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Metrolinx: Sheppard East LRT (In Design)

I thought we've been through this point before. So for the third or fourth time, people on Sheppard would see similar gains with a subway to Kennedy all the way to about Neilson when taking rush hour numbers for the busses that'd be running on Sheppard East after Agincourt. But take note that the vast majority of people living on Sheppard and who'd be the most inclined to take transit are those from Don Mills to Agincourt.
 
Yeah, then I'm talking about that it's not like people out in Malvern will be left out in the dark with a subway. Perhaps best saved for the transit city thread, I admit. Though I may note that if the future Sheppard LRT is real, a future Sheppard Subway would be real as well.

What would be the preferred numbers for a rush hour bus on Sheppard? It's not like it's that congested out past Agincourt. Perhaps a lower number might be needed west of Agincourt, but then it might only have a total time 10 minutes faster than the bus.

I'm curious on the TTC's estimates of 23 km/h. How did they calculate that?
 
I'm curious on the TTC's estimates of 23 km/h. How did they calculate that?
Computer model - according to the June 2008 FAQ:
"The Micro-simulation model developed for Sheppard East LRT showed the following results: 800 metre spacing*** 26-to-27 kph vs. 400 metre spacing: 22-to-23 kph".​

It then goes on to say that:
"It is expected that the LRT will travel at speeds of about 22km-25km depending on the number of stops in the final design."​

The disparity is that the stop spacing is not 400 metres between each stop, and is often greater. I used 22.5 km/hr in the calculations above, to remain conservative, and no one would accuse me of underestimating the LRT travel time. I also calculated the distances from Don Mills Road, but with the station box for Don Mills station being further east, there'll be a bit of saving there too.

As for future subways, let's keep this thread for discussion in the progress of the LRT, and use one of the many other threads for discussion of other projects.
 
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Yes, in fact. Best analog to the SELRT we have. I'd expect travel times to be quite similar, but I doubt that it even does 20 km/h.
One would not expect that travel times would be similar. The 6.5-km line has (according the TTC website) 25 stops (26 including the terminus). That's a stop spacing of only 260 metres! In addition, the traffic lights along this road are much more dense than along Sheppard.

The only analogue I can think of on the entire system, is the 2.3 km from Parkside Drive to Humber Loop on The Queensway. There are 5 stops along here, with an average spacing of 460 metres. Taking 6 minutes for this trip (according the Trip Planner westbound at 5 pm), the average speed is 23 km/hr.
 
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1) you are comparing off-peak 2) you are ignoring the significant gains that it makes west of Kennedy; east of Kennedy isn't as bad. 3) you are comparing to 2010 times; the LRT lines are premised on the massive gridlock estimated in 2031.

If Kennedy’s the split point where the average speed of bus trip increases significantly eastwards, to speeds of up to 26kph, then perhaps that’s the inference you should take notice of. Kennedy’s westwards is the bottleneck, we alleviate that choke point for bus routes feeding into Don Mills by extending the subway over to Kennedy. It’s simple logic. Do you anticipate multiple condominiums lining the eastern part of the Sheppard corridor anytime soon, or won’t Malvern-Rouge River’s population density be expected to float around the 75,000 – 100,000 mark indefinitely, for decades beyond 2031? Just for whom are we building the latter 10 kilometres of this beast for anyway when it promises to skip all of the major nearby trip-generators and provide the most circuitous routing to UTSC ever conceived?

If the travel time is only 32 minutes (and reliable) with the LRT, compared to 45 minutes (and unreliable) then that is a huge time savings. That's a 13 minute time savings. Probably more, given that it will only be a short distance with no steps from the door to the subway, to the door to LRT, compared to the long walk currently from the platform, to the bus bay. That walk alone must be 2-3 minutes. Let's be charitable and say that the total savings is 15 minutes. 30 minutes a day. 2.5 hours a week. 125 hours a year.

What’s making it reliable other than it being in a private ROW with signal priority and fewer stops? Were it asphalt and concrete instead of steel rails and catenaries, would it be any less dependable? Don Mills is a poorly designed interchange station because, guess what, it was never intended to be the final stop. Phase 1 was intended to at least bring the line to the Scarborough border whereby a majority of the splinter routes (10, 169, 167, 24, 224, 122?, 67?) would have a direct connection and avoid the timely 404 crossing. Any future extension east building built in mind to accommodate cross-platform LRT would have that incorporated from conception, not tacked on years later in the name of crafting a political legacy. Lastly people from far east Scarborough (and Durham) would be much better off to be provided with a TTC express bus service following the 401 into Don Mills Stn. Done. More affordable, faster and more effective. And it wouldn't take years on end of waiting for citizens to actually experience shorter commute times either, its implementation-ready now.

What kind of NIMBY would describe that as measly!

The kind that doesn’t want to witness businesses close down, the elderly and infirm forced to walk longer to their nearest stop, needless transfers, and the like for the sake of lining developers’ pockets and for optics to dazzle the int’l community with for all of two weeks when reserved bus lanes down the same corridor would be just as fast; and subway down over a third of said route would be even faster!
 
Kennedy westwards is the bottleneck, we alleviate that choke point for bus routes feeding into Don Mills by extending the subway over to Kennedy. It's simple logic.

The bottleneck is eliminated with LRT. Problem solved and no need to spend a fortune building a subway.

Do you anticipate multiple condominiums lining the eastern part of the Sheppard corridor anytime soon, or won't Malvern-Rouge River's population density be expected to float around the 75,000 - 100,000 mark indefinitely, for decades beyond 2031?

There are a ton of condos downtown serviced by streetcars. The whole Etobicoke Waterfront, Cityplace, Fleet St, etc... streetcars. Condos on Sheppard can be handled by LRT.

The kind that doesn't want to witness businesses close down, the elderly and infirm forced to walk longer to their nearest stop, needless transfers, and the like for the sake of lining developers pockets and for optics to dazzle the int'l community with for all of two weeks when reserved bus lanes down the same corridor would be just as fast; and subway down over a third of said route would be even faster!

If you don't want the elderly or infirm to be forced to walk longer distances you should be supportive of LRT on Sheppard because unlike the LRT on Eglinton which will really have stops spaced out, Sheppard will have them much closer together, much closer than any subway would. Thankfully those elderly people on Sheppard will not have to do with the pain of a subway. If you want to keep money out of developers pockets then subway definitely isn't the way to go. I don't think the plan is to dazzle the international community because if it was they would be building the most extravagant subway system possible... one that rivals Moscow with chandeliers and ornate and intricate detailing.
 
Also, hate to butt in, but could someone tell me what is up with construction on the subway extension towards vaughan? No digging I suppose, but what are they doing?
Among other things, they are currently digging the TBM launch sites - or at least one of them. There has been discussion about this on that thread.

And... the sheppard tram connection to the purple line - is it still gonna be an underground tram stupidity?
No, it will not be underground tram stupidity.
 
Renaming of Mc Asphalt Park to Joyce Trimmer Park (Sheppard Avenue E. and Conlins Road)
Thursday July 8 at 10AM.
Mayor Miller, Councillor Cho, and City of Toronto representatives will be there

- Since the park is right beside the future SELRT maintenance and storage facility, I am sure the Mayor, Councillor Cho and City of Toronto representatives might discuss and make a brief tour of the site. Therefore, I might stop by and hear what they have to say
 
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Renaming of Mc Asphalt Park to Joyce Trimmer Park (Sheppard Avenue E. and Conlins Road)
Thursday July 8 at 10AM.
Mayor Miller, Councillor Cho, and City of Toronto representatives will be there

- Since the park is right beside the future SELRT maintenance and storage facility, I am sure the Mayor, Councillor Cho and City of Toronto representatives might discuss and make a brief tour of the site. Therefore, I might stop by and hear what they have to say

Please update us if you do end up stopping by!
 
Renaming of Mc Asphalt Park to Joyce Trimmer Park (Sheppard Avenue E. and Conlins Road)
Thursday July 8 at 10AM.
Mayor Miller, Councillor Cho, and City of Toronto representatives will be there

- Since the park is right beside the future SELRT maintenance and storage facility, I am sure the Mayor, Councillor Cho and City of Toronto representatives might discuss and make a brief tour of the site. Therefore, I might stop by and hear what they have to say

But what of poor Hamish McAsphalt, who gave so much to his community? Doesn't he deserve recgonition?

:p
 

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