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Toronto Crosstown LRT | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx | Arcadis

ehlow said:
The ttc is run and paid for by the city of Toronto. Pickering is not in Toronto
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This thread is on Eglinton-Crosstown. The City of Toronto's contribution to Eglinton-Crosstown costs is precisely $0. It's contribution to the Scarborough subway is higher, but only because the City decided that a funded solution - to which its contribution would also be $0 - was not good enough.

The TTC's operational costs are borne exclusively by the City (a problem in itself), but expansion costs are not.

We are not going to solve our transportation problems with parochial thinking.

As for the suggestion that Pickering is not being served, beyond GO train service and ongoing expansion (15 minute service within 10 years), Metrolinx's planned Durham BRT (not designed but presumably separated like VIVANext) will connect directly to the Scarborough subway expansion.
 
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DavidH said:
This thread is on Eglinton-Crosstown. The City of Toronto's contribution to Eglinton-Crosstown costs is precisely $0. It's contribution to the Scarborough subway is higher, but only because the City decided that a funded solution - to which its contribution would also be $0 - was not good enough.

The TTC's operational costs are borne exclusively by the City (a problem in itself), but expansion costs are not.

We are not going to solve our transportation problems with parochial thinking.

As for the suggestion that Pickering is not being served, beyond GO train service and ongoing expansion (15 minute service within 10 years), Metrolinx's planned Durham BRT (not designed but presumably separated like VIVANext) will connect directly to the Scarborough subway expansion.
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So because the Eglinton Crosstown is paid by the province, the TTC should have to serve Mississauga, York Region, Pickering, the rest of the GTA? The rest of Ontario?

As you said, the operational costs are paid 100% by Toronto taxpayers, and decisions are ultimately made by Toronto Council, who are elected by those who live in Toronto only.

Both costs and decisions are City of Toronto only. Toronto is it's own city with it's own government and transit system. Pickering or other surrounding cities have no vote or say in the TTC, don't pay for operating costs at all.
 
Speaking as a Pickering resident, we're frankly quite happy with our GO service - couple that with improvements to 15 min service and most of us will be happy as clams.

Now, I do recognize that a severe lack of transit options exists for commuters from Durham Region wishing to travel to places other than downtown Toronto via Union Station (I barely count the 92 GO bus, which crawls with the rest of traffic along Highway 2 and then Highway 401). The Durham BRT as above-mentioned will be a step in the right direction here, as it will connect Durham in a series of bus-only lanes along Highway 2 to UofT Scarborough. Long-term plans include the extension of the BRT westward to STC, which in my opinion is the real solution to linking us easterners to the TTC network, but there are a number of jurisdictional and legal issues which stand in the way of such an extension.

Even longer-term plans include the conversion of the Durham BRT into a continuous Highway 2 LRT, which would serve to improve the speed of the connection and (hopefully) help catalyze some urbanism in this most suburban of GTA municipalities.
 
TheTigerMaster said:
No offence, but I seriously doubt that most people in Toronto even know where Pickering is. People really don't care.
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Personally I do care about all areas of Toronto and the GTA, and I wish that everyone would get the best possible transit in their neighbourhoods. However it's not the TTC's responsibility to improve travel to and from Pickering. That's what Metrolinx is for.
 
Paolo said:
why does everything have 2 stop at the scarborough/pickering townline? do these clowns not know that people in pickering have to drive WEST to mccowan stn or stc, and if their lucky to find parking and then take the ttc down town to where they work? if they maybe made the ttc even going as far to port union that would be better than nothing, lots of land there to make a parking. it moves people out of the city faster, the ppl in suburbs also take transit not just ppl in toronno
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Isn't RT to Morningside/Kingston or UTSC close enough? You're practically at the Pickering border beyond that point. With the Ellesmere BRT meeting RT at UTSC, Durham would have great transit access.
 
Paolo said:
why does everything have 2 stop at the scarborough/pickering townline? do these clowns not know that people in pickering have to drive WEST to mccowan stn or stc, and if their lucky to find parking and then take the ttc down town to where they work? if they maybe made the ttc even going as far to port union that would be better than nothing, lots of land there to make a parking. it moves people out of the city faster, the ppl in suburbs also take transit not just ppl in toronno
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depute at the next Metrolinx meeting. Any rapid transit line extended into Pickering will be a matter for them, not Toronto/TTC. Even if it were not, Toronto taxpayers will not be happy to be left holding the bag for costs on such a project as we did the operating deficits on the Sorbara Extension into Vaughan.
 
Why would anyone want the Eglinton LRT extended to Pickering? To be useful it would have to at least Liverpool and Kingston, near the existing GO station. That's another 19 km past Kennedy! Or 30 km to Yonge.

Surely the express buses from Pickering or GO Trains would be much, much, faster. Wouldn't Pickering residents who do want to go to points on Eglinton East be better served by simply extending the Eglinton line 2.5 km to the Eglinton GO station near Eglinton and Bellamy?
 
Exactly. Pickering is far away, further than most realize. Durham in general is well served already with the GO line, though its local transit is probably the worst in the GTA.
 
innsertnamehere said:
Exactly. Pickering is far away, further than most realize. Durham in general is well served already with the GO line, though its local transit is probably the worst in the GTA.
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Having attempted to genuinely use Durham Region Transit to get places around town I can agree with that statement. The buses all run at around 30 min frequencies (except maybe during rush hour when they're 20 min) and follow an annoying tendency to loop through multiple residential side streets rather than nearly any of them follow a main road. Ugh.

As far as it goes that we Pickeringites (?) want any sort of transit access other than the GO line, I hate to break it but we're not looking for Eglinton East. We're looking for faster access to jobs in North York, and above that even YORK REGION, where hundreds of Durham Residents work and have no choice but driving to get to. GO really needs to have a serious overhaul and re-think of the 407 bus services once the 407 East opens. No more meandering through Scarborough, and no more skipping certain GO Stations in Durham Region. For me to travel from Pickering to Unionville GO Stations as I did during the Markham Jazz Festival, I had to use the GO train to backtrack all the way to Oshawa before taking the 407 bus since the infrequent branch which does reach Pickering mindlessly skips Unionville in favour of Richmond Hill Centre. The other choice would've been GO train to Union and then Stouffville bus up to Unionville.

I know also that a sizeable chunk of Durham Region residents work in Mississauga, but AD2W GO on the Milton and Kitchener lines (preferably with a Hurontario LRT) would hopefully provide a better connection in those directions.

Now that's all a little bit off topic. Closer to topic, I would also like to say that I do support an Eglinton LRT extension at least to Eglinton/Kingston, and preferably up Kingston to Morningside or Guildwood GO.
 
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Can I ask a question? I'm not from Toronto and my experience with the city is pretty low (I'm an onlooker from Kingston). Why is Durham so low profile in Toronto? People seem to always talk about Mississauga, Vaughan, Richmond Hill, etc. but nobody really talks about Pickering or Ajax. On this forum, people debate about whether the subway extensions to Vaughan or Richmond Hill are worth it (some like the idea, some against) and some people talk/fantasize about subways to Mississauga... but the idea of a subway to Pickering would just make people laugh, even though Pickering is really the same as Vaughan or Miss... it's a municipality immediately adjacent to Toronto.

I'm not trying to criticize or judge, I'm just genuinely curious about this.
 
The reason why Pickering, ajax and whitby are so low profile in Toronto is that Durham regions cities are generally very small in comparison to Mississauga Vaughan and Richmond hill plus there are very few jobs in Durham region in comparison to other cities in the region also those 3 cities that you named are all relatively close to subway lines so it simply makes a hell of alot more sense to extend them into neighboring cities that are pretty close to them anyways
 
1overcosc said:
Can I ask a question? I'm not from Toronto and my experience with the city is pretty low (I'm an onlooker from Kingston). Why is Durham so low profile in Toronto? People seem to always talk about Mississauga, Vaughan, Richmond Hill, etc. but nobody really talks about Pickering or Ajax. On this forum, people debate about whether the subway extensions to Vaughan or Richmond Hill are worth it (some like the idea, some against) and some people talk/fantasize about subways to Mississauga... but the idea of a subway to Pickering would just make people laugh, even though Pickering is really the same as Vaughan or Miss... it's a municipality immediately adjacent to Toronto.

I'm not trying to criticize or judge, I'm just genuinely curious about this.
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The reason is population. Durham region has about 600,000 people, which isn't much bigger than Halton region (a bit more than 500,000 people). In comparison, York Region has a little over a million. Peel Region is about 1.3 million.

If you look at the density statistics for the four regions;

Durham is at about 241 / km2
Halton is at 540 / km2
York is at 506 / km2
Peel is 1040 / km2
Toronto 4149 / km2

It seems simple why people laugh at the idea of a subway to Durham. It is kind of ludicrous.
 
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Also, traditionally Durham region is focused around Oshawa, the same way the Hamilton CMA is focused around Hamilton the city. Peel, Halton and York region are more centered around Toronto.
 
And for the record, I think an Eglinton Crosstown link to Eglinton GO Station would be a good idea for riders from Durham.
 
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