Toronto Ontario Line 3 | ?m | ?s

innsertnamehere said:
Go electrification will probably cost around $8 billion, which leaves enough to get most other big move projects finished provided they fund only the first phase of the DRL.
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Honestly, all they need to fund is the first phase of the DRL - once that's completed, there will be calls for it to be extended, and that's a path of lesser political resistance.

AoD
 
Can someone say what the estimates are for all of the major projects we are talking about? From what I understand, GO is about $8B and the DRL is similarly about $8B. So what is the Ottawa LRT, K-W LRT, Hamilton LRT, Mississauga/Brampton LRT?

Also, what are the chances that the federal government will allocate some money to these projects? The Conservatives have proved that they want to go after suburban votes with their $600M Scarborough pledge. So, they might be interested in trying to grab some votes in Ottawa, Mississauga and K-W (and maybe even all the suburbs by pitching in for the GO electrification) - especially since the austerity hinted at by the provincial Cons seems to have failed miserably? This could free up some money for the DRL or other Toronto LRTs that the feds couldn't care less about. We all know that suburban Toronto will be THE battleground in the next election, so I can only hope some badly needed goodies will be on offer from all the federal parties. Or am I being too optimistic?
 
AlvinofDiaspar said:
Honestly, all they need to fund is the first phase of the DRL - once that's completed, there will be calls for it to be extended, and that's a path of lesser political resistance.

AoD
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I was thinking that, but what about cost overruns, etc. And what about calls for sheppard East (how come Downtown has 3 subways and Scarborough only has 1?!)
 
gweed123 said:
Ottawa LRT Phase II, K-W LRT, and HSR will eat up a fair bit of that other $14B, and the northern highway expansion (including twinning Highway 17) will take up a lot of the rest. There may only be a couple billion left on the table when all of those projects are done.
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Right. While HSR is a very interesting project, it looks a lot like a `we have money, where do we put it` kind of project. Nobody was asking for it except maybe David Collenette (hasn't been politically active in a decade).

Nearly non-highway planned municipally (Kingston LRT, London BRTs?) would probably have taken precedence.
 
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denfromoakvillemilton said:
I was thinking that, but what about cost overruns, etc. And what about calls for sheppard East (how come Downtown has 3 subways and Scarborough only has 1?!)
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Let's not be facetious here - as long as there is a subway extension deep into Scarborough, I think people in general will be happy (and if not, it would only be those immediately along Sheppard who doesn't.) And besides, people in Scarborough will be benefitting from a DRL when they ride downtown with the BD extension - do you think they enjoy suffering at Yonge-Bloor?

rbt said:
Right. While HSR is a very interesting project, it looks a lot like a `we have money, where do we put it` kind of project. Nobody was asking for it except maybe David Collenette (hasn't been politically active in a decade).
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And if HSR gets rolled into a bigger Federally funded HSR project, the accounting would be even more interesting.

AoD
 
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AlvinofDiaspar said:
Let's not be facetious here - as long as there is a subway extension deep into Scarborough, I think people in general will be happy (and if not, it would only be those immediately along Sheppard who doesn't.) And besides, people in Scarborough will be benefitting from a DRL when they ride downtown with the BD extension - do you think they enjoy suffering at Yonge-Bloor?


And if HSR gets rolled into a bigger Federally funded HSR project, the accounting would be even more interesting.

AoD
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I don't think saying it sets a bad precedent is facetious imo. It does. Frankly the stampede needs to be pushed to the Eglinton-Don Mills( I hate typing this out all the time) and Pape, so no I don't think they enjoy suffering at yonge bloor.
 
Everything in transit is a "precedent", what matters at the end of the day is how one manages competing demands. You can't push anything unless you start building the N-S line that allows you to shift transfer locations while adding capacity in any case.

AoD
 
The DRL will likely only be phase one at $3 billion. Outside of the GO electrification I wouldn't be surprised if the province looks for a 30% municipal contribution as well.

Assuming 30% contribution, I'm assuming something similar to this:

GTHA:
$8 billion - GO electrification
$2 billion - DRL (phase 1)
$2 billion - Yonge extension
$800 million - Hamilton LRT
$1.1 billion - Hurontario LRT
$500 million - Queen BRT
$500 million - Dundas BRT
$200 million - Durham BRT

TOTAL : $14.6 billion

Outside of GTHA:

$3 billion - HSR (guesstimate)
$2 billion - Ottawa LRT phase 2
$5 billion : northern highway twinning
$500 million - Kitchener LRT phase 2
$ 500 million - ad2w GO to Niagara
$1 billion - municipal roads and bridges fund
$500 million Kitchener AD2W

$1.5 billion other things (probably mostly MTO highway money)
 
$5 billion for AD2W infrastructure (double tracking and expansion of peak services) an $3 billion for system electrification. Both costs are from Metrolinx documents.
 
rbt said:
Right. While HSR is a very interesting project, it looks a lot like a `we have money, where do we put it` kind of project. Nobody was asking for it except maybe David Collenette (hasn't been politically active in a decade).

Nearly non-highway planned municipally (Kingston LRT, London BRTs?) would probably have taken precedence.
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Actually residents and companies in Waterloo Region have been asking for substantial rail improvements for a long time. HSR is being proposed because the costs would be negligibly higher than bringing it up to, say, 200 km/h, especially compared to the benefits. Current speeds just aren't an option.

Kingston is nowhere near big enough for LRT. It's no bigger than Guelph or Brantford.
 
Kitchener is already going to be the smallest city in NA with LRT.

London BRT is probably a good candidate for funding though.
 
innsertnamehere said:
Kitchener is already going to be the smallest city in NA with LRT.
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Smallest? About 500,000 now ... the same as Edmonton when their LRT opened. Calgary was about 600,000 when it's LRT opened.

I don't see an issue here, given that Kitchener is blessed with a central corridor with several major nodes.
 
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