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Toronto Crosstown LRT | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx | Arcadis

11th said:
Rapid transit expansions took too long from planning to opening that by the time they opened, the travel pattern and demographics of the areas they are to serve had changed drastically. Remember Network 2011? Idea came during the mid-80s and it took nearly two decades to just finished a stub of a line.
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Yup, and many plans have fallen victim to lobbying and politics. Travel patterns have changed in some ways, but I'd argue that rapid transit expansion hasn't followed demand at all. The demand has always been greatest downtown even as lines got extended farther and farther away. I'm all for the Crosstown of course, I'm just pointing out that transit expansion outside the old city is nothing new.
 
Those complaining that the "downtown elites" keep getting the "good stuff" is plain wrong. Most of the "improvements" have been in the "suburbs". Time for the "downtown elites" to get their turn with the Crosstown LRT and the Relief Line. And as shown, the old "suburbs" (IE. town of North Toronto) are now "downtown".
 
^To add to that point, there are people from Oakville, Burlington, and Hamilton who think they're not in Toronto until they are around the Exhibition area. Other people dont even know that Toronto has a midtown, and think that the entire spine of Yonge Street is "Downtown". Generally speaking, these people have a poor concept of how cities are made up.
 
Many of the old towns and villages of Toronto had their "downtowns" along or next to Yonge Street. Yorkville and North Toronto would have had their "downtowns" at Yonge Street. Today, Richmond Hill has its "downtown" along Yonge Street.
 
Amare said:
^To add to that point, there are people from Oakville, Burlington, and Hamilton who think they're not in Toronto until they are around the Exhibition area. Other people dont even know that Toronto has a midtown, and think that the entire spine of Yonge Street is "Downtown". Generally speaking, these people have a poor concept of how cities are made up.
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Since the concepts of "downtown", "midtown" and "uptown" vary depending on the city being discussed, maybe "these people" as you call them just have different definitions than some of the elitist snobs in the city who go out of their way to make people who happen to live outside the core sound like country yokels.
 
W. K. Lis said:
Those complaining that the "downtown elites" keep getting the "good stuff" is plain wrong. Most of the "improvements" have been in the "suburbs". Time for the "downtown elites" to get their turn with the Crosstown LRT and the Relief Line. And as shown, the old "suburbs" (IE. town of North Toronto) are now "downtown".
Click to expand...


Weird....Yonge-Eglinton was considered a suburb when the subway was first built. Maybe we would all be better off if the subway only went from Union to Dundas or Bloor. I can't believe that transit was able to promote higher density housing along it. We certainly don't want that to occur in car-oriented areas like the suburbs. That would ruin the city.
 
BMO said:
Weird....Yonge-Eglinton was considered a suburb when the subway was first built. Maybe we would all be better off if the subway only went from Union to Dundas or Bloor. I can't believe that transit was able to promote higher density housing along it. We certainly don't want that to occur in car-oriented areas like the suburbs. That would ruin the city.
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He isn't wrong - the subway system as it is currently structured is not all that useful for intra-downtown trips; also the track record of subways leading to intensification is bit mixed. Note - keyword is transit, not mode per se.

AoD
 
AlvinofDiaspar said:
He isn't wrong - the subway system as it is currently structured is not all that useful for intra-downtown trips; also the track record of subways leading to intensification is bit mixed. Note - keyword is transit, not mode per se.

AoD
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My comment was tongue-in-cheek. The reality is that whether you have transit or not people would still be travelling downtown. If you didn't have these extensions you'd have more cars clogging up the roadways downtown affecting streetcar surface routes. To act like a suburban transit expansion is only for the benefit of the suburbs is wrong. and to claim that transit expansion has only been focused in the suburbs is also wrong when you consider Union Station expansion, Queens Quay W ROW, UP Express (Transit directly from downtown to the airport), and King Street Pilot are all based in Downtown, not to mention the expanded GO Train service that gives the greatest Regional access to and from Downtown. There's nowhere else in the region where you have access to so many modes of transportation. This whole act about downtown being ignored is getting tiring...the DRL is currently planned to commence the EA process in 2018...you can't fund something unless you know what to fund. It has already been pushed up in the Big Move Update.
 
BMO said:
My comment was tongue-in-cheek. The reality is that whether you have transit or not people would still be travelling downtown. If you didn't have these extensions you'd have more cars clogging up the roadways downtown affecting streetcar surface routes. To act like a suburban transit expansion is only for the benefit of the suburbs is wrong. and to claim that transit expansion has only been focused in the suburbs is also wrong when you consider Union Station expansion, Queens Quay W ROW, UP Express (Transit directly from downtown to the airport), and King Street Pilot are all based in Downtown, not to mention the expanded GO Train service that gives the greatest Regional access to and from Downtown. There's nowhere else in the region where you have access to so many modes of transportation. This whole act about downtown being ignored is getting tiring...the DRL is currently planned to commence the EA process in 2018...you can't fund something unless you know what to fund. It has already been pushed up in the Big Move Update.
Click to expand...

Of course it isn't solely for the benefit of the suburbs, but let's look at the examples you have cited - Union Station expansion isn't about providing service to downtown residents - it's a commuter hub for the 905 above all else; Queen's Quay W ROW has been in place since what, the late 80s; UP Express is a low frequency service that is not really designed for downtown resident usage either (beyond the business crowd); King Street Pilot (costing what, a few M at best) for a streetcar line have more users than most suburban transit extensions? Even DRL is required not because it is intended to service downtown users per se - but to relief Yonge (and in doing so, allow the latter to extend further out). Take that relief aspect out, and will anyone be even batting an eye for a strictly downtown subway line? You tell me.

AoD
 
While it might be true that downtown does have it best (by far) for getting the f.o. of the place by mass transport (1 airport, 1 train to next airport, Union Station), it most certainly has not had anything much added to improve intra-downtown transit. The DRL does almost nothing to address this. That being said, I'm young enough and active enough to be willing and able to walk which is my preferred method of intra-downtown hussle, so my heart's not in it.
Just don't take away our airports/trains, thanks. The only thing I love almost as much as Toronto is getting the hell out of this mad house at regular intervals.
 
Statement

Statement from the Minister of Transportation on a New Agreement for Eglinton Crosstown Vehicles
December 21, 2017

Steven Del Duca, Minister of Transportation, released the following statement on a new agreement with Bombardier for light rail vehicles for the Eglinton Crosstown:

"Our government is committed to delivering the transit that the people of Ontario and the Greater Toronto and Hamilton Area (GTHA) deserve. A critically important part of that commitment is making sure that all of our suppliers are fulfilling their contractual obligations.

In May, our government announced that we were taking strong and decisive action to ensure that quality light rail vehicles for the Eglinton Crosstown and other LRT projects would be provided on time. This included signing a new agreement with Alstom Canada to provide vehicles that would be used on Toronto-area transit projects.

As a result of the steps that our government took at that time, along with the leadership of Metrolinx CEO Phil Verster, Bombardier has now accepted a new agreement to provide the number of vehicles required for the Eglinton Crosstown. The new agreement includes more prescriptive performance deadlines and a new late delivery penalty that provides us with the confidence that they will deliver on time for the opening of this critical transit project. The new agreement also requires that Bombardier provide Metrolinx with the opportunity to adequately assess delivery progress on an ongoing and regular basis, along with additional penalties.

We will continue to be vigilant with respect to Bombardier's performance. Simply put, they are expected to deliver as per our new agreement or face significant consequences.

This new agreement does not affect the contract previously signed with Alstom, as the Alstom vehicles ordered will be used on other LRT projects.

As Minister of Transportation, my responsibility is to deliver a seamless and integrated transit network that the people of the GTHA. Working together, we will ensure that the Eglinton Crosstown and all of our other priority transit projects open on time."
 
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