Sheppard Line 4 Subway Extension (Proposed)

[nfitz]

This goes back to the fare integration situation. Combined with increased service, ridership of those GO lines will jump if the last leg of a trip doesn't cost another $3.20.

I doubt it to be honest. Also, there was partial fare integration in place during 2019, when this ridership is from.

The bottom line is that GO ridership is just too small to have a significant impact on any TTC station - with the exception of Union. A bus or streetcar route terminating at a station provides much more ridership.

The TTC /Province are looking at extending the length of Sheppard trains to six cars. Shorter rolling stock than existing is not under consideration.

At this point at least. But look how quick the last order for six 4-car trainsets materialized (by amending an existing contract for four 6-car trainsets).

They could whip together another 2 or 3 4-car trains in a few days, simply by removing a couple of cars from some TR sets - which they have done before.

 

[CapitalSeven]

The decision whether to save money by going elevated (or even changing technology) or spend the maximum on deep bored tunnels depends on the current take on electoral politics, and little else.

 

[steviej1]

I'm about to retire soon. I really hope that I'll get to see a Sheppard East extension in my life time.

 

[SashaLemon]

The decision whether to save money by going elevated (or even changing technology) or spend the maximum on deep bored tunnels depends on the current take on electoral politics, and little else.

If the extension is tunneled it will be absolutely criminal, Sheppard Ave is so wide and ugly, an elevated guideway could even IMPROVE the look of the street like they had planned on the REM de l'Est.

 

[T3G]

I sooner expect the area underneath the bridge would turn into an inhuman wasteland, much like the Gardiner.

 

[Cobra]

If the extension is tunneled it will be absolutely criminal, Sheppard Ave is so wide and ugly, an elevated guideway could even IMPROVE the look of the street like they had planned on the REM de l'Est.

City and TTC are dead set against elevated unless it's in the middle of nowhere.

What would be criminal is not doing "cut & cover" the entire way except under the 404.

 

[APTA-2048]

What would be criminal is not doing "cut & cover" the entire way except under the 404.

TYSSE and SSE show us we will choose the most expensive deep boring option.

 

[Rainforest]

I sooner expect the area underneath the bridge would turn into an inhuman wasteland, much like the Gardiner.

If the Gardiner is our primary source of inspiration, then for sure.

On the other hand, if we look at Paris Line 6 or Line 2 - they are not bad at all.

 

[JasonParis]

And we've truly made a large portion of "under the Gardiner' quite respectable in recent years.

 

[T3G]

If the Gardiner is our primary source of inspiration, then for sure.

On the other hand, if we look at Paris Line 6 or Line 2 - they are not bad at all.

In order for this to be a 1:1 comparison, there has to be something of note in the area underneath the guideway in the first place. A historical European city seems like a sufficient example (and let's face it, Scarborough is no Paris). LemonCondo notes that "Sheppard Ave is so wide and ugly" (I don't disagree), but if we just build a bridge over it, how will that help the problem? If you want the area underneath an elevated Sheppard Subway to be hospitable, you need to have a streetscape of merit there to begin with. And once we're at that level of urban renewal, the suggestion of elevating the line because the street is ugly has lost its reason for being and we can bury the subway.

 

[SashaLemon]

In order for this to be a 1:1 comparison, there has to be something of note in the area underneath the guideway in the first place. A historical European city seems like a sufficient example (and let's face it, Scarborough is no Paris). LemonCondo notes that "Sheppard Ave is so wide and ugly" (I don't disagree), but if we just build a bridge over it, how will that help the problem? If you want the area underneath an elevated Sheppard Subway to be hospitable, you need to have a streetscape of merit there to begin with. And once we're at that level of urban renewal, the suggestion of elevating the line because the street is ugly has lost its reason for being and we can bury the subway.

Well the line would spur development, which would improve the streetscape on both sides of the Ave.

 

[afransen]

In order for this to be a 1:1 comparison, there has to be something of note in the area underneath the guideway in the first place. A historical European city seems like a sufficient example (and let's face it, Scarborough is no Paris). LemonCondo notes that "Sheppard Ave is so wide and ugly" (I don't disagree), but if we just build a bridge over it, how will that help the problem? If you want the area underneath an elevated Sheppard Subway to be hospitable, you need to have a streetscape of merit there to begin with. And once we're at that level of urban renewal, the suggestion of elevating the line because the street is ugly has lost its reason for being and we can bury the subway.

Vancouver has shown that elevated guideways can be compatible with decent urban streetscapes, especially in the context of North America suburban built form.

 

[jcam]

If the extension is tunneled it will be absolutely criminal, Sheppard Ave is so wide and ugly, an elevated guideway could even IMPROVE the look of the street like they had planned on the REM de l'Est.

If I'm not mistaken, REM de l'est in on pause because of the backlash against the proposed raised segment through the city.

 

[Rainforest]

In order for this to be a 1:1 comparison, there has to be something of note in the area underneath the guideway in the first place. A historical European city seems like a sufficient example (and let's face it, Scarborough is no Paris). LemonCondo notes that "Sheppard Ave is so wide and ugly" (I don't disagree), but if we just build a bridge over it, how will that help the problem? If you want the area underneath an elevated Sheppard Subway to be hospitable, you need to have a streetscape of merit there to begin with. And once we're at that level of urban renewal, the suggestion of elevating the line because the street is ugly has lost its reason for being and we can bury the subway.

I think the guideway design is the key here. Instead of an ugly grey concrete slab (= the Gardiner), should find a more impressive form. White stone finish, or a metal structure, with sleek curves etc.

It would help if more agile trains are used on the Sheppard line, then the guideway will have a smaller footprint. But even for the wide TTC trains, something decent can be designed.

Scarborough won't become Paris, but a pleasant enough environment can co-exist with the guideway on Sheppard. We shouldn't think of the Gardiner as a golden standard for elevated structure.

 

[officedweller]

Vancouver has shown that elevated guideways can be compatible with decent urban streetscapes, especially in the context of North America suburban built form.

Yup - it all depends on how much the municipality is willing to spend to beautify and maintain the area under the guideway
- whether in the median or the side of the road.