caltrane74
Senior Member
Another picture from this weekend.
Toronto Aura at College Park | 271.87m | 78s | Canderel | Graziani + Corazza
khris
Senior Member
You answered your own question. Boring Canadian suburban chains. And wtf is with the anti-suburban thing? It makes no sense. As if only people who live in suburbs want to shop at Bed Bath and Beyond. People are moving downtown from the suburbs in droves, and they want to be able to shop. It benefits everyone to have these shops downtown.
Not everywhere in Toronto can be hipster Queen St. West. Ugh.
Traynor
Senior Member
HOWEVER... Kristopher, I think you are misunderstanding the implications of people's disdain for suburban-ism. They don't bemoan the convenience of Bog Box stores, they only feel they need to be sensitive to the kind of retail that is in the area.
There is no need, with a complex like Aura and its vast podium, to situate a Costco-sized store on the ground floor where all the pedestrian traffic is. Something larger could be placed on the second and third floors while reserving the ground floor and Yonge and Gerrard frontages for smaller retailers, offering interest and variety for passers-by.
Suburban Big-Box malls, don't need to be pedestrian friendly (Read: window-shopper friendly) they are designed to be driven to. Those giant stores don't even have windows with window displays. There's no need for it. They only need a giant colourful sign that's high enough to be seen from parking section Double H three acres away.
By putting a Bed Bath & Beyond on the ground floor of Aura right on Yonge Street, you are potentially asking for a block-killing stretch of street frontage, analogous with the Hudson's Bay concrete bunker on Bloor. To keep street-life you have to keep pedestrians interested and that requires adherence to the 20 foot rule: A different store, restaurant or business every 20 or 30 feet.
A tourist attraction like Yonge Street needs to keep pedestrians' interest. It doesn't need to turn its back on them like the Eaton Centre did back in the 70's. [The refresh of the Yonge Street facade of the Eaton Center (with its store entrances added) helped to mitigate the dead-space the original design had caused, but it's still not perfect.] Tourists walk, they don't drive everywhere and they shop for small stuff like clothes and jewellery. They rarely buy linens or towels or lamps or furniture. They want funky cool Can only be found in Toronto merchandise.
As a person who has lived downtown my whole adult life and chooses not to own a car, I have always dreamed of an IKEA or The Brick at College Park, but not if it had to be on the ground floor. That would kill the street. I would rather if Sears would give up the space of the top few floors of the old Eaton Store at the Eaton Centre (I believe they are vacant) and turn that into a Futureshop, Bed Bath & Beyond or any other Big-Box store I have coveted over the years.
There is no need, with a complex like Aura and its vast podium, to situate a Costco-sized store on the ground floor where all the pedestrian traffic is. Something larger could be placed on the second and third floors while reserving the ground floor and Yonge and Gerrard frontages for smaller retailers, offering interest and variety for passers-by.
Suburban Big-Box malls, don't need to be pedestrian friendly (Read: window-shopper friendly) they are designed to be driven to. Those giant stores don't even have windows with window displays. There's no need for it. They only need a giant colourful sign that's high enough to be seen from parking section Double H three acres away.
By putting a Bed Bath & Beyond on the ground floor of Aura right on Yonge Street, you are potentially asking for a block-killing stretch of street frontage, analogous with the Hudson's Bay concrete bunker on Bloor. To keep street-life you have to keep pedestrians interested and that requires adherence to the 20 foot rule: A different store, restaurant or business every 20 or 30 feet.
A tourist attraction like Yonge Street needs to keep pedestrians' interest. It doesn't need to turn its back on them like the Eaton Centre did back in the 70's. [The refresh of the Yonge Street facade of the Eaton Center (with its store entrances added) helped to mitigate the dead-space the original design had caused, but it's still not perfect.] Tourists walk, they don't drive everywhere and they shop for small stuff like clothes and jewellery. They rarely buy linens or towels or lamps or furniture. They want funky cool Can only be found in Toronto merchandise.
As a person who has lived downtown my whole adult life and chooses not to own a car, I have always dreamed of an IKEA or The Brick at College Park, but not if it had to be on the ground floor. That would kill the street. I would rather if Sears would give up the space of the top few floors of the old Eaton Store at the Eaton Centre (I believe they are vacant) and turn that into a Futureshop, Bed Bath & Beyond or any other Big-Box store I have coveted over the years.
arvelomcquaig
Active Member
It's not about “hipster Queen St. West,” it's about human-scale, locally-owned, locally-unique, interesting, pedestrian-friendly retail. It doesn't have to be hip or exclusive. Bloor west of Bathurst, for instance, or Davenport west of Ossington, consist of this kind of smaller-scale retail, without the “hipster” factor that you deride.
The “anti-suburban thing” comes from the fact that suburban planning makes for more alienating, less sustainable communities, so we should try to make Toronto denser and the retail more in the style that is associated with “downtowns.” Yes, downtown people will shop at these bigger international stores, too, but that doesn't mean it's more constructive for the city to have such stores.
And suburban people who have moved downtown do not need giant American chain stores to survive. They can shop at smaller stores, too.
The “anti-suburban thing” comes from the fact that suburban planning makes for more alienating, less sustainable communities, so we should try to make Toronto denser and the retail more in the style that is associated with “downtowns.” Yes, downtown people will shop at these bigger international stores, too, but that doesn't mean it's more constructive for the city to have such stores.
And suburban people who have moved downtown do not need giant American chain stores to survive. They can shop at smaller stores, too.
KA1
Senior Member
A few things, guys.
Bed, Bath and Beyond will be on the 2nd floor and not the main floor. I have pasted a link to the announcement by Canderel about lease signing. When you click on the link, please click on November 11, 2008 press release by Canderel.
http://collegeparkcondos.com/pages/media.html
As regards small boutique stores, they are supposed to be going in the basement level condo units. Once again, I have pasted a link. When you click on the link, click on 'retail' on the right had side. You will get an idea of the type of stores Canderel hopes to be there. I hope the stores will attact the kind of 'babes' shown in the video. If so, I could spend all my spare time, and later, my retirement years, watching these babes go by.
http://collegeparkcondos.com/pages/media.html
KA1
Senior Member
So far, Canderel has not announced the tennant(s) for the first floor.
Do you guys think it will be a good idea to lease the entire 1st floor to a 'local' business -- that is, Zanzibar?
Do you guys think it will be a good idea to lease the entire 1st floor to a 'local' business -- that is, Zanzibar?
cruzin4u
Senior Member
Aura mish mash of photos.
Taken from Bay St.
Walking South on Yonge St.
Northern portion of Aura.
Looking at Aura from the South towards the South West (did that make sense?)
From Bay St.
Taken from Bay St.
Walking South on Yonge St.
Northern portion of Aura.
Looking at Aura from the South towards the South West (did that make sense?)
From Bay St.
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BrianSolo
UT Member
CanadianNational
Senior Member
Har! Throw in Sam's, The Imperial Six, Lick's, World Of Jeans, The Downtown, The Superior and the Colonial Tavern, and you'd have a potent podium indeed.
Tewder
Senior Member
.. Yes! Plus ca change...
dt_toronto_geek
Superstar
Yesssss, and throw in the Cinema 2000 with a thin, crooked stairwell leading to under-lit, moldy smelling, mini adult cinemas in the level below!
Seriously, the discussion above is very valid. I have had spiritual experiences in Bed, Bath and Beyond so I'm thrilled it's coming to College Park but when it was first suggested that it would take up the Yonge Street frontage I was angry as hell, glad it's not. As Traynor explains so well, a single retailer along Yonge Street would be a block killer, as I alluded to several pages back. I think Canderel is handling this well, my only concern now is the quality of materials that will be used here.
KA1
Senior Member
A few words to stir up the discussions further.
BMO is also moving in the podium. It has not been announced as to which floor BMO will be occupying. Being a bank, I presume they would want to be on the ground level.
Tulse
Senior Member
Tewder
Senior Member
Would it? There are massive flag-ship stores all along 5th Ave. in NYC or Michigan Ave. in Chicago. Heck, even a few along Bloor Street. I'm not sure that they destroy the urban retail environment quite to the degree as suggested, although Traynor's point is well taken. This may provide a different retail/urban experience than the one experienced along Queen West say or along certain stretches of Yonge Street but this is not necessarily a bad thing if the street-level windows or displays are interesting... and in fact the larger stores can become anchors that draw and support smaller ones.
Ramako
Moderator
Big-box retail can work downtown. While there have been poor attempts (e.g. Best Buy and the Canadian Tire at Bay & Dundas) there have also been many successful attempts both here and in other cities, as Tewder pointed out. If done well, they can really bring a "big city" feel to the downtown core. Hell, Times Square is almost nothing but big-box retail and chain restaurants.
That being said, remember that this new retail will be replacing a parking lot, and not older establishd retail. No matter what, it will be an improvment over what was there, and will likely spill customers into nearby retail. Rather than be a "block killer" I expect this development to spur higher-end retail along Yonge. I'm all for grit, but the shops on this stretch of Yonge are just plain crummy.
That being said, remember that this new retail will be replacing a parking lot, and not older establishd retail. No matter what, it will be an improvment over what was there, and will likely spill customers into nearby retail. Rather than be a "block killer" I expect this development to spur higher-end retail along Yonge. I'm all for grit, but the shops on this stretch of Yonge are just plain crummy.