Only to a point; one of these studes was the one to used to justify Sheppard having priority ...
What credibility can you give to a study saying that Sheppard can have a “higher” priority over Eglinton?
The peak point is already subway; so it already has the capacity...
It really shows you studied engineering… this project doesn’t address many factors such as network connectivity, speed, economic growth, social impact, etc… You’re looking at this with only numbers… only numbers, no common sense
If Sheppard east doesn’t justify a subway, explain how Morningside justify and LRT let alone the zoo… Can your numbers explain that logic?
How do you explain that many transit hubs (downsview to STC) on the same route will be link by a 22 kph streetcar which will still require many transfert a billion dollar later?
Which only demonstrates that appropriate technology was not chosen for those other lines ... or that they were constructed in a different era when the subway was a more economical choice. While an interesting point, it doesn't provide any information to provide input into future decisions.
Are you serious???
So any cities across the globe that do not meet the TTC’s “standards” for subway got it wrong?
Everyone but the TTC are incompetent for choosing subways?
Montreal who completed the blue line in 1988 (north Crosstown) were wrong? Right…they should have built a streetcar on Jean-Talon instead…
Because the passenger demand can easily be met by a lot cheaper modes, allowing a lot more km to be built for the same $.
What about speed?
What about finding ways to built subways at a lower cost?
What about SELRT being overprice?
What about BRT east of Agincourt to cut cost instead of building a streetcar to Morningside?
Demand is one thing but you don’t address speed, transfers and practicality…
Because there is already subway west of Don Mills that can handle whatever east of Don Mills throws at it.
Really and I thought the goal of public transit was to increase ridership… Every major city are finding ways to convince people to leave their cars at home and take public transit and you would be satisfied with that “incomplete line” that won’t do anything to get people out of their cars east of Don Mills. If you think that people will leave their cars for a streetcar, you are seriously dreaming.
Downsview to Yonge is east of the LRT project; I really don't see the relevance; it's not like having a subway from Yonge to Downsview is suddenly going to double the number of people travelling from Don Mills to Victoria Park. Besides, they did study it in
Metrolinx BCA report where they noted that extending the subway to Downsview (Option 4) would results in a peak demand of 5,100 passengers per hour per direction on the LRT east of Don Mills; compare to to the 5,000 passengers per hour predicted for the selected Option 3. In other words, extending to Downsview will only add 100 passengers per hour east of Don Mills, so not a signficant issue.
Talked like a true politician who never or rarely use Sheppard West of Yonge Street.
I use it “EVERYDAY” at peak hours.
Streetcar won’t fixe it at all. You cannot take another lane off Sheppard between Yonge and Bathurst. It’s to narrow. Circulation is heavy and although the TTC tries to put as much buses as possible, they cannot meet an acceptable quality of service. Connectivity and practicality points towards the subway extension as the only option. Paying 600 millions to convert the whole thing is wasting money.
People will get out of their way and travel to go to a subway station, not to a streetcar stop. Saying that an extra 100 passengers per hour would use the subway over LRT is…”stretching it”
When the Laval Extension was open in Laval, the STM predicted 35 000 passengers…they got 60 000 which badly overcrowded the line with no short term solutions to fix the problem except buying new trains. It shows that the STM underestimated how far people were willing to travel and how much people were willing to change their habits to get to a subway station.
Where has TTC said 30,000 is needed for subway? The EA I referenced earlier clearly showed that at 15,000 subway was the only option, and that 30,000 is the capacity for subway.
Perhaps someone stuck their foot in their mouth? The studies are documents, and are quite clear.
I think the TTC contradicted themselves period…
I can't for a minute imagine that this would double the usage! Particularly as they will have the Markham GO Train running regularily to Agincourt, Kennedy, and Union by then! And if you take that into account, the demand might actually decrease!
And no one works at NYCC or STC…
Agincourt is underused. Sure people are using the Go, YRT and VIVA to get to Finch Stn but what about those who would rather drive on Yonge street than use the (GO+TTC BUS+SUBWAY)?
Do you think they will leave their cars for (GO+LRT+SUBWAY) or (GO+SUBWAY)?
Of course it won’t affect those working Downtown but those working in North York and Scarborough…Absolutely.
Not at all, Having live in the suburbs myself in the past, I’ve seen this many times. A subway line’s ridership will always increase faster than a streetcar if you take into account all the growth and projects that it attracts. Sheppard Subway and North York Center Station already proved that. Even Downsview Station is doing the same. Once in the middle of nowhere, it will become the centre of many residential condo towers.
It’s really a point of view. Some wants the ridership there and now…Others use the subway to develop an area… Miller won’t build subway if his “standards” aren’t met. Others would build it to attract business, resident and give better service to those already using it and attract those near or farther. LRT is not even close to what a subway can bring in the long term.
Point of view…sure
Telling me there’s a “universal rule” about building subway that Miller have miraculously figure out over the incompetent europeens and Asians who are building even today…That’s stretching it.
The TTC 5000 projection dates back to when they were trying to justify the subway extension to SRT ... explain that one!
In 2001 they projected the ridership for the extension to STC would be 8400. If they did the study like they did today, they took in consideration the Sheppard Corridor area only. TTC official said “at 10 000, you’re in the subway technology”. IF Sheppard East of Don Mills grows like it did west of Don Mills it would exceed 10 000. IF the 190 buses keep on increasing year after years, what would a subway do?
I think the best thing for Toronto is to quickly build what is funded (before some government that just realised it has a huge deficit wants to pull it back); obtain funding for Jane and Don Mills, and perhaps Lakeshore West; push ahead with the DRL based on the outcome of the Environmental Assessment that has just started. Extend Yonge subway. Move ahead with GO and Metrolinx's commuter rail and regional express rail proposals quickly. And then in 2020 when Transit City is complete, and hopefully Yonge and the start of the DRL are under construction, sit down and figure out what to do next based on updated traffic studies, population densities, etc.
No “rapid” north crosstown is a mistake…period
