adma
Superstar
Exactly, Einstein.
Solaris
Senior Member
April 14 2009 update
still no work on site yet ~
still no work on site yet ~
barrytron3030
Active Member
plenty work of work done on the o'keefe/hummingbird/sony cent(r)e(r), however. as you can tell, i will soon be running for office.
dt_toronto_geek
Superstar
For what it's worth, it's The Sony Centre for the Performing Arts but I always liked O'Keefe Centre myself. I'll never get over SkyDome being renamed to Rogers Centre being as our tax dollars paid for it and a Canadian came up with the name, but that's old news.
Back O/T, I find it strange that the "L" Tower website still refers to this project as the L Tower and is still using the old render on it's homepage.
Back O/T, I find it strange that the "L" Tower website still refers to this project as the L Tower and is still using the old render on it's homepage.
Granny
Active Member
Whenever I tell out of town people where I'm moving to, I always tell them it will be near the Okeefe/Hummingbird/ Sony Centre. One of those usually clicks with them. More often than not 'Okeefe' registers.
If they still have questioning look on their face, I say "by the the Old Spaghetti Factory". Its so funny how they always know EXACTLY where I am going then.
As for the Ltower still showing the old image, that does not surprise me too much. This project is really starting to to develop a familiar funny smell to it. It's the same smell as.. let me think.. oh yes...
1 Bloor St.
If they still have questioning look on their face, I say "by the the Old Spaghetti Factory". Its so funny how they always know EXACTLY where I am going then.
As for the Ltower still showing the old image, that does not surprise me too much. This project is really starting to to develop a familiar funny smell to it. It's the same smell as.. let me think.. oh yes...
1 Bloor St.
Automation Gallery
Superstar
This project is really starting to to develop a familiar funny smell to it. It's the same smell as.. let me think.. oh yes...
1 Bloor St.
Except this project has been approved by the city, and i believe has the financing in place to back it up. But Granny i know what you mean, im also not to sure since the re-design that this will ever get built.
adma
Superstar
As for the Ltower still showing the old image, that does not surprise me too much. This project is really starting to to develop a familiar funny smell to it. It's the same smell as.. let me think.. oh yes...
1 Bloor St.
If it's the L Tower as in the L Word, that familiar funny smell means it needs a douche.
Of course, some might think they're real douches to commit this indignity to the O'Keefe...
taal
Senior Member
Whenever I tell out of town people where I'm moving to, I always tell them it will be near the Okeefe/Hummingbird/ Sony Centre. One of those usually clicks with them. More often than not 'Okeefe' registers.
If they still have questioning look on their face, I say "by the the Old Spaghetti Factory". Its so funny how they always know EXACTLY where I am going then.
As for the Ltower still showing the old image, that does not surprise me too much. This project is really starting to to develop a familiar funny smell to it. It's the same smell as.. let me think.. oh yes...
1 Bloor St.
I don't think you have much to be concerned about. This is a totally different situation then 1 Bloor East. All of it, in this case, centers around the previously planned AHA! center that didn't work out. It caused all the delays and the redesign. Construction should be starting in the next few months as indicated by a few articles now.
Granny
Active Member
First of all I am going to to make it clear that I would be ecstatic to see this second version tower proceed. I think the odds are reasonably good, but not great.
If it does proceed I suspect a much longer wait is in store for us and much longer than anybody originally anticipated. Keep this in mind. We have that little irritating issue of arranging for resident parking across the street. People can't and will not move into a building that has not got a designated (and paid for) place to put their vehicle. Although the builder is working on it, that issue has not been resolved yet. We will not see construction on the Ltower until there is constuction across the street on The Esplanade at the same time.
I always maintained the first design was an incredibly dramatic piece of design work that would have been an instant Toronto icon. It would have been easily identified as a Toronto landmark in much the same way as the CN Tower or City Hall.
It was a discomfort in the way it balanced off with the Okeefe, but it would have made people look, talk, debate etc., much the same way the Crystal did for the ROM.
This second version shows the tower's design to be basically unchanged, however the lower section now allows the Okeefe to show itself considerably more. It no longer appears overwhelmed and hidden.
The old podium design, not the tower, was the source of debate. It is gone.
If the new LTower gets built, peoples reaction will be almost surely be overwhelmingly complimentary.
The original would have made people stop in their tracks and say "Holy Crap! Will ya get a load of that!"
This city could use a little more of that 'In your face' architecture. That is what we got at Bloor and Avenue Road. That is what we lost at Yonge and Front.
Tewder
Senior Member
Granny, I always thought the 'O'Keefe Centre' was a 'stop and take a look at that' piece of architecture. In the 60's when it was built, though before my time I must confess, it was part of a new and bold 'modernist' wave of development and design that reflected Toronto's post-war ambition and optimism, in the same way as the TD Centre, City Hall and the Eaton's Centre eventually. It was going to be the only major live theatre in town at that time and it opened its doors with the world premiere of Learner & Loewe's Camelot, which was fitting really when you consider the optimism that its imagery represented to the same generation all over North America...
My opposition to the L Tower has always been due to its complete disregard for the importance of this building in its encroaching on it, literally stepping on it. I would have loved the L Tower if built anywhere else and agree that it would have fast become a new Toronto icon on our landscape like OCAD and the ROM Crystal. That said, although I'm glad the building's design has been revised I still don't think it goes far enough, and to its own detriment. Rather than simply starting with fresh eyes from scratch at podium level the new design feels to me like a 'make do with as little change as possible' approach, which never really works effectively in design when you think about it. The old concept is finished, happily for this site as far as I'm concerned, and they should go back to the drawing board with the podium at least and embrace their context beside a famed city landmark, using it fully to their advantage instead of dismissing it. The design for the new building over by the Royal Alex seems to have taken this approach.
What I'd like to see for the L Tower location is a podium that defers to the O'keefe yet connects with it through a public plaza whose art contribution reflects the history of the performing arts centre, and a base and tower design that contrasts in materials with the O'keefe, leaving an 'iconic' design gesture for the upper tower and/or roof pinnacle. There is still landmark potential here but the base is not the place for it, imo.
, it was part of a new and bold 'modernist' wave of development and design that reflected Toronto's post-war ambition and optimism, in the same way as the TD Centre, City Hall and the Eaton's Centre eventually. It was going to be the only major live theatre in town at that time and it opened its doors with the world premiere of Learner & Loewe's Camelot, which was fitting really when you consider the optimism that its imagery represented to the same generation all over North America... My opposition to the L Tower has always been due to its complete disregard for the importance of this building in its encroaching on it, literally stepping on it. I would have loved the L Tower if built anywhere else and agree that it would have fast become a new Toronto icon on our landscape like OCAD and the ROM Crystal. That said, although I'm glad the building's design has been revised I still don't think it goes far enough, and to its own detriment. Rather than simply starting with fresh eyes from scratch at podium level the new design feels to me like a 'make do with as little change as possible' approach, which never really works effectively in design when you think about it. The old concept is finished, happily for this site as far as I'm concerned, and they should go back to the drawing board with the podium at least and embrace their context beside a famed city landmark, using it fully to their advantage instead of dismissing it. The design for the new building over by the Royal Alex seems to have taken this approach.
What I'd like to see for the L Tower location is a podium that defers to the O'keefe yet connects with it through a public plaza whose art contribution reflects the history of the performing arts centre, and a base and tower design that contrasts in materials with the O'keefe, leaving an 'iconic' design gesture for the upper tower and/or roof pinnacle. There is still landmark potential here but the base is not the place for it, imo.
CapitalSeven
Senior Member
I can find barely a word of Tewder's last two paragraphs to agree with. While it's true that compromises aren't always happy, a revised design isn't always inferior. In my opinion the new design actually does a lot of precisely what Tewder says it doesn't do. I find the new collection of angles works nicely with the theatre's old collection.
I'm so tired of people saying that the "boot" was "literally stepping" on the theatre. It was literally beside the theatre in reality, not on top of it. The fact that one could see the theatre and especially the projecting canopy "underneath" the "toe" was what made the perspective interesting. An instant postcard view. From the east side, there would be a whole other view, with the new structure cradling the theatre.
I always thought of the "boot" merrily tapping its toe in time to the music in the theatre, not stomping on it.
I'm so tired of people saying that the "boot" was "literally stepping" on the theatre. It was literally beside the theatre in reality, not on top of it. The fact that one could see the theatre and especially the projecting canopy "underneath" the "toe" was what made the perspective interesting. An instant postcard view. From the east side, there would be a whole other view, with the new structure cradling the theatre.
I always thought of the "boot" merrily tapping its toe in time to the music in the theatre, not stomping on it.
Tewder
Senior Member
Fair enough, but I just find the added angles to be gratuitous, clumsy and cluttered. In the render below I am impressed with how the O'Keefe itself almost seems to form a podium for the tower. For me, an effective design would defer to this, indeed use it. Instead the revision feels like a carbuncle clinging on, imposing itself and vying with the design language of the O'Keefe in a clashing way rather than engaging with it in a contrasting way. I don't know, to each his own!
3Dementia
Senior Member
^That's exactly what is going on after the amputation. And it's accidently working.
I realize purists want the O'Keefe to be left alone in all its architectural splendor but this a theatre/exhibition space that should not be sentenced to die by lethal apathy... no audience is the same as no blood transfusion... just a corpse.
I really think the grafting will be good thing for the bottom-line of O'Keefe/Humming-Sony... the urban drama of L jammed up against the O'Keefe might well generate more interest than a hundred billboards...
I know I'd reconsider the theatre's offerings after daring to have sex with a total stranger nearly 60 storeys tall. There's something very exciting about the future of this site... and exciting isn't a word I would use to describe the present state of the nation.
Tewder
Senior Member
Ultimately the fare on offer will determine the fate of the performing arts centre itself, long term at least. You're right though that this project, if done right, will generate lots of attention for the O'Keefe.
Incidentally, its closure is being felt. Dancap is fighting for theatre space given that the Mirvishes have bought up just about everything else.
Incidentally, its closure is being felt. Dancap is fighting for theatre space given that the Mirvishes have bought up just about everything else.