Toronto Queens Quay & Water's Edge Revitalization | ?m | ?s | Waterfront Toronto

44 North said:
I'm not sure why we have to reinvent the wheel on this. We're not a temperate climate. As much as I'd like to see more greenery in our streetscape, I really can't see grass working well. Perhaps synthetic turf, but...I have my doubts about that. Also, it's still part of the roadway, and vehicles and cyclists will be on various parts of the ROW. So I can't see MTO allowing such a surface.
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Oslo appears to be building a streetcar ROW with grass (http://www.dronninga-landskap.com/eng/index.php?side=segater&gater=16) and they get 30 days a year with more than 25 cm of snowfall. As for the parts that motor vehicles, cyclists and pedestrians have to be on (mainly at intersections), well, the grass needn't be continuous.

https://goo.gl/maps/ZBS4v

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the lemur said:
Oslo appears to be building a streetcar ROW with grass (http://www.dronninga-landskap.com/eng/index.php?side=segater&gater=16) and they get 30 days a year with more than 25 cm of snowfall. As for the parts that motor vehicles, cyclists and pedestrians have to be on (mainly at intersections), well, the grass needn't be continuous.

https://goo.gl/maps/ZBS4v
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In your Oslo example though, it looks like the ROW is protected from salt exposure in the winter by the row of hedges. We'd have to change our winter road maintenance practices on QQ to prevent brown dead grass every spring. Having to re-sod the ROW every year would get expensive.
 
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the lemur said:
Oslo appears to be building a streetcar ROW with grass (http://www.dronninga-landskap.com/eng/index.php?side=segater&gater=16) and they get 30 days a year with more than 25 cm of snowfall. As for the parts that motor vehicles, cyclists and pedestrians have to be on (mainly at intersections), well, the grass needn't be continuous.
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I don't exactly know Norway's climate, but I'd assume Oslo to be a bit more temperate than TO. So cool summers, and cooler (but more stable) winters than ours - with less extremes in each. As well, snowfall and accumulation itself doesn't mean much in terms of an area's temp, and if anything it can actually act as an insulator for grass. And like the comment says above, it's more of a proper ROW with an ample buffer. Here, I'd presume both QQ and MGT to be salted - which I don't think would help any kind of vegetation on the adjacent ROW.
 
ttk77 said:
In your Oslo example though, it looks like the ROW is protected from salt exposure in the winter by the row of hedges. We'd have to change our winter road maintenance practices on QQ to prevent brown dead grass every spring. Having to re-sod the ROW every year would get expensive.
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I don't buy that argument. A massive amount of roads in this city have grass along the ROW, and the grass does pretty well through the winter. There are no examples of grass needing to be re-sodded every year here in Toronto. Why would Queens Quay be any different? (Especially considering the fact that the areas that would have sod, wouldn't be near a roadway or pedestrian path/cycle track. There's a buffer between them all.
 
ttk77 said:
In your Oslo example though, it looks like the ROW is protected from salt exposure in the winter by the row of hedges. We'd have to change our winter road maintenance practices on QQ to prevent brown dead grass every spring. Having to re-sod the ROW every year would get expensive.
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The hedges wouldn't be that difficult, would they? There already appears to be some between the ROW and the bike track in places. Norway uses tons of road salt and it's sodium chloride, even more corrosive than most salt used in North America. I'll keep an eye on this particular situation and see how they deal with it.
 
44 North said:
I don't exactly know Noway's climate, but I'd assume Oslo to be a bit more temperate than TO. So cool summers, and cooler (but more stable) winters than ours - with less extremes in each. As well, snowfall and accumulation itself doesn't mean much in terms of an area's temp, and if anything it can actually act as an insulator for grass. And like the comment says above, it's more of a proper ROW with an ample buffer. Here, I'd presume both QQ and MGT to be salted - which I don't think would help any kind of vegetation on the adjacent ROW.
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You're right about the climate and the issue not being snowfall and accumulation as much as the configuration. I actually would have thought the main objection to grass on the ROW in winter would involve plowing.
 
Tuscani01 said:
I don't buy that argument. A massive amount of roads in this city have grass along the ROW, and the grass does pretty well through the winter. There are no examples of grass needing to be re-sodded every year here in Toronto. Why would Queens Quay be any different? (Especially considering the fact that the areas that would have sod, wouldn't be near a roadway or pedestrian path/cycle track. There's a buffer between them all.
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.. And will Queens Quay even need salt ? The road is heated, I saw them put in the heatlines when building the new road. It will be interesting to see how well this works this winter.
 
It is not heated. Ground heaters were used during construction ONLY to heat road briefly in advance of work. This is a common misconception and there is absolutely no indication that any part of the road is in any way heated.
 
Well - I saw them lay serpentine piping and then putting concrete and then asphalt over it. Don't know what else it could be.
 
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