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TTC: Other Items (catch all)

I don't mind a small increase to offset inflation and cost of business but I do mind that they are letting every kid claiming to be 12 on for free and adding presto operation fees to the fare. TTC and ML's miscalculation of how much TTC will lose over presto is no the rider's fault. We shouldn't be paying for mistakes that the TTC didn't realized.
 
I disagree on that claim. albeit it all depends on how you define "efficient". I'd say the TTC used to be vastly more efficient two generations ago, and not so efficient now.

The TTC was vastly more efficient decades ago because they were only serving the high density Old Toronto. Serving the inner sunburbs ruined any perceived "efficiency".
 
I don't mind a small increase to offset inflation and cost of business but I do mind that they are letting every kid claiming to be 12 on for free and adding presto operation fees to the fare. TTC and ML's miscalculation of how much TTC will lose over presto is no the rider's fault. We shouldn't be paying for mistakes that the TTC didn't realized.
The TTC were not in favour of Presto but we're forced into it by Metrolinx and the Province. Of course it does have some advantages but the Metrolinx % is probably too high and TTC makes it more complex by refusing to go to timed transfers.
 
The TTC was vastly more efficient decades ago because they were only serving the high density Old Toronto. Serving the inner sunburbs ruined any perceived "efficiency".
That's certainly a good part of it. They also weren't a political football the way they are now, and that relates to your point in terms of subways. The TTC may have served the suburbs, but built subways where demand dictated, not where votes could be bought.

In all fairness, Canada's ability to run efficient bureaucracies is starting to fail. This was apparent in the UK generations ago, it's starting to happen here. Ironically, as far as transit goes, the US seems to be improving in many cities, but that's because they hit bottom and are bouncing back...not to mention Federal funding. They are also realizing the car culture has destroyed their cities. That's still a struggle here in Toronto. Toronto used to be the envy of North Americans for transit, winning the safety award for some (thirty?) years in a row.

We've slipped, badly.
 
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The TTC were not in favour of Presto but we're forced into it by Metrolinx and the Province. Of course it does have some advantages but the Metrolinx % is probably too high and TTC makes it more complex by refusing to go to timed transfers.

As I recall, TTC wasn't forced into using Presto, although they were reluctant. It was agreed in 2011 to use Presto in exchange for the province agreeing to the combined Eglinton-Scarborough Crosstown.
I wonder what will happen first, the grade-separated Eglinton Scarborough line connecting STC to Yonge, or full Presto roll-out.
 
I wonder what will happen first, the grade-separated Eglinton Scarborough line connecting STC to Yonge, or full Presto roll-out.

Seeing as the ECLRT is at minimum about 4.5, and realistically at least 5.5-6 years away from opening (but the vehicle contract might fall through any time now and need to be replaced pushing that back, possibly quite a lot) and Presto is, by all measures, very well on track to be fully rolled out in less than 45 days, I'm going to take a shot in the dark and gamble on Presto.
 
As I recall, TTC wasn't forced into using Presto, although they were reluctant. It was agreed in 2011 to use Presto in exchange for the province agreeing to the combined Eglinton-Scarborough Crosstown.
I wonder what will happen first, the grade-separated Eglinton Scarborough line connecting STC to Yonge, or full Presto roll-out.

They were forced.
 
There is not a single person working in City Council that isn't "rich" by these standards, and who would not be affected at all by this increase financially. Who do you want to be mayor of Toronto? The homeless guy on Queen and University?

The same report mentions that Toronto's transit ridership has increased 33%, while population has increased only 25% over the past 24 years. Transit growth is rapidly outpacing population. Imagine how much greater it could be if we didn't have mayors hostile to transit service.
 
As I recall, TTC wasn't forced into using Presto, although they were reluctant. It was agreed in 2011 to use Presto in exchange for the province agreeing to the combined Eglinton-Scarborough Crosstown.
I wonder what will happen first, the grade-separated Eglinton Scarborough line connecting STC to Yonge, or full Presto roll-out.

What is it with you and obsessing over that combined Eglinton Scarborough Crosstown Plan, you can't seem to think of anything else.

The TTC was forced into using it, they wanted an open payment system and had accepted bids for for such a system. The province forced them into using Presto and threatened to withdraw funding for the LRT lines and I think the new streetcars as well.
 
The same report mentions that Toronto's transit ridership has increased 33%, while population has increased only 25% over the past 24 years. Transit growth is rapidly outpacing population. Imagine how much greater it could be if we didn't have mayors hostile to transit service.

How many of the ridership came from outside the 416? There are people who smuggle themselves across the borders from the 905 to use the TTC. The 905 don't pay property taxes that subsidize the 90¢ per TTC fare. Unlike in the States where the cities have a sales tax payable from visitors and tourists from outside those cities.
 
How many of the ridership came from outside the 416? There are people who smuggle themselves across the borders from the 905 to use the TTC. The 905 don't pay property taxes that subsidize the 90¢ per TTC fare. Unlike in the States where the cities have a sales tax payable from visitors and tourists from outside those cities.

The commercial/retail pay property tax. They help pay for our transit. And they need customers.

A retail sales tax is a regressive system which penalizes the poor the most. You do not want that in Toronto.
And just like the US you would see a catering of retail in a 0% location...Mississauga. So Toronto would lose a huge amount of new retail development.
 
The commercial/retail pay property tax. They help pay for our transit. And they need customers.

A retail sales tax is a regressive system which penalizes the poor the most. You do not want that in Toronto.
And just like the US you would see a catering of retail in a 0% location...Mississauga. So Toronto would lose a huge amount of new retail development.

I always feel the need to challenge the argument that a sales tax is or must be 'regressive'.

In Toronto, ON, Canada, looking at the HST.....

The tax does not apply to basic grocery, nor to residential rent, nor children's clothes, amongst other exceptions.

These together account for about 70% of what a low, or lower-middle income earner would spend in after-tax dollars.

On top of that, if you earn less than about $34,000 or so, you get a rebate equal to around $500, as a single person, more if you have kids, which in essence entirely refunds any HST you would have paid, and probably a bit extra on top.

Its regressive in the sense that it isn't a tiered-bracket system; but in truth the poor are substantially exempt from paying this tax as are most lower-middle income earners.

***

With respect to charging this tax, as a municipal tax, it would be best to do it province-wide, with the second choice being regionally, with the entire GTHA charging it, rather than the City alone.

That said, a 1% difference is unlikely to have a massive impact on Toronto-based retail.

There is no Norstrom or Sak's in York Region, or Durham, or Halton for that matter.

There is no one driving an hour each way to do their groceries, which are largely sales-tax exempt anyway.

Where it would have an effect is on border roads, where shifting to other side of the street would save you 1%, a concern yes, but not inevitable disaster.
 
I always feel the need to challenge the argument that a sales tax is or must be 'regressive'.

In Toronto, ON, Canada, looking at the HST.....

The tax does not apply to basic grocery, nor to residential rent, nor children's clothes, amongst other exceptions.

These together account for about 70% of what a low, or lower-middle income earner would spend in after-tax dollars.

On top of that, if you earn less than about $34,000 or so, you get a rebate equal to around $500, as a single person, more if you have kids, which in essence entirely refunds any HST you would have paid, and probably a bit extra on top.

Its regressive in the sense that it isn't a tiered-bracket system; but in truth the poor are substantially exempt from paying this tax as are most lower-middle income earners.

***

With respect to charging this tax, as a municipal tax, it would be best to do it province-wide, with the second choice being regionally, with the entire GTHA charging it, rather than the City alone.

That said, a 1% difference is unlikely to have a massive impact on Toronto-based retail.

There is no Norstrom or Sak's in York Region, or Durham, or Halton for that matter.

There is no one driving an hour each way to do their groceries, which are largely sales-tax exempt anyway.

Where it would have an effect is on border roads, where shifting to other side of the street would save you 1%, a concern yes, but not inevitable disaster.

People forgot about the GST/HST tax credit. See link. Maybe having a city (or GTHA) sales tax would mean having a rebate as well for low income families as well.

The GST/HST credit is a tax-free quarterly payment that helps individuals and families with low or modest incomes offset all or part of the GST or HST that they pay.
 

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