Toronto Ontario Line 3 | ?m | ?s

innsertnamehere said:
I wonder how much this line will change now with the Ontario Line planned to end at Exhibition.
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If it's really to end at Exhibition station - which is what some diagrams do show, rather than serve Ontario Place, then one thing that will change, is that there'd be no concern left about going under (or over) Fort York - which is south of the tracks.
 
steveintoronto said:
How ironic for "Mr Subways" to have discovered elevated track. Just like the SRT.

Hypocrisy knows no bounds...
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I actually think this shows how Ford support transit that is out of the way of cars - with the side benefit of cars being out of the way of transit. Going back to the Scarborough-Eglinton Crosstown, it reinforces that Ford would have had no trouble elevating the line through Golden Mile - it was likely Metrolinx or the Liberal who didn't want it.
 
Steve X said:
I did draw up an alternative aliment a couple month ago. It would be less disrupted to build the alignment further away from Overlea Blvd and closer to the residence of the area but it might be noisier. If a rubber tire technology is chosen, noise will be less of an issue.
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I'd say elevated is less disruptive than building closer to the residences, where I assume you proposed underground. Let the locals decide, Cut-and-cover or elevated.
 
AlvinofDiaspar said:
Wait till you see whether they will do that for Scarborough...but you can't call it subways if it is elevated, of course.

AoD
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The problem with the legacy trains used on extensions is that they are really heavy.. Hopefully the train type selected for the Ontario Line is a little lighter that allows for less overbearing elevated structures.
dowlingm said:
Elevating only through priority neighbourhoods is a pretty savage look - so very on brand for Doug.
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I imagine the line would continue to be elevated in any northern extension to Sheppard.. Right through Don Mills, a very wealthy neighbourhood.

Similarly, it is tunneled along Pape, which is a very low income neighbourhood (especially around Cosburn).

It's tunnelled where the built form requires it to be, not where the "poors" live.
 
innsertnamehere said:
The problem with the legacy trains used on extensions is that they are really heavy.. Hopefully the train type selected for the Ontario Line is a little lighter that allows for less overbearing elevated structures.

I imagine the line would continue to be elevated in any northern extension to Sheppard.. Right through Don Mills, a very wealthy neighbourhood.

Similarly, it is tunneled along Pape, which is a very low income neighbourhood (especially around Cosburn).

It's tunnelled where the built form requires it to be, not where the "poors" live.
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Are you saying that it will likely be an elevated to underground transfer at Science Centre? What happened to Phil Verster’s enthusiasm with same platform (grade) transfers ?
 
steveintoronto said:
It's just bizarre, viewed from any and all angles. And somehow the napkin boys demand to be taken seriously.

Btw: I tried watching the YouTube vid of that announcement. I could take only the first five minutes....Yurek is a Pharmacist? Really? And he demands a vile without explaining what it's for. He's more like a drug addict.

Post Script: Just attempted to watch it again. I'm overwhelmed by how much this reminds me of Second City back in their heyday, Johnny La Rue never looked so good, but at least the shtick was funny back then, hilarious in fact.
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Love to go back a couple of years in this forum and see the comments on HSR to London. I wonder how many people defended the then gov't for using a ruler when drawing the line from KW to London.

The feds are complaining that they don't know which train technology is used? They know that a full commercial RFP will include the option for the winning bidder to pick the supplier of the train.

Both sides are playing politics and for those who think its only one side there needs to be a reality check here. This board should not be an echo chamber!
 
The Fed response was silly.

They should have just been "We gave ~$5B to Ontario and you've not yet spent 80% of it. Focus on getting federally funded projects to the construction stage and we'll provide additional funding.".

SSE being the most obvious project feds contributed to, money Ford asked for as Councillor, which is still far from starting construction.
 
Unless the Ontario Line is the first stage of what would in essence be a BART system for the GTA, I think it risks becoming another SRT-like orphan technology. For it to be truly successful, Metrolinx needs to commit to building Ontario Line-compatible tracks within existing rail corridors. Without that commitment, all you're doing is building another subway line that's incompatible with the existing subway, and creating a NYC-style IRT/BRT situation.

The corridors that are the prime candidates for this treatment are the Milton, Richmond Hill, and Midtown lines. None of those lines are included in the RER program, and they all would require some flexibility within the corridor in order to shoehorn them in. The advantage of the lighter rolling stock is that it would allow the corridor to go above, below, and around the existing rail lines, fitting in wherever there's space.

If this is the beginning of the GTA's version of BART then I'm sold. If it isn't, then I seriously question the need to introduce a new technology into the mix.
 
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innsertnamehere said:
The problem with the legacy trains used on extensions is that they are really heavy.. Hopefully the train type selected for the Ontario Line is a little lighter that allows for less overbearing elevated structures.

I imagine the line would continue to be elevated in any northern extension to Sheppard.. Right through Don Mills, a very wealthy neighbourhood.

Similarly, it is tunneled along Pape, which is a very low income neighbourhood (especially around Cosburn).

It's tunnelled where the built form requires it to be, not where the "poors" live.
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The problem is that the Fords entire transit strategy has revolved around the idea that subways are for the rich and privileged 'downtown elites', while 'working folk' in the suburbs have to suffer with the indignity of RTs and streetcars.
 
Ontario’s Transit Plans: Details Emerge in City Report
by Steve

I'll have quotes to discuss later.
innsertnamehere said:
For it to be truly successful, Metrolinx needs to commit to building Ontario Line-compatible tracks within existing rail corridors.
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Absolutely. Standard gauge, and using the same overhead line electrification *physically* as GO. Electrically it can differ, as modern switching techniques are easy to do and readily available (usually a 1500VDC/25kVAC hybrid)
innsertnamehere said:
The problem with the legacy trains used on extensions is that they are really heavy.. Hopefully the train type selected for the Ontario Line is a little lighter that allows for less overbearing elevated structures.
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Doesn't have to be. Many EU, Asian and Australasian nations use mainline on very graceful structures. Think Pearson and the elevated spur.
gweed123 said:
If this is the beginning of the GTA's version of BART then I'm sold.
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You do realize that BART is a gargantuan rail gauge? Their later extensions though are standard.
[...]The original BART design called for standard 4’ 8.5” gauge. There is not one sound technical reason for using nonstandard gauge. In fact, there are many technical reasons to use standard gauge, in addition to the obvious cost savings. Any good MBA knows that non-standard gauge was chosen to create a monopoly. [...]
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(The story of the TTC gauge writ large...)
Why does BART use 5′ 6″ rail gauge when the standard gauge is 4 ...
 
steveintoronto said:
You do realize that BART is a gargantuan rail gauge? Their later extensions though are standard.
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My comparison to BART was more in terms of a regional rail-style system that runs in a tunnel through downtown and isn't compatible with mainline rail. It's distinct from CalTrain, even though it serves much of the same purpose.
 
I vaguely recall brief discussion of this on this thread a while back, so apologies if it's regurgitation, but the Staff report did nothing to allay my concern about the feasibility of the routing of the Ontario Line coming over west of the Don from East Harbour. If, as various provincial officials have seemed to intimate, the plan is to bridge over the Don at that point (rather than tunnel under it), and to leverage the existing rail corridor in some way, it seems there are (at least!) two key questions:

1) Where in that general area west of the Don and adjacent-ish to the rail corridor is there room for the tunnel port to get the OL tracks under ground in time for the Sumach stop; and

2) Depending on that answer, is a Sumach stop even feasible anymore given how tight the turn would have to be?

I ask those two questions both out of general curiosity and, more importantly, because I am worried that the Province may propose a tunnel port that would infringe upon (or necessitate the partial tearing up of) Corktown Common, which should be a total nonstarter.
 
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