TTC: Flexity Streetcars Testing & Delivery (Bombardier)

[pstogios]

And I agree with you completely. Management at Bombardier has made their bed and now they'll have to sleep in it. This bungled TTC streetcar deal will cost Bombardier future deals, at least in Ontario. Of course Bombardier is a transnational corporation. They recently signed a deal with SNCF in France. Maybe North America just isn't that important for Bombardier.

As far as pstogios is concerned, he has these little temper tantrums in which he stamps his little taxpayer feet and demands instant gratification. This adds nothing of value to the discussion and it is tiresome.

Excuse me?

I have nothing against Bombardier. Or you. I'm not sure how accusing me of tantrums adds anything of value.

Accountability matters. Fiscal prudence matters. Contracts matter. Deadlines matter.

If we don't speak up when standards aren't met, then we will continue to be worse off as a society.

If you enjoy paying more of your hard-earned dollars because of the extra spending TTC has been forced to incur because of Bombardier's poor performance... if you don't support legal proceedings against them to recover those funds... if you enjoy hundreds of millions of dollars of taxpayer money going to vehicles which at this rate will arrive years behind schedule (at least, until pressure as put on Bombardier to get their act together)....then we have nothing further to discuss.

 

[books]

Excuse me?

I have nothing against Bombardier. Or you. I'm not sure how accusing me of tantrums adds anything of value.

Accountability matters. Fiscal prudence matters. Contracts matter. Deadlines matter.

If we don't speak up when standards aren't met, then we will continue to be worse off as a society.

If you enjoy paying more of your hard-earned dollars because of the extra spending TTC has been forced to incur because of Bombardier's poor performance... if you don't support legal proceedings against them to recover those funds... if you enjoy hundreds of millions of dollars of taxpayer money going to vehicles which at this rate will arrive years behind schedule (at least, until pressure as put on Bombardier to get their act together)....then we have nothing further to discuss.

And I have nothing against you. However your "I'm a god because I pay taxes" routine has worn a bit thin.

Management at Bombardier has messed up badly on this contract, obviously there's no argument there. But why you've been going around counting the number of Flexities that the TTC has in service at any given moment and then attributing that to a conspiracy on the part of the TTC is very bizarre.(http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/thread...elivery-bombardier.3263/page-620#post-1164611)

No, I don't enjoy paying extra money because of Bombardier's poor performance and none of the other words that you attempted to put in my mouth are true either. I can speak for myself, thanks anyway.

The bottom line is that the TTC is committed to this contract; backing out now would cost the city even more and delay the introduction of new streetcars by years. I agree with you that holding corporations accountable is important. What is equally important is to understand the complexity of dealing with a corporation that has production facilities spread out over North America and Europe, a corporation which may not see the TTC streetcar deal as its highest priority.

Toronto will have its streetcar fleet completely replaced in due time, the new streetcars are very nice, and Bombardier will likely lose several contracts in Ontario (mostly LRT lines) as a result of its egregious behaviour on this contract. So, my friend, the universe is unfolding as it should.

P.S. I think we're pretty well off as a society despite the late delivery of the streetcars.

 

[JamesKoole]

From reddit.com/r/toronto: http://i.imgur.com/4FSGmgD.jpg

 

[rbt]

... and Bombardier will likely lose several contracts in Ontario (mostly LRT lines) as a result of its egregious behaviour on this contract.

I doubt that. They might lose a few but I suspect they'll also keep a few but at a much more profitable price.

Expect Bombardier to be part of the consortium bidding on these lines (LRVs, maintenance, and operations components) and they still have a significant price advantage (a signed purchase agreement they can agree to let lapse without penalty in exchange for the new tender) even with the new free trade agreements in play. They also have an advantage of a huge number of staff locally (economies of scale in management overhead) since they already operate and maintain GOs fleet.

Bombardier will not be disqualified from bidding and I expect they'll win either Finch or Hurontario and be financially better off than if they built the LRVs alone (their Canadian content component will be gone; they could kick the vehicles out of their European factories and ship 'em).

 

[drum118]

Nov 27

 

[drum118]

Nov 27

 

[JJ's Trackside Rambles]

Here is the Flexity Freedom Light Rail Vehicle pilot vehicle for the Eglinton Crosstown LRT Project. It emerged from the Bombardier plant in Thunder Bay on Friday, November 25th, 2016, and is seen here on the outbound track, ready for pickup by the CP switcher. It will be forwarded to Toronto on CP Train 420 and forwarded on to the plant in Millhaven, Ontario for testing. Bryan Martyniuk photo with permission

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Whoever designed the Metrolinx LRV needs to take pointers from the LFLRV. The ML LRV is so bland.

 

[crs1026]

Whoever designed the Metrolinx LRV needs to take pointers from the LFLRV. The ML LRV is so bland.

The added width sure makes it look much less sleek than the TTC version. I wonder if the lack of colour is a sign that no decision has been made about how the Crosstown fleet will be painted.

- Paul

 

[innsertnamehere]

why is 4402 over on Long Branch? Don't they get delivered directly to Hillcrest?

 

[drum118]

why is 4402 over on Long Branch? Don't they get delivered directly to Hillcrest?

All the cars are delivery to Hillcrest and then tow to Leslie. Out for testing and burn in.

Should be in service by Friday or the weekend if there are no problems. 4427 could enter service about 3 days after 4402, depending if TTC can test 2 cars at the same time.

 

[dowlingm]

All the cars are delivery to Hillcrest and then tow to Leslie. Out for testing and burn in.

Should be in service by Friday or the weekend if there are no problems. 4427 could enter service about 3 days after 4402, depending if TTC can test 2 cars at the same time.

I wonder if things will get more efficient* with commissioning when streetcars arrive more frequently/regularly, so that Hillcrest/Leslie personnel can work on them more continuously rather than being pulled in for a few days here, a month goes by, then a few days on another.

* Please note - not adverse commentary on how long things are taking now, just that the right conditions might not exist for them to be better still.

 

[M II A II R II K]

So they'll bunch 3 of these together on Line 5.

 

[EastYorkTTCFan]

I wonder when more of them weil get regular advertising in them other then the ones that have been wrapped? It seems odd that they have gone so long with out advertising in them. like fr example I know the Toronto Rockets had no adds for about a month and you sometimes see the occasionally one without them is there some reason they are harder to get advertising revenue for them buses or the older fleet?

 

[Steve X]

I wonder when more of them weil get regular advertising in them other then the ones that have been wrapped? It seems odd that they have gone so long with out advertising in them. like fr example I know the Toronto Rockets had no adds for about a month and you sometimes see the occasionally one without them is there some reason they are harder to get advertising revenue for them buses or the older fleet?

Initially TTC has stated they won't advertise inside the car. They done it with the wrapped cars.