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Rob Ford's Transit plan

ssiguy2 said:
The problem is that they do, like the citizens themselves, understand the plan and know that no system that stops at all the light, has stops every 2 to 3 blocks, and is an endless series of transfers is not rapid transit. It is the TTC that continually insists that TC is rapid transit............just go to their website.
If Torontonians want subways then they should get them, end of story. The taxpayers are the one's who are footing the bill whether provincially or municiple so they are the ones who should make the decision.
In BC the province wanted the new Evergreen Line to be LRT { real LRT like CTrain not a bunch of streetcars like TC} but they took 3 different polls and were shown that a SkyTrain route would be 30% more expensive but the people of Coquitlam resoundingly prefered SkyTrain so that is what is being built. You build systems that people want not City Hall.
I also find the comparison with Smitherman's plan disingenous as Ford's plan is 5 years not 10.
I find it laughable that good old Steve Munroe is making fun of the financing of the project sseing he is a TC backer but it's price managed to soar 50% in 18 short months years before even one shovel was in the ground.
As for this notion that laws have rules about working more than 44 hours well newsflash, I know that. This is why you employ several different tenders to different companies at once. That would not be possible under a union contract.
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You write like you're on heavy psychiatric medication.
 
W. K. Lis said:
He wants to replace the streetcars with buses? We have 248 streetcars, but will need 496 buses to replace them, which we don't have (if not more). Congestion will be worse. And instead of replacing every 30 years, the buses have to be replaced every 10 years, maybe 12, 15 if very lucky..
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What would be the labour costs of running and maintaining those 496 buses? Scrapping the streetcars and replacing them with buses would be a gift to the unions by significantly increasing their membership.

Rob Ford is a unionist, or a really bad businessman who can't calculate costs.
 
GenerationW said:
There would be a trade-off. He would get his subway plan to replace Transit City in exchange for dropping his "war on streetcars".

Streetcars aren't going anywhere.
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This is what I'm thinking too. I'm thinking if he does get elected he'll play one off against the other. He can threaten to make life hell for downtowners if the province doesn't play ball on his subway plans. Plus, once faced with a cost analysis on why streetcars are cheapers, he'll be able to graciously back out of this commitment citing cost issues.
 
Swarley said:
Yeah, having several different companies working on the same project, with different supervising engineers, project managers, etc is a great way to create efficiency and save money. You and Ford have it all figured out...
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Not that I'm saying ssiguy2 or Rob Ford is correct, but this does happen in industry from time to time. Good managers can integrate work from several contractors.
 
kEiThZ said:
This is what I'm thinking too. I'm thinking if he does get elected he'll play one off against the other. He can threaten to make life hell for downtowners if the province doesn't play ball on his subway plans. Plus, once faced with a cost analysis on why streetcars are cheapers, he'll be able to graciously back out of this commitment citing cost issues.
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So you want to count on him being brilliantly sneaky rather than a idiot?
 
He can threaten to make life hell for downtowners if the province doesn't play ball on his subway plans. Plus, once faced with a cost analysis on why streetcars are cheapers, he'll be able to graciously back out of this commitment citing cost issues.
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Actually I highly doubt it - the contract for the new LRVs has been signed, if the TTC under RF backs out of it now, expect legal fallout with heavy penalities. Ditto contracts for the existing Sheppard LRT. And yes, if he threaten to make life hell for downtowners, I am sure things won't be that pleasant for those who work but doesn't necessarily live there either; and that's on top of the fact that the provinical government has a vested interest on making sure shovels are in the ground on time - I wouldn't be surprised if the province will make a move against the city should RF goes beyond the rhetoric if he gets elected. They, not RF, are the ones who can threaten and back it up with something other than hot air.

You know what, the evil side of me actually want to see RF take the streetcars off and replace them with buses - and see how much riders and motorists would love that change. Nothing like reality to put an end to verbal nonsense.

AoD
 
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hopefully this man doesn't get elected mayor... his plan is short sighted and doesn't make sense.
2 steps forward 20 steps back.
 
I read Rob's transportation PDF, and one thing which caught my attention is coordinating express and collector bus routes, which is something far overdue for a city like Toronto. Even if not a single railway or busway is built (seems like a safe bet), such a system would make long distance commutes by transit far more appealing, or at least tolerable. Let's take it a step further: imagine frequent express buses using our highway network. We could have express buses from Fairview Mall/Don Mills station to Scarborough Town Center and downtown. We could have a crosstown route going from the airport to Yorkdale to Fairview to Scarborough. A direct express bus from Sherway straight to downtown, etc. Obviously a real rapid transit network would be better for the most part, but there is no denying how quickly and affordable getting such bus services started is.

All that said, it will be interesting to see how Ford's poll ratings will do in the aftermath of this plan. Don't forget, Smitherman's numbers began to slide after releasing his transit strategy. Now that people can see what Ford is proposing, I could see people swing over to Smitherman since his plan is far more comprehensive and far better costed.
 
Electrify said:
All that said, it will be interesting to see how Ford's poll ratings will do in the aftermath of this plan. Don't forget, Smitherman's numbers began to slide after releasing his transit strategy. Now that people can see what Ford is proposing, I could see people swing over to Smitherman since his plan is far more comprehensive and far better costed.
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Lets hope so, because the thought of Ford as Mayor should be both embarrassing and frightening for citizens.
 
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Electrify:

I think you are assuming people vote on the basis of a rationale analysis of transit plans - which isn't likely the case.

AoD
 
AlvinofDiaspar said:
Electrify:

I think you are assuming people vote on the basis of a rationale analysis of transit plans - which isn't likely the case.

AoD
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My vote will be based largely by this... I use public transportation on a regular basis, I want to see progress. I don't believe Rob Ford has anything progressive in his plan.
 
AlvinofDiaspar said:
Electrify:

I think you are assuming people vote on the basis of a rationale analysis of transit plans - which isn't likely the case.

AoD
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I think people's votes with respect to transit are largely based on "what will it do to benefit me?". Fortunately for us, unless you live in Scarborough, the answer to this question when using Jabba the Ford's transit plan is "not a f***ing thing". This ultimately helps the transit advocates out, because even the average person will be able to see that this plan is nonsense.
 
kEiThZ said:
He can threaten to make life hell for downtowners if the province doesn't play ball on his subway plans.
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I'd think that if he pushes the province too much, they'll simply transfer the subways, or even the entire TTC to Metrolinx. And take the cost to run them out their transfer payments to the city. A Rob Ford city council might be exactly the opportunity Metrolinx is looking for.
 
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