Toronto Spadina Subway Extension Emergency Exits | ?m | 1s | TTC | IBI Group

[scarberiankhatru]

No more open pit mines, unless demand justifies it.

I never advocated overbuilding stations, I just wanted a taller platform ceiling and greater attention to detail with the artwork. It really shouldn't cost that much. It would really improve the experience. Stockholm and even Montreal have done it.

As I recall the Spacing conversations were centred around the Bloor Danforth tiles because they were most at risk. Pape and Danforth and are to be significantly altered soon. Yet every station is important in the pattern and consistency of the original design. There were some calls to restore and enhance. There's no "modernization" coming for Leslie, hence no preservation discussion.

Demand never really justifies subway stations conceived by Doom level designers. I never said design/aesthetics didn't matter...I was talking about overbuilding stations and then writing off the wasted money as Good "at least it's palatial" Design. Spending a couple million on artwork or skylights is one thing, but open pit mines with mini-PATH networks to nowhere and ballroom sized mezzanines are quite another. It would be better if the ridiculously large mezzanine spaces were shifted to platform ceiling level, but it would be better still if there were no ridiculously large spaces at all.

Yes, I know what Spacing was doing. I mentioned Leslie because internet groups will pop up to support absolutely anything, and even though Spacing was recently centred on the less is more era stations, the more is more era stations like Leslie will one day receive similar Spacing treatment.

 

[adma]

Yes, I know what Spacing was doing. I mentioned Leslie because internet groups will pop up to support absolutely anything, and even though Spacing was recently centred on the less is more era stations, the more is more era stations like Leslie will one day receive similar Spacing treatment.

Given that it involves "art", I'd betcha that there'd be a Spacing brouhaha if the Leslie tiles were threatened *now*, never mind 20 or 30 years from now...

 

[scarberiankhatru]

Given that it involves "art", I'd betcha that there'd be a Spacing brouhaha if the Leslie tiles were threatened *now*, never mind 20 or 30 years from now...

If there was a brouhaha, it could just as easily be for ironically celebrating the suburbs as for preserving art.

 

[ShonTron]

Given that it involves "art", I'd betcha that there'd be a Spacing brouhaha if the Leslie tiles were threatened *now*, never mind 20 or 30 years from now...

Given the distance from the Gladstone, the Communist's Daughter, and Sneaky Dee's, I doubt the Spacing crowd would notice if Leslie were threatened.

Then again, I think Leslie looks like a mausoleum and unlike the mosiac at Sheppard-Yonge, or even the optical illusions at Bayview, it's never going to be worth saving. I think the repeating tile where the person spelled "Shepherd and Leslie" makes it truly TTC-worthy as well.

 

[junctionist]

What if the coloured stripes on the concrete walls on the Sheppard line are actual distribution pipes painted fuchsia? Such a move towards addressing aesthetics, practical matters, and the need to cut costs all in one pipe would be inventive. Alas, I doubt it distributes anything.

 

[adma]

Given the distance from the Gladstone, the Communist's Daughter, and Sneaky Dee's, I doubt the Spacing crowd would notice if Leslie were threatened.

Yeah, as if the Shawn Micallef gang never psychogeographs up this way because they get nosebleeds north of the 401, yeah, sure, whatever you say...

Remember who started the "subway button" phenomenon, kiddo. And if Matt Blackett can testify on behalf of Islington Station, well, Leslie isn't much more distant (and for whatever Spacing-loving college kids, it's the Ikea station)

Then again, I think Leslie looks like a mausoleum and unlike the mosiac at Sheppard-Yonge, or even the optical illusions at Bayview, it's never going to be worth saving. I think the repeating tile where the person spelled "Shepherd and Leslie" makes it truly TTC-worthy as well.

If you think the tile's not inherently worth saving (at least, relative to a lot else on the subway that's been deemed worth saving), you truly are a philistine by Spacing or whatever standards.

 

[M II A II R II K]

I saw on the news that they're already doing some site preparation to do with sewage and stuff, and that the cities won't have to pay anything, just Queen's Park but they're still waiting for the Feds.

 

[Mike in TO]

A recently released report to the City of Toronto Government Management Committee recommends approval of a memorandum of principles between the TTC and Downsview Park regarding property acquisition with respect to the Spadina Subway extension. The exact nature of the property that the TTC will require is not known because the project is still in preliminary stages. Of the estimated $2.6 billion capital costs for the project, $100 million has been allocated for property acquisition.

 

[RedRocket191]

I saw on the news that they're already doing some site preparation to do with sewage and stuff, and that the cities won't have to pay anything, just Queen's Park but they're still waiting for the Feds.

Yes, that is correct. Under MoveOntario 2020, the province is supposed to pay 2/3rds and the federal government 1/3rd. However, it's not clear who will pay the operating costs, or what will happen if the feds refuse to come to the table.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

From the Globe:

SUBWAY
Spadina extension hits snag
KAREN HOWLETT AND JEFF GRAY

July 10, 2008

The federal government has not yet signed off on a multimillion-dollar deal to extend the Spadina subway line into the Toronto area's rapidly growing York Region. And the speculation around the provincial legislature is that politics has played a role in that delay.

Ontario Premier Dalton McGuinty said yesterday that he had thought the federal government would hold a news conference this week to announce completion of the agreement.

But that has now been delayed, he told reporters, because "something gummed up the works."

Ottawa's $697-million contribution to the $2-billion subway extension is part of $1.5-billion in funding that Prime Minister Stephen Harper unveiled in March, 2007, for Toronto-area public transit projects. While some preparatory work has started at the site of the subway extension, construction cannot start until all agreements are signed.

"I don't want to find fault here," Mr. McGuinty said. "Other issues seem to be clouding this major priority," he said, referring to other infrastructure projects that are part of the funding.

Around Queen's Park, however, the speculation is that the Harper government wants to time the completion of the deal to the next federal election, which could happen as early as this fall.

"There are better and worse times to do things," a source at the legislature said. "That could certainly be holding them back."

A spokeswoman for federal Transport Minister Lawrence Cannon denied that Ottawa is causing any undue delay to the project, or dragging its feet in order to announce the funding closer to an election.

Catherine Loubier, Mr. Cannon's director of communications, said the Spadina project will "proceed fast" once Ottawa has made final its Building Canada deal with Queen's Park to deliver $7.7-billion for various infrastructure projects across the province.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20080710.SPADINA10/TPStory/TPNational/Ontario/

________________________________________

Forget about waiting for Ottawa - Ontario should just upstage the Feds by unilaterally letting the extension proceed.

AoD

 

[Anth]

Forget about waiting for Ottawa - Ontario should just upstage the Feds by unilaterally letting the extension proceed.

Seriously, are there hard legal obstacles to growing a spine and just getting on with it? You'd think that Ontario has the clout to rip the feds a new one, yet it always seems so meek. Political sensitivity is one thing, but simply taking it like this every time is quite another.

 

[Conrad Black]

Why can't the province use the 1.4 billion it is contributing and get started. They could at least start the portion to York U.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

Because it is politically inopportune - it's the equivalent of sticking a pencil in someone's eye. That said, I am getting rather sick and tired of waiting for the proper stars to be aligned for needed infrastructure projects just for the sake of political opportunism - which above all else result in it being subjected to inflationary pressures.

AoD

 

[JasonParis]

It could also be argued that a massive construction site flanked with signs saying "financed by the Government of Canada" makes for a better and more lasting impression on would-be voters than a quick press conference that will make the news for a single day.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

Indeed. Or the endless soundbites on how it's part of Canada's "ecoaction" plan - of course, they wouldn't be mentioning the years of inaction prior to the shovels hitting the ground.

AoD