Anonymous Anti-Scientology Protest: April 12th, 2008, 11 AM

[Prometheus The Supremo]

if scientologists are allowed to perform streetside psychological examinations without having any real qualifications to do so, does that mean i can perform streetside gynecological examinations without having any qualifications either?


"free sex tests" "just hold on to the P-meter with your pelvic muscles" "the P-meter seems to indicate that you are very tight" "we can help you with that"

 

[ganjavih]

I'm appalled by the number of educated people who follow any religion at all.

Why?

 

[Panzerfaust]

Why?

Because some people just have to be edgy atheists who are better than anyone who believes in a religion. You know, because anyone who believes in a higher power is stupid and ignorant of facts.

Christ, Anonymous tries to make a thread about a legit cause and a bunch of atheists troll it just because it involves religion on some level. This is coming from an atheist, so don't try and claim I'm defending my faith because I have none. I'm just trying to stop a derail of an otherwise very informative thread before it starts. We get it. You're better than everyone else because you take science over faith. Now shut up and live and let live.

 

[Prometheus The Supremo]

Because some people just have to be edgy atheists who are better than anyone who believes in a religion. You know, because anyone who believes in a higher power is stupid and ignorant of facts.

Christ, Anonymous tries to make a thread about a legit cause and a bunch of atheists troll it just because it involves religion on some level. This is coming from an atheist, so don't try and claim I'm defending my faith because I have none. I'm just trying to stop a derail of an otherwise very informative thread before it starts. We get it. You're better than everyone else because you take science over faith. Now shut up and live and let live.

actually belief in a higher power, supreme being, etc. is ignorance. i don't mean that in a pejorative way and i'll break it down for you. the biggest argument for the existence of a higher power is the "argument from ignorance" = "i can't prove god exists but you can't prove god doesn't exist". it is all a matter of faith and hoping it to be true.

as for the comment

I'm appalled by the number of educated people who follow any religion at all.

people have faith for many reasons. sometimes it's out of fear (people are too afraid to even question and analyze their beliefs for fear of earthly or eternal punishment). sometimes it's out of the lack of knowledge of facts and sometimes it's a matter of tradition and not needing to change because things are working fine the way they are. some people believe out of hope for betterment and fear of death.

these are some of the reasons why extremely smart and educated people have irrational beliefs. i wouldn't call newton an idiot for believing in god as much as i wouldn't call darwin an idiot for marrying his first cousin. both have nothing to do with their discoveries and the intelligence required for those discoveries. smart people can, do and believe irrational things, but it doesn't make those things any more valid and true.

 

[Panzerfaust]

All I'm saying is that anyone who says people who believe in god are stupid is just as bad as the Christian fundamentalist who says all atheists are stupid. I was trying to keep a derail from happening, but apparently I started one unintentionally.

I don't see how what I said is hypocritical at all. I think some of you need to learn what hypocrisy is. If I was going on about how God is the best thing ever, then told you to shut up, then I'd be a hypocrite.

To be honest, I think I'd take a fundamentalist Christian or Muslim over a militant atheist any day. At least the religious person has your best interests at heart, at least to them, in that they're saving you from some varying damnation. The only purpose a militant atheist has is to tell people they're stupid and ignorant. I'd like to see anyone try and defend that, because seriously, how can you tell someone that there is no god and that they have to give up their peaceful beliefs "for their own good"? Are they hurting themselves or anyone else by thinking there is some higher power? Before you say it, I'm not talking about the minority of religious people who discriminate based on religion. I'm talking about the vast majority who just want to believe what they believe and leave everyone else alone.

Once again, allow me to reiterate that I am an atheist, in case someone doesn't read my last post and jumps on me with claws bared.

 

[Prometheus The Supremo]

All I'm say

To be honest, I think I'd take a fundamentalist Christian or Muslim over a militant atheist any day. At least the religious person has your best interests at heart, at least to them, in that they're saving you from some varying damnation.

i'm sure before the planes crashed into the twin towers, all the victims we glad that the terrorists had their best interests in heart.

i'll take a snooty atheist over a witch burning christian or an islamic terrorist. not all religious people have your best interests at heart. some of them actually cut out your heart as a sacrifice to their god.

bullets hurt more than words. but that's just me. i have the "i'm rubber, you're glue, whatever you say bounces off of me and sticks back to you" view.

 

[Panzerfaust]

i'm sure before the planes crashed into the twin towers, all the victims we glad that the terrorists had their best interests in heart.

i'll take a snooty atheist over a witch burning christian or an islamic terrorist. not all religious people have your best interests at heart. some of them actually cut out your heart as a sacrifice to their god.

bullets hurt more than words. but that's just me. i have the "i'm rubber, you're glue, whatever you say bounces off of me and sticks back to you" view.

Because every single religious person is a terrorist and a witch hunter, right? Stop twisting my words to make me sound like an idiot, as I have no problem calling out people who do so. I said nothing even approaching "I would prefer a terrorist over a militant atheist". There's a big difference between terrorist and fundamentalist. One can be a fundamentalist without being a terrorist.

Please don't start throwing the whole "Well most religious people are evil" argument at me, because both of us know that's not true. The vast majority just want to live their lives in peace, and a very vocal minority twists that perception into "most religious people are insane, think Earth was created 6000 years ago, and want to fly planes into buildings". You aren't exactly helping that. Then again, I suppose I'm stupid to you for believing we should let people believe whatever they like as long as it doesn't hurt anyone, right?

 

[Prometheus The Supremo]

Because every single religious person is a terrorist and a witch hunter, right? Stop twisting my words to make me sound like an idiot, as I have no problem calling out people who do so. I said nothing even approaching "I would prefer a terrorist over a militant atheist". There's a big difference between terrorist and fundamentalist. One can be a fundamentalist without being a terrorist.

Please don't start throwing the whole "Well most religious people are evil" argument at me, because both of us know that's not true. The vast majority just want to live their lives in peace, and a very vocal minority twists that perception into "most religious people are insane, think Earth was created 6000 years ago, and want to fly planes into buildings". You aren't exactly helping that. Then again, I suppose I'm stupid to you for believing we should let people believe whatever they like as long as it doesn't hurt anyone, right?

you said:

To be honest, I think I'd take a fundamentalist Christian or Muslim over a militant atheist any day.

a fundamentalist Christian or Muslim can be a terrorist, so by your logic you would take them over some "militant atheist". you also say that fundamentalist religious people have your best interests at heart which is not true. not all fundamentalist religious people have your best interests at heart.
yes, one can be a fundamentalist without being a terrorist but not all fundamentalists non-terrorists. there are many fundamentalists who are terrorists. bin laden is a fundamentalist muslim. would you take him over arguing with a militant atheist? you may have meant that you'd take a fundamentalist religious person that doesn't engage in acts of violence over a militant atheist but that is not what you said. you left your argument open to include anyone that fits the fundamentalist religious criteria and that includes terrorists. i don't prefer people by their associations. i prefer people by individual basis.

i never said that "most religious people are evil" and i never "supposed" that you are stupid for "believing we should let people believe whatever they like as long as it doesn't hurt anyone."

 

[adma]

Judging from what's been built in the name of religion over centuries, militant atheists are utter philistines. Not a good place to be

 

[Prometheus The Supremo]

Panzerfaust, so you see it from another perspective...


i wouldn't take an atheist or agnostic person over a christian any day.

i'd take my christian mom over stalin anyday. but if anyone were to say that stalin's evils were fueled by atheism it's like saying hitler's evils were fueled by vegetarianism.

 

[Prometheus The Supremo]

BTW:


fun·da·men·tal·ism
Pronunciation:
\-tə-ˌli-zəm\
Function:
noun
Date:
1922

1 a movement in 20th century Protestantism emphasizing the literally interpreted Bible as fundamental to Christian life and teaching b: the beliefs of this movement c: adherence to such beliefs

2: a movement or attitude stressing strict and literal adherence to a set of basic principles


if you literally follow the teachings and instructions in the bible, you will end up in jail and be guilty of "a" or many criminal acts. if you try to follow all the teachings in the bible all at once, your brain just might explode.


"kill disobedient children but thou shall not kill" "it is a shame for a man to have long hair but jesus had long hair" hmmm, what to do? flip a coin?


most religious people don't follow or take every part of their dogma/doctrine literally, even if they do call themselves fundamentalists. thank god for that. amen brother

 

[BuildTO]

If you have to ask, it's unlikley you'd understand the answer.

It's more likely you misunderstand why he's asking the question.

For those of us who have been on the forum for years and know a lot of the long-time members, we can tell you ganjavih understands a lot than you ever will.

 

[Anonymous Anonymous]

Wow. I've been watching this thread from my regular account, and I've decided that I'm not even going to comment on the atheists vs. religious people debate that's going on. That's not why I'm here.

I came here to post a video made my another member of Anonymous. It's called "The Road to April 12th", and it does an amazing job of showing what we fight for. It also gives you an idea of the scale of these protests. This isn't a Toronto thing. It's not a Canada thing. It's a worldwide thing.

http://www.vimeo.com/951467

It's a bit long, at around 11 minutes, and I honestly don't know if anyone cares anymore. If you want to watch it and see how this is a lot more than a bunch of isolated people fighting against a weird religion, go ahead.

The next protest is on May 10th. It runs from 11 AM to 3 PM, same place as before. The corner of Yonge and Isabella, if you don't remember. If you want to join us, you're welcome to. If you want to keep considering us a bunch of bored kids with nothing better to do, so be it. Nothing I can say will convince you otherwise.

 

[JasonParis]

I say keep up the good fight!

 

[Urban Shocker]

For a week in 1970 my mother and I lived in a large guest house in East Grinstead, England that was also a Scientology house. My father had emigrated to Toronto, and we needed a place to stay before flying here to join him. When she booked us in there my mother had no idea that it was anything but an ordinary guest house. The Scientologists kept to themselves at breakfast, didn't seem very intelligent, didn't seem "all there", and didn't seem threatening either - just rather weird and brain dead. My mother had heard of Scientology, and knew that it was under investigation in some jurisdictions, so she checked with the local police station to see if it was advisable to move somewhere else. They didn't tell us to. A week later we were in Toronto.