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TTC: New Fare Gate Installation

TheTigerMaster said:
What happens if you lose your Presto card? Are you stuck on the subway for the duration of the life of the Universe?
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In Brussels I needed to get one of the metro police to let me out; thankfully, they're at nearly every station downtown. With TTC the station staff would likely handle it; another option is the Washington DC/BART method of putting ticket purchase machines in the fare-paid areas.

Fun fact, I lost my ticket inside the faregate. There was a gap between the electronic tap surface and faregate body plenty large enough to suck in one of those bendy paper tickets when I slide it off. Gate was open, ticket was gone, I went through anyway (gambled I wouldn't need the ticket to exit; was wrong).
 
rbt said:
In Brussels I needed to get one of the metro police to let me out; thankfully, they're at nearly every station downtown. With TTC the station staff would likely handle it; another option is the Washington DC/BART method of putting ticket purchase machines in the fare-paid areas.

Fun fact, I lost my ticket inside the faregate. There was a gap between the electronic tap surface and faregate body plenty large enough to suck in one of those bendy paper tickets when I slide it off. Gate was open, ticket was gone, I went through anyway (gambled I wouldn't need the ticket to exit; was wrong).
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Vancouver recently went to "tap-in, tap-out" for SkyTrain. They have machines for purchasing an exit fare in case you lose your card. I think the cost was the same as one 3-zone ticket.
 
EastYorkTTCFan said:
Maybe but I think more people will be caught doing it as they will probably have more fare inspectors out.
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Shouldn't a gate 'catch ' you if there is no 'ON' tap? So if you hopped a gate and then at a busy station, went to tap off, shouldn't the system stop that individual and call a fare inspector? "No valid start to journey. Please wait for customer assistance to exit."
 
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TransitBart said:
Shouldn't a gate 'catch ' you if there is no 'ON' tap? So if you hopped a gate and then at a busy station, went to tap off, shouldn't the system stop that individual and call a fare inspector? 'No valid start to journey. Please wait for customer assistance to exit."
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That's what happens elsewhere - e.g. London. There if you do not have enough money on your card or have no card or it does not show a tap in, the gates do not open. You either wait to explain or add money at an add fare machine inside fare paid area or attempt to jump the gate.
 
DSC said:
That's what happens elsewhere - e.g. London. There if you do not have enough money on your card or have no card or it does not show a tap in, the gates do not open. You either wait to explain or add money at an add fare machine inside fare paid area or attempt to jump the gate.
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Exactly. So why is the crowd here so hysterical about this proven and widely-used technology?

Too much criticism folks.

Since Main Street Station was done last Spring, this has rolled out remarkably quickly and smoothly. It's a big job requiring both electrical and data connections. Everyone here who says TTC can't execute should re-evaluate that view. For an agency that has not had a lot of big change for a long time, it is coming thick and fast. Fare Gates. Station hosts in place of collectors. New fleet. OPTO on Line 4. TYSSE. ATC on Line 1. ECLRT. FWLRT...and that's only in the next six years.
 
DSC said:
That's what happens elsewhere - e.g. London. There if you do not have enough money on your card or have no card or it does not show a tap in, the gates do not open. You either wait to explain or add money at an add fare machine inside fare paid area or attempt to jump the gate.
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Aside. This appeals to my sense of fair play and intolerance for assh*les. You have to cheat twice to get away with it and that increases the chance you'll get caught.
 
TransitBart said:
The way it should be for the nefarious.

For the genuine, call customer service. :)
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For the nefarious? What would be nefarious about jumping the gates to exit the station? Toronto uses a flat fare system, so you'd be charged the same regardless of whether you tap or decide to jump the gates to exit. In fact, I don't quite understand the logic behind tapping to exit. What benefit does that provide?
 
TheTigerMaster said:
In fact, I don't quite understand the logic behind tapping to exit. What benefit does that provide?
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In a flat-fare system like Toronto, none. And there's no tap-off coming any time soon, or at the very least the TTC has no public plans to introduce it. I think the only exception is at York University, to implement the free transfers for Viva and Go Transit.
 
amnesiajune said:
In a flat-fare system like Toronto, none. And there's no tap-off coming any time soon, or at the very least the TTC has no public plans to introduce it. I think the only exception is at York University, to implement the free transfers for Viva and Go Transit.
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Why are there free transfers to Viva and GO Transit at York University Station?
 
TheTigerMaster said:
For the nefarious? What would be nefarious about jumping the gates to exit the station? Toronto uses a flat fare system, so you'd be charged the same regardless of whether you tap or decide to jump the gates to exit. In fact, I don't quite understand the logic behind tapping to exit. What benefit does that provide?
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The benefit? Aside from tapping off to determine a fare by distance, tapping collects data so we can end the stupid debates about how many people travel from where to where. We will know exactly where each trip began and ended. We will know how many rides a Metropass user takes. We can stop running the system with guesses. Unless they are insane, politicians and planners will have to accept what the data say.
 
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TheTigerMaster said:
Why are there free transfers to Viva and GO Transit at York University Station?
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I don't believe Viva and GO will be serving York University station, actually. GO Trains will service Downsview Park GO/TTC, replacing York University GO which will be decommissioned, GO buses will service 407 station, YRT Pioneer Village, and Viva Vaughan Centre.

I've also heard that there will be free transfers specifically for the trip of getting off the GO Train at Downsview Park, getting on the subway, and getting off at York University--the rationale I've heard isn't that we feel bad for students and want to throw them a discount, but rather because we don't want to slap them with a new penalty: students currently don't have to pay a TTC fare for the GO Train trip into York U, since they just get off at the GO station and walk or take the free York-run shuttle bus. With York U GO being closed, and the station moved out of walking distance at Downsview Park+no plans to continue offering a free shuttle due to distance, students will have to take the subway 2 stops to get to campus, and it's patently unreasonable to take what is currently a free trip and make students pay $112 a month (pending increases) for a TTC metropass for a 2-stop subway ride that they're essentially being forced to take due to transit planning decisions adding a step to their previously simpler trip.

I would assume GO buses at 407 station will be subject to the same arrangement, as they used to go directly into campus and are now being cut short 2 subway stops away. YRT/Viva I'm not sure about--my understanding is that with tap-out required on the TYSSE to charge an additional fare for travel beyond steeles, at minimum, the YRT portion of the subway fare should be a free transfer to/from a YRT or Viva bus so that you only pay the $2.90 TTC fare. I wouldn't be surprised if other transit routes/agencies that used to service York U directly were offered the same free transfers solely for trips from their terminus points to York University station. Of course, no free transfer for travel downtown.
 
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