Toronto Union Station Revitalization | ?m | ?s | City of Toronto | NORR

DHLawrence85 said:
The main limitation is GO Transit's fleet of coaches, all designed to be low-floor. They would have to completely re-equip and rebuild every station on the network to be high-floor respectively.
Click to expand...

They wouldn't need to adjust all the other stations on the network, but they would need to stop buying their current BiLevel cars and switch to the MultiLevel cars used in Montreal and New Jersey. They wouldn't be able to have a high-platform at Union until enough equipment was converted to have all cars that show up on a platform be MultiLevel. Personally I think GO should make the transition now to MultiLevel so that some day they have the option of high platforms, even in the absence of having any time-line or decision to implement high platforms.
 
EnviroTO said:
They wouldn't need to adjust all the other stations on the network, but they would need to stop buying their current BiLevel cars and switch to the MultiLevel cars used in Montreal and New Jersey. They wouldn't be able to have a high-platform at Union until enough equipment was converted to have all cars that show up on a platform be MultiLevel. Personally I think GO should make the transition now to MultiLevel so that some day they have the option of high platforms, even in the absence of having any time-line or decision to implement high platforms.
Click to expand...

There is no need to transition to MultiLevel cars. As stated by DHLawrence85 above, the BiLevel car is designed to be equipped with high-level doors if required, even though no one has requested that option as yet. The only reason to use the MultiLevel car is if there are locations with restricted clearance that is not easily solved - such as a tunnel - and which is not a problem in Toronto.

As for high-level versus low-level, there is another option: UTA has equipped their cars and platforms with level-boarding doorways and platforms on the lowest level. This prevents clearance issues with most types of freight equipment and yet still allows for no-step entry/exit from the equipment.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
 
smallspy said:
the BiLevel car is designed to be equipped with high-level doors if required, even though no one has requested that option as yet.
Click to expand...
This is very interesting - are you saying that Bombardier has publicly stated that they can convert the existing bi-levels? Or that based on the car construction it is technically feasible?
 
The only BBD design I know of that can use high-floor doors is used by New Jersey Transit and AMT. Both companies use them on lines with high platforms (Penn Station and Gare Centrale) and height restrictions from tunnels.

The other GO stations technically wouldn't have to have their heights adjusted, but cars compatible with high-level platforms would have to have steps and floor panels like VIA Rail coaches have. Steps are a really bad choke point when boarding; GO might not want the delay that would accompany it, not to mention they would have to rebuild the accessibility platforms to reach the new height.
 
Photo by cjared

New Union canopy.jpg
 

Attachments

  • New Union canopy.jpg
    New Union canopy.jpg
    94.2 KB · Views: 517
chriskayTO said:
This is very interesting - are you saying that Bombardier has publicly stated that they can convert the existing bi-levels? Or that based on the car construction it is technically feasible?
Click to expand...

Not Bombardier - Hawker-Siddeley during the original design process of the car. The structure has not changed in any substantial manner since its original design in the mid-1970s.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
 
What are the constraints on Union Station's capacity? I hear it repeated all the time that as GO moves toward more all-day service and greater frequency that they will run out of capacity at Union. Based on a simple count of platforms and tracks, this doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. Zurich Hauptbahnhof, for example, with a similar number of tracks as union and also primarily a terminal station, serves almost 3000 trains per day. As far as I can tell, GO would have to have 5 minute service on every single on of their lines 24 hours a day in order to even approach that sort of capacity.

Edit: I think Union actually has about half the tracks, but I think the point still stands that there should theoretically be sufficient capacity at Union for far greater service than is planned.
 
Go trains take up to 10 minutes to unload and reload again, it is no in and out in a minute or two like many other stations.
 
sorry to be off-topic, but are they still going with the green roof design. ^in the last picture posted by Ed007Toronto you can see they have been doing something with the roof. The right side were they started there construction or the side nearest to the Air Canada Center the roof is white, looks brand newish and smoother. The rest is brown.
 
jamincan said:
What are the constraints on Union Station's capacity? I hear it repeated all the time that as GO moves toward more all-day service and greater frequency that they will run out of capacity at Union. Based on a simple count of platforms and tracks, this doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. Zurich Hauptbahnhof, for example, with a similar number of tracks as union and also primarily a terminal station, serves almost 3000 trains per day. As far as I can tell, GO would have to have 5 minute service on every single on of their lines 24 hours a day in order to even approach that sort of capacity.

Edit: I think Union actually has about half the tracks, but I think the point still stands that there should theoretically be sufficient capacity at Union for far greater service than is planned.
Click to expand...

Zurich has 56 tracks that can hold 2 long trains at the same time and I saw it personally this summer in actions. Videos and photos are up on my site.

The big different are the track leads as well fyovers which has far more capacity than Union. Another couple of flyovers are being build as well a through underground tunnel for a new line.

GO is going to have a problem with the west side since it will see 2-3 times the service than the east side. Once the new west concourse is built and in operation along with the new east one, GO will (Should by Right) have 2 trains on the same track at the same time. If the Lakeshore use Track #27, it will have a faster entrance/exit from Union. The same can happen for Milton on track #26 if all trains arrive and depart within 5-10 minutes upon arrival. I saw this type of service at many terminals in Europe with no problem other than servicing the trains with fresh water and cleaning the toilets. Many trains ran with out toilets supplies or water, even on long haul trains.

I have to wait and see what the new tracks, switches setup look like, as well work, along with the the new signaling system to say more on the limitation for the station based on what I saw in action for stub track station let alone through station in Europe. I can say this now, Union operation fails at this time compare to smaller station in Europe for turn over.
 
drum118 said:
Zurich has 56 tracks that can hold 2 long trains at the same time and I saw it personally this summer in actions. Videos and photos are up on my site.
Click to expand...

Zurich has 30 tracks and some tracks are shorter then other. The Swiss know that one size (of train) doesn't fit all.
 
I noticed today that they have started to lay a new copper roof on top of the blueskin waterproofing on the south side of the main roof of the Union Station building. Not sure if they are also working on the north side. UPDATE on 27 Dec. From a Dec 21 photo on the L-Tower site (posting 4293) at http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/showth...-Fernbrook-Cityzen-58s-Libeskind-P-S)/page287 one can see they are working on both north and south sides of the roof.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to post here.

Back
Top