M II A II R II K
Senior Member
The DRL could perhaps get it's own yard.
Toronto Ontario Line 3 | ?m | ?s
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But the question is where? There are very few points along the line that are either suitable or cost-effective for a yard. That's why I've suggested the DRL take over Greenwood and Bloor-Danforth build a new yard at Honeydale, and perhaps a secondary yard at McCowan (replacing the SRT yard).
denfromoakvillemilton
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Why too far? We always do phase and then phase 2 never gets built.
M II A II R II K
Senior Member
There's also the Keele Yard to make use of.
junctionist
Senior Member
If they build it to the west end, they could build a yard in the Stock Yards area which has a lot of open space.
mrxbombastic
Active Member
Keele Yard (Vincent Yard is the official moniker) is currently being recommissioned to store the displaced T1 trains from the Yonge line which now have the new Toronto Rocket trains. These trains will be put onto the Bloor line as demand warrants it. So unfortunately no DRL capacity at Keele.
Honeydale Yard seems like a tight fit for storage trackage and proper maintenance facilities which would be needed if the fleet is expanded. that said a new yard is definitely needed as the TTC subway fleet inevitably grows. is there any possibility of expanding Wilson Yard north? There seems to be a fairly large swath of land available with a tail track already extending deep into into it.
dunkalunk
Senior Member
The yard location would be more flexible.
Off the top of my head there are a few locations that I'd choose. (links are to Google Maps Loactions)
Flemingdon Park. I'm not sure if it's even possible to build in the Gatineau Hydro Corridor, but it's not like anything else is ever going to be built there.
North Toronto Sewage Treatment Plant. If a Pape-Overlea alignment is chosen, this site would lie directly to the west of the track to the north of the Don River. Again, Nothing else will ever be built here.
Ashbridges Bay Sewage Treatment Plant.. Same as above, although the DRL would need to follow an alignment to bring it to Lakeshore to serve the Port Lands. (which in itself is not a bad thing, I have serious doubts about whether or not it is actually feasible/practical to build under a constrained, active rail corridor.)
Wynford/DVP. I have no idea what this land is/was but it is conveniently at the (if temporarily) at the end of the line. Another Eglinton Crosstown yard/maintenance facility could also be co-located here. Personally though, I'd think that the redevelopment potential of this plot is quite large.
Roncesvalles Carhouse. The function of the carhouse for streetcar operation would need to be located somewhere else (Humber Loop/Ontario Food Terminal would be my choice) but a DRL yard could feasibly be constructed here completely below grade. With the help of Infrastructure Ontario, I could see a PPP in which a developer would attain land rights above the maintenance facility to build a residential development on top of this corner to take advantage of the nearby Roncesvalles Subway and Sunnyside GO station.
Of course, the yard's location would be highly dependant on what technology is chosen for the DRL. TTC Gauge subway vehicles can be located near TTC track provided a wye is able to be constructed somewhere on the Bloor Line. If high-floor catenary vehicles are used, the yard can be located pretty much anywhere along the UP Express line (likely in North Etobicoke)
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Voltz
Senior Member
Isn't CP shutting down their yard at Kipling and Bloor? It could make a good subway yard, but I assume GO might want it as well.
Dan416
Senior Member
Obico? I thought so too. Is it not shut down yet?
All interesting opportunities. The main reason why I suggest Honeydale is because of the redevelopment opportunity that exists, not to mention the possibility of extending the Bloor-Danforth line one stop further west (which would be very low on the priority list otherwise). The area is greatly underused 1950s strip mall land, that if used for a complete redevelopment would be a pretty significant anchor in western Etobicoke. Your Roncesvalles proposal has a similar kind of feel to it (transforming underutilized land).
Of course, if the Obico yard is being closed down, that would make a natural site for a yard too, in which case the Honeydale proposal would be somewhat moot, although the land still could be used for a truly integrated transit terminal.
As for the Honeydale site being small, the yard, transit terminus, and redevelopment would definitely need to be stacked, but I think there would be enough room if the right properties were expropriated. Although it would likely require a realignment of West Mall.
W. K. Lis
Superstar
They could take over the parking lots at the Ontario Science Centre and Celestica business park. And any other parking lots in the area of Don Mills & Eglinton. Put them to some useful use other than real estate storage for motor vehicles.
What I think would be a logical phasing plan for the DRL:
Note that anything in Green or Blue is a very long range plan. What would happen though is from Day 1 along Jane and Don Mills there would be a dedicated lane BRT service (very similar to Vancouver's B-Lines), running along those corridors. They would gradually be replaced as the subway is extended. They would also provide a decent barometer as to whether or not a subway extension is warranted. If, for example, north of Eglinton along Jane the BRT service is only moderately used, then obviously either the subway terminus can stay where it is, or other extension routes can be explored. But if the BRT is bursting at the seams, then a subway extension to replace it may be warranted.
For the Scarborough branch, I've put in a variation on what has been posted before. Rather than having every Bloor-Danforth train end at Victoria Park, I've decided that it would be wise to have every 2nd train run to Kennedy. There are two main reasons for this. The first is so that Bloor-Danforth still has a direct connection with the Kennedy hub and the Eglinton LRT. The 2nd is because there may be termini-related problems with stopping every Bloor-Danforth train at Victoria Park. By running half the trains through, not only do you increase the frequency to Kennedy, but you decrease the pressure on Victoria Park to act as a transfer station/termini.
Note that anything in Green or Blue is a very long range plan. What would happen though is from Day 1 along Jane and Don Mills there would be a dedicated lane BRT service (very similar to Vancouver's B-Lines), running along those corridors. They would gradually be replaced as the subway is extended. They would also provide a decent barometer as to whether or not a subway extension is warranted. If, for example, north of Eglinton along Jane the BRT service is only moderately used, then obviously either the subway terminus can stay where it is, or other extension routes can be explored. But if the BRT is bursting at the seams, then a subway extension to replace it may be warranted.
For the Scarborough branch, I've put in a variation on what has been posted before. Rather than having every Bloor-Danforth train end at Victoria Park, I've decided that it would be wise to have every 2nd train run to Kennedy. There are two main reasons for this. The first is so that Bloor-Danforth still has a direct connection with the Kennedy hub and the Eglinton LRT. The 2nd is because there may be termini-related problems with stopping every Bloor-Danforth train at Victoria Park. By running half the trains through, not only do you increase the frequency to Kennedy, but you decrease the pressure on Victoria Park to act as a transfer station/termini.
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M II A II R II K
Senior Member
So it's a kind of S-Bahn then with a trunk route.
In a sense, yes. Although it uses major arterials for the most part outside of the central section, not the path of least resistance like much of the S-Bahn network uses (which in most cases is rail corridors).
The basic principle behind this design is to get the highest number of N-S subway lines to go through downtown as possible. You have the "inner" YUS U, and then the "outer" Jane-Don Mills U, and then the Scarborough branch.
I should also note that this scheme is intended to work with the GO REX network, not replace it. In fact, in many cases I purposely tried to avoid overlapping with GO REX in order to not duplicate service. The most obvious example of this is the Jane Branch alignment between Bloor and Eglinton. I could have just routed it up the Georgetown corridor, but that would have created an unnecessary duplication in service. By having stations at Dupont & Dufferin, Davenport & Lansdowne, St. Clair West & Caledonia, Weston & Gunns, Weston & Rogers, and finally Mt. Dennis, it serves areas that by and large wouldn't really be served by GO REX. Note that the majority of that alignment also uses the hydro corridor that runs NW-SE through the area.
dunkalunk
Senior Member
I know that Steve Munro likes it, but what exactly is the benefit to tying directly into the Greenwood Yard? Is the yard able to or does it make sense to convert it handle the new Toronto Rocket of trains? There are many places where new yard could be built on public lands not otherwise occupied. Should we even be using the Toronto Rocket trains for the DRL given service flexibility provided if we went with standard gauge? Doing so opens up the CPR West Toronto Yard for TTC use and allows the ARL to be converted to a rapid transit line.