was thrown on the wall to be rejected.

2 alternative alignments for what? Alternatives to the Eglinton West part?

 

[nfitz]

2 alternative alignments for what? Alternatives to the Eglinton West part?

There are 2 different routes proposed to get heavy rail from Mount Dennis station to Renforth station.

The dashed line and the solid line. See the blow-up image on page 23 of the PDF:

 

[TheTigerMaster]

The Eglinton ST alignment is objectively stupid, and the only reason it's being considered is because it was part of Tory's platform. Hopefully next month's report will come back with something more resonable (like an ECLRT extension in dedicated ROW).

 

[CapitalSeven]

Essentially that's the base case documents refer to. What if the work comes back and says maximum ridership is about 2000 per hour? Do you build an LRT extension for that, or the equivalent of a DRL? When there little development potential along the line, except in Mississauga, and it misses half the transit lines in the area? John Tory ought to have surgery that week, or rescue some orphans from a fiery crash as a distraction.