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Transit City Plan

Which transit plan do you prefer?

  • Transit City

    Votes: 95 79.2%

  • Ford City

    Votes: 25 20.8%
  • Total voters
    120
BMO said:
There's no basis for extending a subway based solely on ridership either. You must look at the connectivity, potential for development, and in this case the regional benefit of the line. Bloor didn't have sufficient ridership levels to justify a subway, yet thankfully because of that bold decision, we have a legitimate subway line that can transport citizens from East to West.
Click to expand...

The Bloor streetcar had twice the peak hour ridership of the current Sheppard subway peak.
 
nfitz said:
Wow, a small lost of riders due to termination at McCowan? Looks like about 50% to me. Given that these must be riders not currently using the SRT, and many of the riders gained on Eglinton are lost from B-D, it would be interesting to add the BD ridership to the bar graph for both scenarios.

Is this presentation on-line somewhere?
Click to expand...


here you go. http://www.metrolinx.com/en/docs/pdf/presentations/EglintonCrosstownSlidesCombinedPresentationFINAL.pdf

I think you're confusing that the light blue means ppl who will *only use the SRT, which in this sceneraio, could mean ppl who *only use the SRT and then transfer to BD line. So essentially when you see the large decrease in size of the light blue in the second bar, it is a mixture of loss riders and diverted riders from the B-D line.
 
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BMO said:
Based on what I've read on these forums and by articles from various transit observers, yes, i'm telling you that ridership forecasts, however many years into the future did not match a subway's ridership. If you do have proof, i'm more than willing to conceit I was wrong, like I did in an earlier post about Eglinton's updated ridership.
Click to expand...
So your pulling completely absurd and highly doubtful statements out of your head and you expect us to run up to the Ontario Archives to prove that the sky is blue?

I've certainly heard comments that the day 1 ridership was lower than it is now ... I've never heard anyone say that the original future ridership forecasts were that low.

If you want to have a sensible discussion, fine. If you want to make up absurd facts ... well let's try this one. We can't put the Eglinton line underground at Warden, because everyone knows that the portal into the hell dimensions is down there, and that would create more trouble than it's worth.
 
BMO said:
here you go. http://www.metrolinx.com/en/docs/pdf/presentations/EglintonCrosstownSlidesCombinedPresentationFINAL.pdf

I think you're confusing that the light blue means ppl who will *only use the SRT, which in this sceneraio, could mean ppl who *only use the SRT and then transfer to BD line. So essentially when you see the large decrease in size of the light blue in the second bar, it is a mixture of loss riders and diverted riders from the B-D line.
Click to expand...
Thanks - ah yes, you are correct. Still would be interesting to see BD on the top as well.
 
nfitz said:
So your pulling completely absurd and highly doubtful statements out of your head and you expect us to run up to the Ontario Archives to prove that the sky is blue?

I've certainly heard comments that the day 1 ridership was lower than it is now ... I've never heard anyone say that the original future ridership forecasts were that low.

If you want to have a sensible discussion, fine. If you want to make up absurd facts ... well let's try this one. We can't put the Eglinton line underground at Warden, because everyone knows that the portal into the hell dimensions is down there, and that would create more trouble than it's worth.
Click to expand...

Cool, maybe next time instead of making a scene you can just leave the reply box blank, if you're not gonna move the discussion forward. I might have responded with incorrect information but at least I admit it, and don't yell at you whenever you need me to find proof for you.

Thanks,
 
Interesting line from this article:

http://www.thestar.com/news/article/1127526--ignore-council-transit-vote-and-just-start-digging-toronto-councillor-norm-kelly-says?bn=1

Stintz also said her motion will be omnibus, including confirmation of the 2009 memorandum of agreement for three light rail lines, plus a request for the province to consider councillors’ other suggestions for future consideration.

They include extending the Bloor-Danforth line to Scarborough Town Centre so the Scarborough RT can stay in operation while the extension is being built.
Click to expand...

As much as I dislike the SELRT, it might be worth considering if we can finally get BD to STC. This idea is so plainly logical I don't know why it wasn't pursued before.
 
Coruscanti Cognoscente said:
Interesting line from this article:

http://www.thestar.com/news/article/1127526--ignore-council-transit-vote-and-just-start-digging-toronto-councillor-norm-kelly-says?bn=1



As much as I dislike the SELRT, it might be worth considering if we can finally get BD to STC. This idea is so plainly logical I don't know why it wasn't pursued before.
Click to expand...

A BD extension is very logical. Do we have any reports about if there is enough density along the SRT to justify a subway?
 
BMO said:
It's really not that difficult. When I purchase a computer. I purchase one that will last me a bit longer. I spend a bit more on it, and it lasts me substantially longer, and saves me money, rather than buying a newer computer that is somewhat better than what i currently have and is cheaper. I pay $1300 for 5 or 6 yrs, instead of $700 two or three times over the same period of time.
Click to expand...
People are fed up with the wait, so they'll want to build as many km of rails as possible with the funding, grade-seperated or not. I think everyone can understand that. They have their points, and so does the "subway" camp. Neither is right or wrong, it only depends on what vision each has on the city's future transit plan.
If they've given up on any future extension of the "subway" network, then yes, build as many LRT lines as they can.
Otherwise, better spend the funding on one big project that'd give the biggest/longest benefit (i.e DRL). But since the EA's not done/started for DRL, spend it on Eglinton (next priority). Then work on the EA for DRL while Eglinton's being built.
 
Rob Ford is getting desperate. He just sent a letter out begging for support of his transit vision. Looks like even Mr.Ford doesn't think he will be victorious tomorrow.
 
TheTigerMaster said:
Looks like even Mr.Ford doesn't think he will be victorious tomorrow.
Click to expand...
While I don't think much of Ford's intellect, I'd presume that he can add.

My guess is that even if he loses the vote, he will still refuse to sign off on the TC plan, and thus cause Metrolinx to say there isn't consensus on moving forward.
 
Tulse said:
While I don't think much of Ford's intellect, I'd presume that he can add.

My guess is that even if he loses the vote, he will still refuse to sign off on the TC plan, and thus cause Metrolinx to say there isn't consensus on moving forward.
Click to expand...

The Province already said that they will build whatever council tells them to. At the end of the day its City Council that runs the city. So when TC wins tomorrow it will be built regardless of what Ford thinks.
 
Coruscanti Cognoscente said:
As much as I dislike the SELRT, it might be worth considering if we can finally get BD to STC. This idea is so plainly logical I don't know why it wasn't pursued before.
Click to expand...
It's a reasonable suggestion, if there is no other plans to go to Scarborough Centre. But it makes less sense to continue the subway to Malvern. And it's hard to imagine there would be enough demand for both to be built. It's a very expensive solution to solve a temporary problem.

Switching back to the Transit City plan should at least shorten the time required for temporary busing. I'd think that critical path for the Ford plan, would be the construction of the new LRT carhouse at McCowan, which would first require demolishing the existing SRT carhouse. Presumably the carhouse would now revert to the (suspended but never cancelled) Sheppard East carhouse at Conlins Road that was already being bid. With some careful planning, and doing some of the construction while the SRT continues to operate, this should allow for a shorter shut-down period.
 
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