2018 Provincial Election Transit Promises

[amnesiajune]

They’re tying to be all things to all people with that phrasing. If they were explicitly committing to RER, they would’ve said so. The phrasing is intentionally vague.

I don't see anything vague about it. He probably wants to make things clearer for people in the 905 ridings who might ask "what's in this transit plan for us?" Maybe he's going to back off of the electrified rail commitment, but two-way, all-day service is still a huge improvement.

 

[Adjei]

I heard Patrick Brown on CBC radio talking some crap about how if he is elected, he will make sure Scarborough is respected again. He even said it was it's own city. I just had to roll my eyes.

 

[Adjei]

They could outpromise. After all, we can now take the high speed train to Montreal courtesy of the Chretien Liberals and we can take a high speed train to Winsdor courtesy of Wynne. All that's left is high speed train to Winnipeg.

Liberals caused all the problems in the world.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

RER wasn't in his quite detailed platform. Neither was electrification. It would clearly be dead or very delayed.

Yes it was...
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"The existing commitments to two-way, all day GO train service" can only mean one thing.

They’re tying to be all things to all people with that phrasing. If they were explicitly committing to RER, they would’ve said so. The phrasing is intentionally vague.

I don't see anything vague about it. He probably wants to make things clearer for people in the 905 ridings who might ask "what's in this transit plan for us?" Maybe he's going to back off of the electrified rail commitment, but two-way, all-day service is still a huge improvement.

Well backing off of electrification makes whatever he’s proposing not RER.

 

[innsertnamehere]

RER wasn't in his quite detailed platform. Neither was electrification. It would clearly be dead or very delayed.

Which seems to reference the information back to the same platform that neither mentioned RER nor electrification.

It would appear that Mr. Spurr doesn't know the difference between all-way 2-day service (which has been running on Lakeshore since the 1960s) and RER.

Or perhaps he actually asked them instead of presuming? They literally say they will match existing commitments in terms of transit from the Liberals in the platform, then mention a few projects, including GO expansion. There isn't an extensive list of exact programs, because they are covered by the "We will honour existing commitments" clause. No idea why you think that since they say "All day GO" it means that RER is cut. There is no language to suggest that whatsoever. At best it is a vague guess, It is very, very far from "clear".

Mr. Spurr is very aware of RER. He attends every Metrolinx meeting, and writes about it regularly.

This board is reading this policy document from a transit planning nerds prospective. The people writing this document likely do not treat the naming differences which are apparently huge to this board the same. RER is still all day 2 way service - it meets that description.

At most this is speculation. Don't go saying that it is "Clear". It isn't. All evidence so far seems to indicate otherwise.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Or perhaps he actually asked them instead of presuming? They literally say they will match existing commitments in terms of transit from the Liberals in the platform, then mention a few projects, including GO expansion. There isn't an extensive list of exact programs, because they are covered by the "We will honour existing commitments" clause.

If I remember correctly, they said they’d honour existing commitments to projects already under construction. Not that they’d honour and and all existing transit commitments made by the Liberal governments

 

[innsertnamehere]

If I remember correctly, they said they’d honour existing commitments to projects already under construction. Not that they’d honour and and all existing transit commitments made by the Liberal governments

They then go on to list several projects that they will honour that are not under construction. It isn't exactly clear.

 

[nfitz]

Hourly service both ways between Pickering and Oakville since May 1967.

I thought it was in the fall sometime - October? Perhaps because of equipment delays.

The initial service was all-day 2-way, but was less than hourly.

"The existing commitments to two-way, all day GO train service" can only mean one thing.

Given the billions$ (tens of billions$?) between the mostly completed all-way 2-way and RER ... yes, I'd think it would only mean one thing.

GO and Metrolinx have been very carefcul to differentiate between them.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

They then go on to list several projects that they will honour that are not under construction. It isn't exactly clear.

This whole transit platform isn't exactly clear, which is why I say it's trying be all things to all people. A reader of the platform can validly take the ultra-optimistic point-of-view, and argue that the platform will see all existing Liberal-era transit projects honoured, including RER. Someone can just as validly take the pessimistic point-of-view, and claim that the platform will, and cancel just about all of the Liberal-era commitments (with some exceptions, such as FWLRT), including the cancelation of RER.

Given the last 50 years of GTHA transit politics, and the fiscally conservative views of the PCs, I'm going to assume they've intentionally worded this platform to allow them to cancel as many of the projects as possible, until they release a clear and concise list of what exactly they plan to build.

 

[Cobra]

Just playing devil's advocate:

The PC didn't came out with the GO RER program or electrification, so it makes sense for them to not have details about it. The contrary would actually scare me. They just said that they would complete what started and they mean the whole RER program. Now, we're not naive and we know full well that the PC are unlikely to expend it past what being done at the moment.

They are smart enough to understand that killing any existing project is a guarantee loss for them.

Worst case scenario and they pull a "Mike Harris", I also think they are smart enough to know that they can kiss any hope of reelection goodbye. Transit & Infrastructure projects aren't supposed to be ideological. Where Hudak didn't get the memo because he was too busy replicating Harper or/and Harris, I think Brown gets it. Don't get me wrong he'll cut somewhere and if you read his plateform, he's targeting the environment big time.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

The PC didn't came out with the GO RER program or electrification, so it makes sense for them to not have details about it.

Why wouldn't they have the details on RER? The details on RER are a 15 seconds Google Search away. I must be misinterpreting your comment.

Now, we're not naive and we know full well that the PC are unlikely to expend it past what being done at the moment.

They are smart enough to understand that killing any existing project is a guarantee loss for them.\

Worst case scenario and they pull a "Mike Harris", I also think they are smart enough to know that they can kiss any hope of reelection goodbye. Transit & Infrastructure projects aren't supposed to be ideological. Where Hudak didn't get the memo because he was too busy replicating Harper or/and Harris, I think Brown gets it

I don't expect the PCs will explicitly cancel any project, for the reasons you mentioned. However, what they would do is implement cancellation through indefinite delays, which is a strategy that this Liberal Government has mastered. They get all the fiscal benefits of cancelation (reduced spending), without any of the political fallout.

 

[salsa]

I heard Patrick Brown on CBC radio talking some crap about how if he is elected, he will make sure Scarborough is respected again. He even said it was it's own city. I just had to roll my eyes.

We are wasting billions of dollars on the subway extension just to enable garbage talking points like this for the upcoming election. Pathetic.

 

[Cobra]

Why wouldn't they have the details on RER? The details on RER are a 15 seconds Google Search away. I must be misinterpreting your comment.

I don't disagree with you, I just think it's redundant, it's in progress, they said they wouldn't change and they didn't come up with it. I don't see a problem

I don't expect the PCs will explicitly cancel any project, for the reasons you mentioned. However, what they would do is implement cancellation through indefinite delays, which is a strategy that this Liberal Government has mastered. They get all the fiscal benefits of cancellation (reduced spending), without any of the political fallout.

Liberals are building stuff even if the projects aren't ready. Once they are delivered, PC or not, we all know the Liberals did it which earns them even more credibility on that file. However, the fact that the PC built transit in the past has been forgotten and Harris cancelling projects is still fresh in everyone's mind. Even delays would prove very negative on them and make their reelection hopes harder. If there's one file they need to get their credibility back its transit.

Of course, all the above is assuming that they aren't morons. They must know that. That's one file where they need to keep their words and turn a new leaf as for too long, it was a huge reason for them staying in the opposition

 

[Neutrino]

About time transit became a provincial election issue and not just Toronto. More pressure from more voters.

 

[Cobra]

I'm glad that the PC came out with that transit platform as I'm way more interested in how the Liberals intends to top that.