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Rob Ford's Toronto

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RC8 said:
The real problem is that the Argos have an awful average attendance of around ~20,000 and play only 8(!) home games a year. That on a year when they win the damn thing!

A terrible team like TFC on the other hand plays something like 20-25 home games any given season with an average attendance of ~20,000 people while finishing at the bottom of the table.

If the Argos were such an important institution to Torontonians, they would be filling up the stadium 8 times a year and wouldn't risk being evicted by Rogers.

That said, I favour letting them continue to use the skydome even if it means the absence of real grass.
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A lot of Argo fans hate the sight-lines for football in the dome, or hate the dome itself. Another issue is scheduling. Rogers claims it requires 36 hours to switch from one configuration to the other. After baseball and other events are factored in, Rogers gives the Argos the choice of only 12-15 dates to schedule 10 games. The Argos couldn't find a date for this year's pre-season game because of baseball one week and concerts the next, and there are two Tuesday games on this year's schedule. Most suburban fans want weekend games. The Argos also make no money from suites, concessions or parking in the dome, so the team might end up pursuing a new stadium whether or not they get evicted.

I don't know what they're announcing but there's no way TFC is averaging anything close to 20K this year. And the main difference between the two teams can be found in TV ratings. Even in a down season, the Argos completely obliterate TFC in that department.

sixrings said:
In the Olympic bid scenario the government would build the stadium in partnership with whomever would take it over for the nfl franchise. So if the stadium cost 900 million to make the government would pay about 1/3rd and the nfl team the other 2/3rds. The government sells it as a way to get part of the stadium paid for so they aren't really out the entire stadium. If you think that a nfl stadium is going to be built in Toronto without government help then you are simply wrong. Almost every stadium in this day and age gets a government kick in of some sort.
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And exactly who would that be? Remember that the NFL explicitly prohibits corporate ownership so it would have to be an individual. A team on top of that would cost that individual at least another billion. Not to mention that the Bills own NFL territorial rights to Toronto, so unless there's a plan in place for them to permanently move here, the Bills will never allow another team to move here. So I call bullsh;t unless I see this white knight reveal himself.

The Leafs got zero public funding for the ACC, and after the Skydome fiasco and the recent farce of BMO starting its life as a multi-purpose facility and ending up as a soccer-specific stadium, I can't see the municipal, provincial or federal government giving a dime to the richest pro sports league on the planet, especially if you're talking about a team that does not and may never exist.
 
hawc said:
So Ford has basically totally survived the crack video scandal and if the Scarborough subway goes ahea is totally going to get re-elected. I love it.
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You love the fact he isn't being held accountable for his actions and lies and that he is wasting money to buy votes?
 
If Ford wanted to whip up his base with the promise of sports facilities, it's baffling that he didn't get behind that plan to convert the Hearn into ice pads. It would have been win-win-win for him. The sports facilities would appeal to his base, the building reuse would appeal to preservationists and he would have been able to lay claim to a superior plan compared to the 'stacked rinks' proposed by his opponents. It also could have been used as a wedge to further speed up development in that area. Best of all, it would have been a great place to get drunk & high and yell at the other spectators.
 
GenerationW said:
A lot of Argo fans hate the sight-lines for football in the dome, or hate the dome itself. Another issue is scheduling. Rogers claims it requires 36 hours to switch from one configuration to the other. After baseball and other events are factored in, Rogers gives the Argos the choice of only 12-15 dates to schedule 10 games. The Argos couldn't find a date for this year's pre-season game because of baseball one week and concerts the next, and there are two Tuesday games on this year's schedule. Most suburban fans want weekend games. The Argos also make no money from suites, concessions or parking in the dome, so the team might end up pursuing a new stadium whether or not they get evicted.
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If they were an even remotely popular team they wouldn't have an issue getting better accomodations at the Skydome.

I don't know what they're announcing but there's no way TFC is averaging anything close to 20K this year. And the main difference between the two teams can be found in TV ratings. Even in a down season, the Argos completely obliterate TFC in that department.
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This year it is understandably lower. But they've averaged close to 20,000 every year since their inception (and they've been atrocious year after year). Bear in mind this is while playing over 3 times as many home games as the argos. If TFC played only 8 games a year at the skydome I'm confident attendances would be very impressive.

Jays attendances are up there even though they play god knows how many home games a season.

Maybe a move to the suburbs would help (argos certainly don't have many downtown fans), but it may also prove to be the kiss of death for a team that hugely benefits from its skydome visibility. I know many people who don't even know the argos exist and who are unaware of what the CFL is. Can't say the same for TFC, Jays, or Maple Leafs, or Raptors.
 
TFC is behind the Argos only because of TV ratings. Argos get great TV ratings. At least since the TSN, contract. But the CFL is gate driven, so the TV ratings mean almost nothing. Just like the NHL. TFC has bad TV ratings, so they are last.


Ford also wanted an NFL team at some point, so why we are talking about this I have no idea.
 
hawc said:
So Ford has basically totally survived the crack video scandal and if the Scarborough subway goes ahea is totally going to get re-elected. I love it.
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Still too soon to say. Ford primarily does well when he doesn't do anything and lets his staff take care of business. The Scarborough subway is dependent on Federal funding, and if none of that shows up by September (2 months from now), we'll go back to the LRT plan.

Remember, the subway is contingent with:
1) the federal government contributing new money with which to pay half the capital costs;
2) the province putting in $1.8-billion;
3) funding not being re-allocated from the Eglinton, Finch and Sheppard LRT projects; and
4) funding not being redirected from any current City services.

Still holding out hopes that a better moderate conservative candidate shows up for the 2014 election.
 
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hawc said:
So Ford has basically totally survived the crack video scandal and if the Scarborough subway goes ahea is totally going to get re-elected. I love it.
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You could look at it that way. Or you could look at it this way:

- August 2nd his only sane ally in city council (Doug Holyday) will probably have made a run for the hills based on latest polling.
- Sometime in September when Fed money fails to materialize for the subway and we go back to the LRT plan Rob Ford will again look like the ineffective dummy that he is
- Sometime in October we will likely be viewing material from a drug dealer's phone with Rob Ford on it

In other words, enjoy the rest of your summer :)
 
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bobbob911 said:
You could look at it that way. Or you could look at it this way:

- Sometime in September/October we will likely be viewing material from a drug dealer's phone with Rob Ford on it
- Sometime in September when Fed money fails to materialize for the subway and we go back to the LRT plan Rob Ford will again look like the ineffective dummy that he is
- August 2nd his only sane ally in city council (Doug Holyday) will probably have made a run for the hills based on latest polling.

In other words, enjoy the rest of your summer :)
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I prefer 'your' way ;). The train wreck that is Rob Ford needs to come to an end.
 
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adma said:
Originally Posted by dt_toronto_geek
On the Queen car this afternoon (re-routed between Church & Spadina, I wish I had have known) two younger, twenty-something hipster dudes behind me were talking, it went like this (not a joke): Hipster dude #1 - "Katherine and I were over at the old Maple Leaf Gardens last week, do you know that Rob Ford turned that into a shopping mall"? Hipster dude #2 - "He's such a [expletives here]". So much for smart "downtown elites" that Fraud Nation likes to believe populates the downtown.
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Though at least unlike Fraud Nation, they aren't being egged on by the anti-Frauds on Council, etc...
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Actually, this is worth reflecting on. As I see it, generally speaking, all but the most kneejerk anarcho-syndicalist "anti-Ford left" is the sort to correct/clarify such ill-informed opinion. After all, they don't want their stance or cause compromised by casual ignorance.

Whereas when it comes to the opposite number (i.e. in the epithets, substitute "David Miller" for "Rob Ford", etc), the "pro-Ford right" is more likely to revel in such casual opinionating, however ill-founded. Correct? Clarify? That's being pedantic. Respect For Taxpayers, dude...
 
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