sjc
Active Member
Not exactly a "Porter" item, but here is a neat video showing the assembly process for a Q400 distilled down into 4 minutes:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4T-nRRCpbqc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4T-nRRCpbqc
Toronto Billy Bishop Toronto City Airport | ?m | ?s | Ports Toronto | Arup
sjc
Active Member
I see that American Eagle is dropping its Boston-Toronto service in November. Continental is dropping its Newark-Tremblant service this winter.
While Air Canada still does the BOS-YYZ route, I think Porter can safely claim significant responsibility for both of these developments. From the Boston Globe:
Are these the first routes from which Porter has driven away competitors?
While Air Canada still does the BOS-YYZ route, I think Porter can safely claim significant responsibility for both of these developments. From the Boston Globe:
Are these the first routes from which Porter has driven away competitors?
Justin10000
Banned
I do not think Porter is driving away competition, more like American Eagle is simply too cheap to provide the service, and is blaming unions.
Either way, I think Porter is a good service, and anything to improve it's business is fine by me.
Either way, I think Porter is a good service, and anything to improve it's business is fine by me.
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kEiThZ
Superstar
That would be driving away the competition. Competing from YYZ is challenging. The aiport is further away, American Eagle has less comfortable aircraft, a less frequent schedule, and no lounge service on the ground. Whatever fare difference there is (and usually it's minimal) can't make up for all that.
Agreed!
sjc
Active Member
It was five years ago today that Porter started flying.
http://business.financialpost.com/2011/10/23/porter-airlines-edge/
http://business.financialpost.com/2011/10/23/porter-airlines-edge/
Automation Gallery
Superstar
Yeah, who would ever thought.
Porter Airlines is truly a success story.
From two aircraft and 10 daily return flights to Ottawa on Day One, Deluce’s airline now has 24 Q400 planes serving 18 destinations.
That includes Timmins to which service will commence on Jan. 16 and Burlington, Vt., which will ferry seasonal passengers, starting Dec. 15.
They are slated to take delivery of two more aircraft from Bombardier next month.
The airline now employs 1,300 staff compared to 200 on the first day of operations in 2006 — many of whom Deluce seems to know as he proudly takes me on a tour of the sleek new $50-million-plus terminal building.
He said they’re quickly outgrowing their domestic passenger lounge and are already starting to look at expansion.
Construction on a $50-million pedestrian tunnel to the airport (an underground version of Miller’s fixed link) — funded through a private-public partnership and approved by council earlier this year — is scheduled to begin in early 2012. The project is scheduled for completion by 2014
http://www.torontosun.com/2011/10/23/porter-has-taken-off-levy
erikyow
New Member
Actually, while I'm sure Porter hasn't helped the situation for the other airlines, the main reason that American Eagle dropped the Boston route has to do with the parent company,AMR (which also owns American Airlines), spinning-off Eagle as an independent company. A clause in the pilots' contract stipulates that only AMR-owned companies can operate between certain cities (all of their current or former hubs/focus cities; Boston, LaGuardia and Kennedy airports included). As JFK, LGA and YYZ were the last airports to have service on American Eagle from Boston, when AMR spun off American Eagle, they had to stop flying Boston-New York (LGA and JFK). It therefore made no sense to continue BOS-YYZ. From what I've heard, American had some pretty good corporate contracts on the route, which is why it stuck around when all other routes were cut over the years. However, with them cutting service to LGA and JFK, Boston would have been a completely cut-off outpost for Eagle and would have meant that they'd either need to do tricky aircraft scheduling so that planes would route through YYZ (i.e. fly BOS-YYZ-JFK or vice-versa), they'd need to maintain a maintenance base in Boston with a small, dedicated fleet for the one route, or they'd need to deadhead aircraft from Boston to a maintenance base for servicing. All of these would either be expensive or operationally problematic (i.e. a plane arriving late from Boston could have knock-on effects for passengers flying somewhere via New York).
So, no doubt that Porter have taken away passengers from Air Canada and American Eagle, and it's very likely that maybe they would have eventually driven Eagle off the route (American don't have much fight in them these days for Boston, as shown how they've recoiled in the face of a growing jetBlue in Boston, and may have just given up at some point). However, Eagle's departure from the route at this juncture was primarily due to Eagle dropping all flights out of Boston, leaving American Airlines to do all the flying out of that city.
Since then, Delta Connection has announced two daily flights and Air Canada has increased its offering to eight daily flights, in addition to Porter's six. So, the route lost three daily flights in the form of American Eagle, but has gained (based on the last time I looked at schedules, about 9 months ago) overall in terms of total capacity.
sjc
Active Member
When they launched five years ago, the announced intention was to fly to 17 destinations in Canada and the US. The addition of Vermont makes 17 places you can fly to from Toronto.
While I was expecting success, I didn't expect them to get to the full 17 destinations so quickly.
Expanded service to Sudbury
http://www.sootoday.com/content/news/full_story.asp?StoryNumber=54504
A fourth daily flight to Sudbury starting Jan 16 (although the additional Sunday flight won't start until April).
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kkgg7
Banned
Great. I'd love to see Porter expand more. But the island has very limited land, how much can it go further?
sjc
Active Member
I think they are looking to relocate the old historic terminal to somewhere offsite.
sjc
Active Member
So much for their being no more sales. Flights are currently 50% until November 4th and you can buy tickets for travel through March. If you have been holding off finalizing your Christmas travel, now could be the time.
kkgg7
Banned
sjc
Active Member
The Q400's maximum range is around 1500 miles but it requires 4600' of runway to take off fully loaded. The runway at the Island is only 4000' which limits them to around 500 miles. They do Halifax non-stop at Christmas (I guess because it is colder and you can take off with more weight when its cold).
They do Myrtle Beach now, which is about as far south as you are going to get.
Of course, they could do further if they stop on the way. Perhaps an extension of the Myrtle Beach flight to the Bahamas? Going that far might take a long time though.
I expect Bermuda would be doable from Halifax or Boston (and I am pretty sure they would be allowed to sell Boston-Bermuda tickets).
EDIT: would Bermuda require ETOPS?
They do Myrtle Beach now, which is about as far south as you are going to get.
Of course, they could do further if they stop on the way. Perhaps an extension of the Myrtle Beach flight to the Bahamas? Going that far might take a long time though.
I expect Bermuda would be doable from Halifax or Boston (and I am pretty sure they would be allowed to sell Boston-Bermuda tickets).
EDIT: would Bermuda require ETOPS?
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erikyow
New Member
The maximum range of the Q400 that Porter uses is quite capable of reaching most warm destinations in the US. However, the slower cruising speed of the Q400 means that any real cost and time advantages that Porter (and the passenger) gets operating the efficient aircraft from downtown over jets leaving from Pearson are lost. The main limiting factor of how far Porter can fly from YTZ, however, is the runway at the Island airport. It's for this reason that Porter has to usually make a stop in Ottawa in order to get to Halifax (which is well inside the typical range of the Q400).
I believe that Porter's initial business plan had them flying to destinations within 500 nm (925 km) of Toronto. Which, with the exception of the seasonal flights to Myrtle Beach and Halifax, they've pretty much done.
So, it's doubtful that Porter will expand to warm-weather destinations (at least with their present aircraft), much less from YTZ.
Don't they fly seasonally to Myrtle Beach? Not sure which season that is, but South Carolina, while not tropical, is certainly 'comfortable' in the winter.
I believe that Porter's initial business plan had them flying to destinations within 500 nm (925 km) of Toronto. Which, with the exception of the seasonal flights to Myrtle Beach and Halifax, they've pretty much done.
So, it's doubtful that Porter will expand to warm-weather destinations (at least with their present aircraft), much less from YTZ.
Don't they fly seasonally to Myrtle Beach? Not sure which season that is, but South Carolina, while not tropical, is certainly 'comfortable' in the winter.
sjc
Active Member
Myrtle Beach is just spring and fall. (I think until the end of November and then starting up again in February or March?).
There might also be an issue with airplanes to do southern flights at Christmas, as all available planes generally get put on shuttling people between Halifax and Toronto at that time.
EDIT: I could imagine access to southerly destinations becoming available through code-sharing within the next year or so....
There might also be an issue with airplanes to do southern flights at Christmas, as all available planes generally get put on shuttling people between Halifax and Toronto at that time.
EDIT: I could imagine access to southerly destinations becoming available through code-sharing within the next year or so....
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