TTC: Sheppard Subway Expansion (Speculative)

[Solid Snake]

I think you are giving way too much credit to Miller. Explain to me why the province will fund it if it doesn't see it in their interest to do so? (vs. say, Jane or WWLRT?) And you haven't really addressed my point - if the DRL is so important to the province/Metrolinx, then why is it on the backburner? Not one provincial government since the Peterson era expressed any interest in building that line (or on that matter, any mayors since what, Eggleton?), even though the writing is on the wall for all to see that the situation is rapidly heading back to that of the late 80s. And let's move things back to the current administration as well - if you shall recall from his campaign lit, Sheppard and BD extension is pretty much the ONLY subway line to be considered. No DRL, no tunneled Eglinton, nothing. Clearly, the blind spot for DRL runs left, right and centre.

AoD

No. Miller is not getting enough credit for this whole mess.

-He killed the DRL study for his precious Transit City plan.

-He made Sheppard LRT his absolute priority above everything else. It seems that Yonge being overcrowded was no a big deal after all and building all those LRT lines would somehow fix Toronto's problem.

-The province? They don't care about the DRL that much since in the Union Station study they are studying the GO tunnel as well. In the end the decision might be purely economics since both final scenario fix their problem with Union and that all they care about

-It's been written in so many article how dysfunctional Metrolinx is and how much they lack leadership. Don't tell me that you still haven't figured out that Metrolinx does what the city wants it to do and they just write cheques.

-Metrolinx wanted Eglinton fully grade separated. It was in their interest to have Eglinton operate at subway speed since it was a fit to their regional vision. But Miller said no and they just went ahead and obeyed. Province/Metrolinx cares about GO, not the municipal transit companies. It will fund them but never tell them what to do.

-Why the DRL is on the backburner? Miller wanted DRL to be way after Transit City and hypocrites like Stinz and Vaughan all votes for that.

-At that time the province was willing to spend 17.5 Billions and DRL didn't came as the first logical thing to do??????? If he took the money and started the dig, imagine what we would have had already.

-Not a fan of Ford but since Miller put Sheppard has the absolute priority, Ford stopped it and promised a subway instead.

So no, Miller and his LRT obsession did and will do more harm than good. No wonder Byford is saying subways, subways. He must be telling himself, "What on earth are they doing????? LRT to substitute for subways??? Imagine if the Brits and French did that...."

Even Montreal is not doing that. They could have taken LRT for the blue line but "It made no sense to the STM"

 

[Dan416]

The Sheppard East LRT was purely political. I hope it is never built. So many projects better than the SELRT. DRL, Hurontario, Hamilton, GO improvements.

This obsession with screwing Scarborough is psychotic.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

The Sheppard East LRT was purely political. I hope it is never built. So many projects better than the SELRT. DRL, Hurontario, Hamilton, GO improvements.

This obsession with screwing Scarborough is psychotic.

No one wants to screw Scarborough. That is a myth created by the Ford brothers which has torn this city apart.

 

[car4041]

The Sheppard East LRT was purely political. I hope it is never built. So many projects better than the SELRT. DRL, Hurontario, Hamilton, GO improvements.

This obsession with screwing Scarborough is psychotic.

That's a bizarrely paranoid interpretation. Rather than screwing Scarborough, maybe the motivation is to give Scarborough an improved form of transit -- and since the ridership projections clearly don't support subways, LRT is an appropriate mode. You do realize that more Sheppard East councillors voted for the LRT than against it? Do you think these councillors also have a psychotic obsession with screwing their own constituents?

 

[44 North]

@solid snake

Miller had no choice. He made Sheppard a priority for LRT to silence the people along Sheppard. They - and SOS - were way to vocal for something that was never a priority, or made sense for that matter. Those very same people are the reason why Ford's behind the subway 100%. He could care less about it, but since "everyone calls him supporting it" (yeah right); then he has to support it too.

LRT on Sheppard was a peace offering. A token to pacify the suburban homeowners that would never even use a subway, let alone one outside their doorstep.

 

[Rainforest]

-Why the DRL is on the backburner? Miller wanted DRL to be way after Transit City and hypocrites like Stinz and Vaughan all votes for that.

Stinz and Vaughan never voted for or against DRL. They did not promote DRL, but Ford and his supporters did not promote it either.

Ford, after being elected, would have been in a much better position to advance DRL (that is, if he was interested).

 

[Rainforest]

@solid snake

Miller had no choice. He made Sheppard a priority for LRT to silence the people along Sheppard. They - and SOS - were way to vocal for something that was never a priority, or made sense for that matter. Those very same people are the reason why Ford's behind the subway 100%. He could care less about it, but since "everyone calls him supporting it" (yeah right); then he has to support it too.

LRT on Sheppard was a peace offering. A token to pacify the suburban homeowners that would never even use a subway, let alone one outside their doorstep.

Frankly, prioritizing another corridor (Finch West, or Eglinton - Kingston Rd - UTSC) would be a much better peace offering.

 

[car4041]

Frankly, prioritizing another corridor (Finch West, or Eglinton - Kingston Rd - UTSC) would be a much better peace offering.

Politically, I guess it would be a better peace offering to say "OK, we'll give you nothing and let you sit on buses while you dream about an unrealistic subway for a few more years," but only because of our ridiculously polarized politics in which any transit investment less than a subway equates to "getting screwed".

Mammoliti was/is trying to manufacture the same kind of situation on Finch West: don't screw us over now by giving us an LRT when we might get a subway in 50 years! I'm not really sure how much we should let this kind of sentiment guide our transit planning...

 

[Palma]

The Sheppard East LRT was purely political. .

And building that subway along Sheppard wasn't when it was built?

 

[EnviroTO]

This obsession with screwing Scarborough is psychotic.

I think the belief that giving Scarborough something instead of nothing somehow equates to "screwing Scarborough" is far more psychotic to me. There is a real disconnect between saying other projects are more important than Sheppard East, and building less than a subway is screwing Scarborough. If other projects are more important that Sheppard and Sheppard is getting something then Sheppard is being given undue favoritism, not being screwed. It is like saying Fred needs no money right now, stop screwing Fred by giving him $25K, only $250K is acceptable. It is completely illogical.

Easy answer. A certain David Miller decided that Sheppard Avenue LRT was more important than the DRL. Remember him?

No, David Miller decided that Sheppard Ave LRT was more important than a DRL LRT, especially for a plan whose goal is to reach every part of the city with transit improvements. Do you think a DRL LRT would make more sense for reaching more potential new transit riders? DRL should be a subway and DRL is about dealing with existing riders more than it is bringing in new riders... both not in scope of Transit City which was a "city-wide" plan.

 

[Palma]

I t Do you think a DRL LRT would make more sense for reaching more potential new transit riders? DRL should be a subway and DRL is about dealing with existing riders more than it is bringing in new riders... both not in scope of Transit City which was a "city-wide" plan.

The DRL was also suppose to be a subway not an LRT

 

[W. K. Lis]

The DRL was also suppose to be a subway not an LRT

The DRL could be light rail subway or heavy rail subway, depending on the study. If it were light rail, it could continue on up Don Mills at the surface, if the need is there.

 

[EnviroTO]

The DRL was also suppose to be a subway not an LRT

Transit City is an LRT plan. Everything in it was LRT since its focus was covering the city and there is no money to cover the city with subways. If the DRL was in the Transit City plan it would have been an LRT and that study had partly occurred as part of the Don Mills Transit corridor studies that provided multiple possibilities of getting the Don Mills BRT/LRT to connect to the Bloor-Danforth line for Phase 1 and downtown for Phase 2. Those options focused mainly on LRT but BRT was looked at, and options of connecting to Castle Frank via a Redway Road / CP connection to Thorncliffe Park and a LRT subway under Pape were examined. If it is important to you that Don Mills / DRL not be LRT then be very happy it wasn't part of Transit City.

 

[Paleo]

The Sheppard East LRT was purely political. I hope it is never built. So many projects better than the SELRT. DRL, Hurontario, Hamilton, GO improvements.

This obsession with screwing Scarborough is psychotic.

The amount of cognitive dissonance in your statements about some of these projects and not to mention neurosis is off the charts. Come on, screwing Scarborough? lol

 

[W. K. Lis]

According the CP24 News, there was a power failure which slowed Sheppard subway service:

Subway service was slower than normal on the Sheppard line for a few hours Monday morning following a power failure that delayed the start of service.

At one point, subways weren't running between Sheppard-Yonge and Don Mills stations due to a power failure at Sheppard-Yonge Station.

Service resumed a short time later, but it was a little behind due to the initial delay. The TTC operated shuttle buses for a couple hours to augment service until service returned to normal by 7:30 a.m.

Did anyone notice?