Danforth Line 2 Scarborough Subway Extension

[WislaHD]

People going west from Scarborough, I think, don't care whether they're going along Eglinton or Bloor/Danforth. They're likely going to transfer at Yonge anyway. This also has the benefit of moving the traffic out of the bursting Yonge/Bloor Station.

It is pretty foreseeable that Yonge-Eglinton will become the second choke point of the system once the Crosstown is complete. I'm betting the experience for Scarborough commuters will be the same whether they transfer to Yonge on Bloor or on Eglinton.

Except Eglinton will likely be slower & less frequent than Bloor-Danforth above ground, and commuters will still have to travel between Eglinton and Bloor to their downtown destinations.

 

[innsertnamehere]

Plus Eglinton is a centre platform, even less space than Bloor-Yonge.

 

[WislaHD]

Plus Eglinton is a centre platform, even less space than Bloor-Yonge.

Oh don't remind me. During rush hour if there is a long enough delay the station quickly fills up with people and the distance between the centre wall and the edge is way too narrow, making walking down the platform a scary enough experience for those of us wary of the edge. I doubt this will get better with the Crosstown feeding more people into the station on a regular basis.

I know that the Eglinton station is being moved up Yonge several dozen meters as part of the Crosstown construction, but my understanding is that the new station location is a legacy of the original subway construction and maintains the centre platform. Shame a complete rebuild of the station with a Spanish solution is out of question.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Of course you are entitled to your opinion about the utility of the whole subway project. We have to agree to disagree on that matter

Please do tell me what additional utility the subway project would have over Lakeshore East RER, Stouffville RER, Scarbrough LRT and elevated Eglinton LRT.

But if the subway is getting built, it makes a lot of sense to add a station in the Eglinton & Danforth area.

No it doesn't. Kennedy is just down the street. As someone who up until recently traveled through that area daily, this proposal to spend hundreds of millions on a station there seems wholly absurd to me. Especially since we're already blowing [at least] $3.5 Billion to appease those who fetishize about underground railways.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

I still have a hard time understanding why a 3 stop subway line has a budget of 3 billion (or did I read the numbers wrong?)

You read my numbers wrong.

The project does not cost $3 Billion. It costs $3.5 Billion.

As for why its so expensive, I'm not quite sure. It's significantly more expensive than the Spadina extension. I suppose we'll know when the reports come out.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Aside: can we stop with the ridiculousness about elevating the LRT? It's not going to happen, and the absolutely only reason to even think about doing it would be to pander to the dimbulbs that have had this 'bright idea' 10 years after everyone else.

It's an exercise to demonstrate how absurdly expensive this project is, compared to the alternatives.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Listening to councillors talk about transit during a council meeting is for the most part absolutely brutal. Their lack of knowledge can be mind-blowing sometimes, there's nothing worse than hearing whining about "fairness", "equality", "deserve". Yes you guys are real civil rights leaders.

Subways are the great civil rights issue of our era.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

I told you guys this would happen!! The gap between Kennedy and Woburn (Brimley-Danforth-Lawrence) is way too large not the have any stops, and it would increase the cost. Plus not the Scarborough Malvern LRT will never be built because of this station. This subway will cost 5.5 billion when built, bank on it.

$5.5 Billion. How will this go to $3.5 Billion to $5.5 Billion?

 

[BurlOak]

It's an exercise to demonstrate how absurdly expensive this project is, compared to the alternatives.

No, it is to demonstrate how absurdly expensive this project is, compared to ONE alternative

 

[salsa]

Please do tell me what additional utility the subway project would have over Lakeshore East RER, Stouffville RER, Scarbrough LRT and elevated Eglinton LRT.

No it doesn't. Kennedy is just down the street. As someone who up until recently traveled through that area daily, this proposal to spend hundreds of millions on a station there seems wholly absurd to me. Especially since we're already blowing [at least] $3.5 Billion to appease those who fetishize about underground railways.

I would also add that a station at Eglinton & Danforth will be about halfway between Kennedy GO and Eglinton GO, all of which are on the same street. With that plus Smart Track and Lawrence East subway station, this part of the city will be grossly over-served by expensive high capacity transit.

 

[BurlOak]

$5.5 Billion. How will this go to $3.5 Billion to $5.5 Billion?

If the cost is much more than $3.5B, then the option could be.

$1.5B B-D extension to Kingston (road, not city)
$0.5B Elevate ECLRT
$2.0B Connected SRT to Malvern
$4.0B

The big problem is that the original planners grossly underestimated the annoyance of the Kennedy transfer. Someone should lay these alternative on the table because as far as the politicians know, the only options are the Transit City LRT - which will cost many their elected positions, and s B-D subway extension - regardless of cost.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

$5.5 Billion. How will this go to $3.5 Billion to $5.5 Billion?

Cost overruns and this station. I can easily see the station become 500 million, happens all the time everywhere else.

If the cost is much more than $3.5B, then the option could be.

$1.5B B-D extension to Kingston (road, not city)
$0.5B Elevate ECLRT
$2.0B Connected SRT to Malvern
$4.0B

The big problem is that the original planners grossly underestimated the annoyance of the Kennedy transfer. Someone should lay these alternative on the table because as far as the politicians know, the only options are the Transit City LRT - which will cost many their elected positions, and s B-D subway extension - regardless of cost.

We're stuck with the subway thanks to JT.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Please do tell me what additional utility the subway project would have over Lakeshore East RER, Stouffville RER, Scarbrough LRT and elevated Eglinton LRT.



No it doesn't. Kennedy is just down the street. As someone who up until recently traveled through that area daily, this proposal to spend hundreds of millions on a station there seems wholly absurd to me. Especially since we're already blowing [at least] $3.5 Billion to appease those who fetishize about underground railways.

The gap between Kennedy and Lawrence East is the reason the station has to be built. Kennedy is just out of walking range but too close to drive. This is another reason the SMLRT was a better solution, it provided mulitple stations between Kennedy and Kingston Road.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

The gap between Kennedy and Lawrence East is the reason the station has to be built. Kennedy is just out of walking range but too close to drive. This is another reason the SMLRT was a better solution, it provided mulitple stations between Kennedy and Kingston Road.

Take the bus to Kennedy. We don't need stations in walking range.

 

[Rainforest]

Please do tell me what additional utility the subway project would have over Lakeshore East RER, Stouffville RER, Scarbrough LRT and elevated Eglinton LRT.

As I pointed out several times, through-routing of Scarbrough LRT and elevated Eglinton LRT is not viable unless DRL is added.

Lakeshore East RER and Stouffville RER will have very limited capacity, until the downtown RER tunnel is built. Downtown RER tunnel is a long shot.

Without the subway extension, many downtown-bound riders from Scarborough will have to transfer from buses to LRT to BD subway to YUS subway. The subway extension makes their trip more convenient.

No it doesn't. Kennedy is just down the street. As someone who up until recently traveled through that area daily, this proposal to spend hundreds of millions on a station there seems wholly absurd to me. Especially since we're already blowing [at least] $3.5 Billion to appease those who fetishize about underground railways.

Then you should conclude that about 20% of the existing subway stations are equally or more absurd, as well as the planned underground Oakwood, Caledonia, Mt Pleasant stations of Eglinton LRT.

It puzzles me that, amid all talk about walk-in accessibility and transit-oriented development, we balk at adding a station that will be very well used.