Toronto Union Pearson Express | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx | MMM Group Limited

[Riverdale Rink Rat]

Often people travel for a meeting or something like that and might leave almost immediately afterward.

Anyone who's jet-lagged must have come from Pearson, so the sign works.

Asked my French wife, and shortening on signs & skipping the 'l'' is perfectly acceptable.

Very nice job. Looks great.

 

[kotsy]

Union Pearson Express Entrance Awaiting Opening by its only kotsy, on Flickr

 

[JasonParis]

A little (YYZ) in brackets would solve this easily.

It's especially a (minor) issue as transit to YTZ can also be made direct from Union too.

I've tweeted Metrolinx.

 

[Tuscani01]

The 509 should just be rebranded as DOWN. UP for YYZ, DOWN for YTZ! That would be geographically accurate too!

 

[Markster]

The 509 should just be rebranded as DOWN. UP for YYZ, DOWN for YTZ! That would be geographically accurate too!

Sounds like a waterfront condo's protest chant.

"UP with Pearson! DOWN with Island!"

 

[DarnDirtyApe]

Which shuttle, train, bus, taxi, Uber, whatever will take me to Owen Sound Billy Bishop Regional Airport? That's the one with Airport IATA Code of YOS?

Billy Bishop Toronto City Airport has IATA Code of YTZ.

Toronto Pearson International Airport has IATA Code of YYZ.

At least, use the IATA Code. See link.

BTW. Toronto Union Station has a IATA Code of YBZ. See link.

Now taking bets on when Air Canada will start selling YUL-YTZ-YBZ-YYZ-XXX itineraries...

 

[Cityminded]

Would it be too early for all the relevant agencies to get together and really develop these wayfinding systems up to a true global standard?

As you point out, Union Station might be on its way to becoming an international travel node. It might so happen that one day, not so far into the future, someone would pass through Union Station en route from say, Boston to Shanghai, or Lima to Ottawa. Sure it sounds farfetched right now but it can be surprising how people make use of new travel options that become available to them. There are many possible combinations that might involve one or both airports, the UPX, TTC streetcars, subways, GO trains and buses, etc. etc. - all connecting through Union Station (or YBZ, as we've now learned).

Since we have always aimed to "welcome the world" to Toronto, it might help to look at things through the eyes of a visiting Pan Am Games athlete, or a foreign exchange student, or any number of future international visitors who will come to the city for leisure, business or study. How might we develop the wayfinding at Union up to a level of clarity, consistency, and organization that truly serves the needs of an international customer base, and reflects its growing role as an international travel node.

(On a related note, one possible starting point for the various transit agencies is to consider updating their system maps to show both of Toronto's international airports and their connecting routes, both within and across various networks.)

 

[Adjei]

Would it be too early for all the relevant agencies to get together and really develop these wayfinding systems up to a true global standard?

As you point out, Union Station might be on its way to becoming an international travel node. It might so happen that one day, not so far into the future, someone would pass through Union Station en route from say, Boston to Shanghai, or Lima to Ottawa. Sure it sounds farfetched right now but it can be surprising how people make use of new travel options that become available to them. There are many possible combinations that might involve one or both airports, the UPX, TTC streetcars, subways, GO trains and buses, etc. etc. - all connecting through Union Station (or YBZ, as we've now learned).

Since we have always aimed to "welcome the world" to Toronto, it might help to look at things through the eyes of a visiting Pan Am Games athlete, or a foreign exchange student, or any number of future international visitors who will come to the city for leisure, business or study. How might we develop the wayfinding at Union up to a level of clarity, consistency, and organization that truly serves the needs of an international customer base, and reflects its growing role as an international travel node.

(On a related note, one possible starting point for the various transit agencies is to consider updating their route maps to show both of Toronto's international airports and their connecting routes, both within and across various networks.)

Metrolinx is looking at a regional wayfinding initiative with the other transit agencies in the region, hopefully they can bring forward some solutions to fix this convoluted mess.

 

[W. K. Lis]

Would it be too early for all the relevant agencies to get together and really develop these wayfinding systems up to a true global standard?

As you point out, Union Station might be on its way to becoming an international travel node. It might so happen that one day, not so far into the future, someone would pass through Union Station en route from say, Boston to Shanghai, or Lima to Ottawa. Sure it sounds farfetched right now but it can be surprising how people make use of new travel options that become available to them. There are many possible combinations that might involve one or both airports, the UPX, TTC streetcars, subways, GO trains and buses, etc. etc. - all connecting through Union Station (or YBZ, as we've now learned).

Since we have always aimed to "welcome the world" to Toronto, it might help to look at things through the eyes of a visiting Pan Am Games athlete, or a foreign exchange student, or any number of future international visitors who will come to the city for leisure, business or study. How might we develop the wayfinding at Union up to a level of clarity, consistency, and organization that truly serves the needs of an international customer base, and reflects its growing role as an international travel node.

(On a related note, one possible starting point for the various transit agencies is to consider updating their system maps to show both of Toronto's international airports and their connecting routes, both within and across various networks.)

Just to confuse things further, add Toronto/Buttonville Municipal Airport, which is YKZ, to the list:

YYZ Toronto Pearson International Airport
​

YTZ Billy Bishop Toronto City Airport

YOS Owen Sound Billy Bishop Regional Airport
​

YKZ Toronto/Buttonville Municipal Airport


​

YBZ Toronto Union Station
​

 

[TOareaFan]

It might so happen that one day, not so far into the future, someone would pass through Union Station en route from say, Boston to Shanghai, or Lima to Ottawa. Sure it sounds farfetched right now but it can be surprising how people make use of new travel options that become available to them. There are many possible combinations that might involve one or both airports, the UPX, TTC streetcars, subways, GO trains and buses, etc. etc. - all connecting through Union Station (or YBZ, as we've now learned).

I am going to ask for a bit more clarification on what you are suggesting here.

Someone in Boston might fly from Logan to Billy Bishop to get on a streetcar or a shuttle to get to Pearson to then get on UPe to get to Pearson to fly to Shanghai? Why would they not just fly from Logan directly to Pearson and connect to Shanghai?

Someone in Lima would fly to Pearson to take the UPe to Union to take a streetcar or a shuttle to YTZ to then fly to Ottawa? Why would they not connect at Pearson to the many more flights to Ottawa that originate at Pearson compared to the few that leave from YTZ?

It seems we have taken the discussion about a bit of signage into a bit of a strange world where people go out of their way to, well, go out of their way

 

[mdrejhon]

YBZ Toronto Union Station
​

Mayday, mayday. Coming down, Yankee-Brazo-Zulu, on Runway 25/27.

 

[mdrejhon]

Someone in Boston might fly from Logan to Billy Bishop to get on a streetcar or a shuttle to get to Pearson to then get on UPe to get to Pearson to fly to Shanghai? Why would they not just fly from Logan directly to Pearson and connect to Shanghai?

People make use of rather interesting itineraries, open jaw, if they have a layover in the city, or to save money.
I have flown to SFO only to depart from LAX.
Likewise, driving a family to Buffalo to save a few hundred on family airfare.

Conceivably a tech-savvy may book a flight that goes to Toronto, then use Porter to hop to Ottawa, if it saves them 200 to 300 to do so, e.g. their national flag airline may be much cheaper than Air Canada and might not codeshare, and Porter is having one of their fare sales with seats but Air Canada sold out their price matched seats... It happens from time to time, and now Toronto can connect 509 to UPX, it needs slight wayfinding clarification even for other reasons too...

 

[ksun]

I am going to ask for a bit more clarification on what you are suggesting here.

Someone in Boston might fly from Logan to Billy Bishop to get on a streetcar or a shuttle to get to Pearson to then get on UPe to get to Pearson to fly to Shanghai? Why would they not just fly from Logan directly to Pearson and connect to Shanghai?

Someone in Lima would fly to Pearson to take the UPe to Union to take a streetcar or a shuttle to YTZ to then fly to Ottawa? Why would they not connect at Pearson to the many more flights to Ottawa that originate at Pearson compared to the few that leave from YTZ?

It seems we have taken the discussion about a bit of signage into a bit of a strange world where people go out of their way to, well, go out of their way

It appears you don't get the value of frequent flyer programs.

Two friends of mine, who were going to visit Iceland, did just that this past weekend. Because they used their miles, it allows them to make stopovers. So instead of making a short connection at YYZ (from LAX) and flying to Iceland a few hours later, they deliberately chose to have a 14 hour layover in Toronto. They rented a car from YYZ and visited me downtown (not too far from Union). We spent quite a few hours together, had a nice meal, chatted for hours, before they drove back to YYZ and took the next flight to Reykjavik.

And this is considered a connection because it is under 24 hours. They will make a real stop over somewhere else, which allows them to stay for a few days (which means visiting a different place, and in their case, Spain), before returning to LAX. All this costs the same miles as a return trip between LAX and the destination.

This is how mileage savvy people use their miles. They would consider redeeming a simple return ticket (using the same number of miles) utterly stupid because you are not taking full advantage of the program. I am always speechless about those people who spend 75000 aeroplan miles for a simple return ticket between YYZ and Asia, (or 60000 between YYZ and west Europe) without making any stopovers, when the program allows one to make a mini around the globe trip.

 

[TOareaFan]

It appears you don't get the value of frequent flyer programs.

perhaps I don't....probably should just donate my miles.

Two friends of mine, who were going to visit Iceland, did just that this past weekend. Because they used their miles, it allows them to make stopovers. So instead of making a short connection at YYZ (from LAX) and flying to Iceland a few hours later, they deliberately chose to have a 14 hour layover in Toronto. They rented a car from YYZ and visited me downtown (not too far from Union). We spent quite a few hours together, had a nice meal, chatted for hours, before they drove back to YYZ and took the next flight to Reykjavik.

And this is considered a connection because it is under 24 hours. They will make a real stop over somewhere else, which allows them to stay for a few days (which means visiting a different place, and in their case, Spain), before returning to LAX. All this costs the same miles as a return trip between LAX and the destination.

those are lovely stories but please consider the context of the discussion and explain to me how the different signage that was being discussed would have assisted your travel savvy pals from LA on their way to Iceland via a sidetrip to DT.

I don't deny that the sort of trip you describe exist.....but I hope you would not deny that they are, by far, the very small minority of trips taken and signage programs should not be developed for that population of trips. Unless it is your suggestion that these super travel savvy travellers, who consider people using air miles for direct trips "utterly stupid" are only savvy with their air miles but can't quite figure out in advance which train/streetcar/bus/whatever will get them back to Pearson to continue their journey to Iceland?

 

[mdrejhon]

It's really not the only reason -- there are huge numbers of stories of people (people unfamiliar with the existence of more than one airport) being confused which airport to go to, when they are in London, UK. And what we have is potentially worse wayfinding than London had to do to keep all their airports clear.