Toronto Forma | 308m | 84s | Great Gulf | Gehry Partners

[TOareaFan]

This project puts other recently launched or soon to be launched 70+ floor projects in a difficult position by raising the design standard so far.

It will come down to value. If those design standards are over valued by the seller relative to the value the buyer puts on them....then it would be detrimental to sales (ie. if they price 'em to high they ain't gonna sell...no matter who pens the design).

In anticipation......this is not about price/cost...it is about value....a much tougher thing to pin down.

 

[Critique]

Hi,
First post so I thought I should introduce myself... I'm just a architecture enthusiast and have been following UT and other skyscraper forums for a while while never joining as a member so I thought I might as well now.

Anyway here is just part of the interview with the press,
http://www.thestar.com/video/articl...rank-gehry-describe-plan-to-transform-king-st

I think there are two important factors to this project that makes it viable.

1. Gehry is demolishing the Wales theatre which may seem horrendous to many but everyone knows that Toronto is overflowing with theatres, so it isn't like he is demolishing a great treasure. The theatre doesn't even host events regularly so is it better to let it rust so that we can call it a historic artifact in 50 years or to redevelop it into something that could transform the city?

2. As you can see from the posted link, Gehry promises to deliver on the podium and that is what matters on the street level. The models of the podium are very interesting and wacky, which is something unheard of in Toronto. The towers themselves are unique (even though I hope they don't become staggered boxes). If Gehry can deliver on the podium, there is nothing for Torontonians to cry about, because the podium will only liven up the street.

 

[innsertnamehere]

did some measurements of this image from blogTO

Festival tower is 169 pixels high, with the tallest Gehry tower being 287 pixels high. this leaves me with 266m for the tallest building, which seems too short.

 

[Big Daddy]

Agreed, very underwhelming - for an iconic building(s)

The Holt tower will be taller.

 

[gristle]

If you watch the posted video, you will see that, according to Ghery, any images shown are exploratory, and that as a result, he was anticipating criticism.

 

[syn]

If you watch the posted video, you will see that, according to Ghery, any images shown are exploratory, and that as a result, he was anticipating criticism.

That's important to note - the design could change quite a bit.

 

[Mongo]

BlogTO's take:

http://www.blogto.com/arts/2012/10/gehry_and_mirvish_project_officially_unveiled_in_toronto/

They actually took some pics of the plans and elevations; but alas, too far away to see what the stacking for the podium will be like (other than guesses - retail on the first 2-3 floors)

AoD

Elevation photo:

From this the following are clearly visible:

Western block:
1-3 : 2-times-average height podium floors

Western tower:
4-6 : 1.5-times-average height podium floors
7-9 : 1.5-times-average height mezzanine/mechanical floors
10-49 : average height residential floors
50 : 1.5-times-average height skylobby/mechanical floor
51-77 : average height residential floors
78-84 : greater-than-average height residential (penthouse?) floors
85-86 : mechanical floors

Central tower
4-5 : 2.25-times-average height podium floors
6-8 : 1.5-times-average height mezzanine/mechanical floors
9-56 : average height residential floors
57 : 1.5-times-average height skylobby/mechanical floor
58-69 : average height residential floors
70-85 : greater-than-average height residential (penthouse?) floors
86 : mechanical floor

Eastern block and tower
1-4 : 2-times-average height podium floors
5-6 : 1.5-times-average height podium floors
7-9 : 1.5-times-average height mezzanine/mechanical floors
10-56 : average height residential floors
57 : 1.5-times-average height skylobby/mechanical floor
58-70 : average height residential floors
71-82 : greater-than-average height residential (penthouse?) floors
83-84 : mechanical floors

There is writing at the sides of the buildings at the top of the residential section, which is unfortunately too blurry to read.

 

[interchange42]

The thread title has been updated to reflect the latest info we have, that includes the working title of the project of course, developer, and a revision to the number of storeys in each tower.

The previous count of storeys was based on the number of floors in the wire-frame models from the promotional video. The new count is from the cross section posted above by innsertnamehere. (We took a shot of that ourselves and have a slightly larger version to work with!)

I think it's too early for everyone to get too hung up on exactly how high, how many storeys, each of these towers is going to have. This is so far beyond what is going into the area now that it is very difficult to predict how city planning and city council are going to react. Gehry also stressed that the designs are in flux still, as did Peter Kofman of ProjectCore.

The dataBase entry has been made live, but it is rather preliminary at the moment. Meanwhile, we have lots more to tell you and show you of course that will be end up on the front page. We're in for the long-haul on this, of course! (See you tomorrow on page 30?)

42

 

[Mongo]

Festival tower is 169 pixels high, with the tallest Gehry tower being 287 pixels high. this leaves me with 266m for the tallest building, which seems too short.

That is almost exactly in line with my results from a previous image for the western building. However, the perspective effects will cause the upper floors to appear to be shorter than they actually are, so I would bump the height up to around 270m or a bit more.

 

[canmark]

Anyway here is just part of the interview with the press,
http://www.thestar.com/video/articl...rank-gehry-describe-plan-to-transform-king-st

In the video from the press conference, David Mirvish says that he is building "scupltures" that people will have the honour of living in, and compares Geary's structures to Gaudi's Casa Mila (La Pedrera), which was controversial at its time. Gaudi's architecture is, of course, very sculptural, organic and bizarre, but Gerhy is also sculptural and bizarre.

While certainly Toronto will never be confused with Barcelona, still it is nice to think that someday our city will be populated with striking architecture that will be marvelled at generations from now (as is Barcelona). Whether they may be the Mirvish/Gehry buildings, or the ROM Crystal, or City Hall, or L Tower, or the Sharp Centre at OCAD, or the TD Centre, or some other yet-unbuilt structure, you have to give Mirvish props for trying. Cause lets face it, who else is trying to create a legacy building in TO?

National Post: Frank Gehry thinks Toronto’s architecture is ‘mostly banal,’ but don’t worry, every city is like that

Q: Why do you think your designs, which are certainly a deviation from the norm, tend to generate opposition at the outset?

Gehry: People don’t understand what we’re doing, and then when they see it finished, they say “oh, I didn’t know.” I get that all the time. The buildings, we’ve had a good track record. They bring value, like [Millenium] Park has brought a lot of value to Chicago. The [Walt Disney Concert Hall in Los Angeles], the orchestra’s been running in the black because of the building, they tell me. And [the Guggenheim Museum Bilbao]’s revenue to the city has been great. I think architecture, there’s a yearning, there’s a thirst for it. Once they see it, the presumption is it’s too expensive and it’s somebody’s ego trip, and you’ve got to get over those two things… The architecture critics have to demand it and say, “we want better and we know you can do better,” and show the examples of where it’s done better.

Q: What city do you think Toronto could look to as an example of where it is done better?

Gehry: Early Chicago. Now it’s getting trashed a bit but pretty much it’s the best architectural city in the western hemisphere, I think.

 

[innsertnamehere]

looking at all those double height floors want me to say this will be 290m though..

 

[syn]

It looks like at least one of the buildings slated for demoliton has a hertiage designation from Toronto - would that mean it has to be integrated somehow?

 

[Joe R.]

Brad Lamb has got to be pissed about the shadows and lost views he'll have from his penthouse at Theatre Park.

 

[Mongo]

looking at all those double height floors want me to say this will be 290m though..

You would think so, but even allowing for all the extra-height floors, the "average" floor-to-floor height if this building were 270m in height would still be 2.95m, which is a very typical height in Toronto. So I do think that the current design (which is not necessarily the final design) has the west and central towers around 270-275 metres in total height, and the east tower around 260m.

 

[bgobgo]

Has anyone seen or read a good explanation about what exactly the inspiration is for the exterior of the podium(s)? I've read every news article from all the major papers today and besides being evocative of "old Toronto" I don't have a clear idea what the podium is evocative of exactly?? I see lots of white strips. Is that suppose to represent snow somehow and our Canadian winters?