nfitz
Superstar
Subway from the Queensway to Port Credit on Hurontario? SOS should become $O$
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Transit City: Sheppard East Debate
- Thread starter unimaginative2
- Start date
Juan_Lennon416
Senior Member
Stay on topic!
nfitz
Superstar
Fair enough, perhaps a mod should move the last few posts to the Hurontario thread
Second_in_pie
Senior Member
There's a Hurontario thread? If so, that would be appropriate.
nfitz
Superstar
Since 2006 - http://www.urbantoronto.ca/showthread.php?t=3299
kettal
Banned
I have to say, this post really takes your credibility down a few notches.
Fresh Start
Banned
Hurontario doesn't need a subway line, HOWEVER, if part of the LRT say from the QEW to the 403 were in an underground ROW, commute times through the densest and most congested section of that corridor would be alleviated. I just can't picture surface ROW coexisting with motorists and pedestrians at busy intersections like Dundas or Burnhamthrope. That's an accident waiting to happen.
I would also recommend further apart spacing for this line, more like a subway, with the local buses that route along Hurontario e.g. 10 Bristol filling in the gaps. I'd do: Lakeshore, Port Credit GO (underground), Mineola, Harborn, (Queensway-Paisley, Dundas, Hillcrest-Cooksville GO, Fairview-Central Pkwy, Elm-Burnhamthrope, Robert Speck, Square One/CCTT: all underground), Kingsbridge-Eglinton, Trailwood-Bristol, Matheson-Waitline, Brunel-Britannia, Courtney Park-Ambassador, Derry Road, Topflight/407 GO, County Court, Steeles/Bartley Bull, Nanwood, and Downtown Brampton (underground).
I would also recommend further apart spacing for this line, more like a subway, with the local buses that route along Hurontario e.g. 10 Bristol filling in the gaps. I'd do: Lakeshore, Port Credit GO (underground), Mineola, Harborn, (Queensway-Paisley, Dundas, Hillcrest-Cooksville GO, Fairview-Central Pkwy, Elm-Burnhamthrope, Robert Speck, Square One/CCTT: all underground), Kingsbridge-Eglinton, Trailwood-Bristol, Matheson-Waitline, Brunel-Britannia, Courtney Park-Ambassador, Derry Road, Topflight/407 GO, County Court, Steeles/Bartley Bull, Nanwood, and Downtown Brampton (underground).
kettal
Banned
scarberiankhatru
Senior Member
The topic of conversation is rapid transit, not street furniture.
kettal
Banned
Ansem
Banned
good,
are you starting to realize that "speed" is an issue.
Lrt can work on the right corridors and at the right speed and stop spacing.
Eglinton and Sheppard are not meant for LRT
Wilson, Lawrence, Dufferin and Islington are better than Sheppard
Justin10000
Banned
Speed is not the issue. Accessibility is much more important. How you choose ignore this is astounding. The heaviest traveled lines are the ones with stations with walking distance of each other. Speed is not the issue. It's a component, but you have to factor in convenience, and accessibility also.
Ansem
Banned
What's wrong with the 85 bus stops? they seem very accessible to me and there are way to many bus stops on Sheppard anyways but they are more accessible than even the LRT which would eliminate many stops.
Accessibility? What's wrong with keeping the 85 bus with all its stops and having a subway on the same corridor? It gives citizens a faster access to rapid transit while having a bus stop at the corner of their street. Wanna bet that many drivers would instantly leave their cars at home for the subway?
This scenario is much more accessible than your glorified streetcar.
Speed is not the issue??? Something costing taxpayer a billion dollar makes it a huge issue...
The TTC keeps on advertising Transit City AS RAPID TRANSIT and that's ok with you? You do know that's a lie and yet, you choose to ignore it every freakin time.They know that citizens would not tolerate a BILLION dollar for another St.Clair streetcar.
Where Eglinton looks more like a LRT route and even Finch West, Sheppard east is clearly a ''glorified streetcar''
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Justin10000
Banned
Now you're talking about the bus? All right.
By your logic, the Sheppard Subway should not have been built, and I agree. Sheppard Subway = waste of money.
Because it is a waste of resources to offer 2 different services on one corridor. If that was the case, you would think Sheppard's ridership would be higher. It's not. No one is using the bus service to access the subway. Who the hell wants to wait for a bus at the stations, only to have to walk again? It's stupid. The Sheppard Subway is not a feeder line, and never will be. Actually your scenario is pretty hypocritical. You moan about transfers, yet it's OK to take a bus to the subway.
The ridiculous traffic on Sheppard, and the low subway ridership tells me you made a fool's bet.
Your scenario is a failure. I'm willing to bet if surface rail was built on Sheppard instead of the subway, there would a line from Downsview to Meadowvale by now, and the ridership would put the current ridership to shame. All the Sheppard subway did was transfer former bus ridership. Sure there are more riders, but the subway is not even close to capacity.
Your scenario is not accessible. It's a waster of resources, and attracts the minimal amount of riders.
Yes, and that is why the Sheppard Subway is called Lastman's Folly. 1 Billion dollars wasted on what is essentially a under-capacity express subway. Focusing on speed is a waste of money, since the line becomes less accessible. Don't you get it from the articles, and comments at the open houses? People want ACCESSIBILITY. Speed is a factor too, but you need to find a good balance between the 2. If someone cannot walk, or at leas bike to a station, chances are they will not bother.
Who cares? God. You just don't get it. What is the point of "Rapid Transit", if you cannot capture the most riders? A subway with 1km station spacing does not work in Toronto! The TTC, and city finally learned their lesson and are actually bringing high capaciy transit TO THE RIDERS. LRT is the best mode for that. It's you,and the rest of the subway advocates who ignore the demands of citizens that wanted the stations put in. Hell, people are complaining that the station spacing on Eglinton is too wide! It's clear you, and others do not know what people want, but still make asinine assumptions.
Seriously stop speaking for citizens. You clearly have no idea what they want.
I love anti-transit assumptions. You think there is an unlimited amount of money floating around. You blame Miller for creating a plan at a time, that the city could afford at the time. What else am I missing? Oh right. There is a huge conspiracy against subways in Toronto. The mayor who finally came up with a plan that got funded, and is pushing for the DRL canceled the Sheppard subway. How can I forget? Since it's a "glorified streetcar", no one will ride it."
Please. Stop focusing on speed, and thinking only subways can deliver. This sort of thinking is exactly why Toronto transit development pretty much stalled over the last few decades. Well, that and ICTS.
scarberiankhatru
Senior Member
Perhaps Justin10000 is one of the 20 bitter people who live at Shaughnessy & Sheppard and didn't get their own personal subway station.
Neither do you. They want faster travel times.
We can't afford Transit City...that's why the original $6B pricetag now covers only 2 of the 7 lines. It's a plan dependent on unlimited funding.
Ridership will not increase along Sheppard with the LRT, except that driven by simple population growth in some places (and the population is actually falling in other places like Malvern). If the 190 continues to operate, the LRT won't even acquire the entire existing ridership base of the corridor. Buses will still need to run to Rouge Hill, and the 24A, 224, 167, and 169 will probably still need to run on Sheppard.
Neither do you. They want faster travel times.
We can't afford Transit City...that's why the original $6B pricetag now covers only 2 of the 7 lines. It's a plan dependent on unlimited funding.
Ridership will not increase along Sheppard with the LRT, except that driven by simple population growth in some places (and the population is actually falling in other places like Malvern). If the 190 continues to operate, the LRT won't even acquire the entire existing ridership base of the corridor. Buses will still need to run to Rouge Hill, and the 24A, 224, 167, and 169 will probably still need to run on Sheppard.