nfitz
Superstar
Fair enough. Such evil bigots shouldn't be allowed to even speak in public, let alone run for office. Perhaps we should round them up and put them in these new Conservative superjails.
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Rob Ford - Why the Supervillian?
- Thread starter T-Bor
- Start date
kool maudit
Active Member
this guy doesn't seem like someone who would come out of toronto. he's just one of these red-faced, drunk-uncley oafs, isn't he?
tkip
Active Member
And last on this subject. Belief in traditional marraige isn't about hating gays. Yet those that believe are treated with contempt. And people should be able to express this without ridiculed by others as being backwards.
Helen Kennedy attacked Ford' personal belief in something that was contrary to her own. But she's hardly alone on this type of behaviour and attacks. I do think the new conservative eagerness to build more jails in a time of declining crime rates doesn't make sense but I digress.
According to her and others likeminded, he was unfit to be mayor because of it while ignoring that half the population holds this view. That people are entitled to their beliefs at home and in public and refused to acknowledge that you can hold a different opinion on a subect. She disregarded the views of others while insisting that somone running this city must respect the views of everyone from all walks of life.
And she doesn't even hold up to her own rhetoric when she's being so dismissive of others. The real problem here is that people with conservative views are vilified and treated like pariahs. As soon as someone mentions anything that is considered conservative in tone, there's this backlash to try and silence them.
I've been in this city my entire life. Raised by a single mother without a father around and it impacted us. So I'm a little biased on this topic. I've lived in neighborhoods where the kids run rampant when a parent is removed from the home or fathers are absent. So I'm not a fan of the single parent model either but this too provokes scorn for suggesting that single parent homes aren't the ideal enviroment for children.
With same sex parrents something is missing. We just engineered out of the picture, the other gender. Intentionally. That's my beef. Not any personal dislike for gays. And a host of others share this thinking.
We have study after study showing that both genders are so important to the developement of children but it's being dismissed. We're also ignoring history. Human societies didn't all arrive at the mother/father family unit by accident. Now, somehow the other gender doesn't play a role anymore. We have entire communities where when you tinker with the basic family unit, things don't go as planned.
I know people on this forum hate this thinking but a great many of us still think that children need both genders to be present and we face this tsunami of scorn for suggesting this.
Helen Kennedy attacked Ford' personal belief in something that was contrary to her own. But she's hardly alone on this type of behaviour and attacks. I do think the new conservative eagerness to build more jails in a time of declining crime rates doesn't make sense but I digress.
According to her and others likeminded, he was unfit to be mayor because of it while ignoring that half the population holds this view. That people are entitled to their beliefs at home and in public and refused to acknowledge that you can hold a different opinion on a subect. She disregarded the views of others while insisting that somone running this city must respect the views of everyone from all walks of life.
And she doesn't even hold up to her own rhetoric when she's being so dismissive of others. The real problem here is that people with conservative views are vilified and treated like pariahs. As soon as someone mentions anything that is considered conservative in tone, there's this backlash to try and silence them.
I've been in this city my entire life. Raised by a single mother without a father around and it impacted us. So I'm a little biased on this topic. I've lived in neighborhoods where the kids run rampant when a parent is removed from the home or fathers are absent. So I'm not a fan of the single parent model either but this too provokes scorn for suggesting that single parent homes aren't the ideal enviroment for children.
With same sex parrents something is missing. We just engineered out of the picture, the other gender. Intentionally. That's my beef. Not any personal dislike for gays. And a host of others share this thinking.
We have study after study showing that both genders are so important to the developement of children but it's being dismissed. We're also ignoring history. Human societies didn't all arrive at the mother/father family unit by accident. Now, somehow the other gender doesn't play a role anymore. We have entire communities where when you tinker with the basic family unit, things don't go as planned.
I know people on this forum hate this thinking but a great many of us still think that children need both genders to be present and we face this tsunami of scorn for suggesting this.
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CDL.TO
Moderator
Property values have NO effect on how much revenue the city collects.
(But if the tax base stops growing (because new buildings stop being built because businesses and residents don't want to move to the city), the existing properties must bear a greater propotion of any future budget increase.)
`
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nfitz
Superstar
If believing in traditional marriage means that one opposed the marriage of two loving people based on something as silly as their gender, then yes, it does mean that you want human rights to disappear. If you sit quietly about it, and don't voice your concerns, that's one thing.
However, when one crosses the line, as you have done, and starts publishing hateful views on public forums, then you have committed a hate crime, and you should be eliminated from free society.
doug
Active Member
You use the word 'we' too much...speak for yourself only, please.
As for ignoring history...that's exactly what you've done in this and other threads.
As previously pointed out to you, this is based on your own mothers failings, not anyone elses.
Coltaine79
Active Member
Or maybe the good ol' days when the White Anglo-Saxon Protestant man was supreme... with his boot-heel pressed down firmly on the heads of all the savage colored people from South Africa to Singapore?
Coltaine79
Active Member
Are you wearing a dunce cap today?
Anyone who isn't will realize the Panda characterization is what Team Ford believes, not Team Smitherman.nfitz
Superstar
Ah ... the days of the traditional marriage!
GraphicMatt
Looking forward to a FRESH START for Toronto
I wish someone would equate me to a Panda Bear. They're cute and rare and vicious. I'd consider it the ultimate compliment.
AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
nfitz:
I don't think he has said anything that can be even remotely considered a hate crime so let's not lighten the gravity of the latter. Eliminated from free society? What is this nonsense? Like seriously, you are just shooting your foot when you make statements like these.
As to your views tkip, I will just chose to challenge this one:
The nature of the family unit in human societies - both historically and at present in practice (as opposite to idealized norm) is extremely fluid; certainly the nuclear model you eluded to is a recent invention.
As to the matter of child rearing - it is the ability of the parents, not their biological sex that determines success. And when it comes to single parents - is it really about the missing gender, or is it more about the missing economic resources or the parents physical presence, the ability of one parent to keep tab on the kid, etc?
AoD
I don't think he has said anything that can be even remotely considered a hate crime so let's not lighten the gravity of the latter. Eliminated from free society? What is this nonsense? Like seriously, you are just shooting your foot when you make statements like these.
As to your views tkip, I will just chose to challenge this one:
The nature of the family unit in human societies - both historically and at present in practice (as opposite to idealized norm) is extremely fluid; certainly the nuclear model you eluded to is a recent invention.
As to the matter of child rearing - it is the ability of the parents, not their biological sex that determines success. And when it comes to single parents - is it really about the missing gender, or is it more about the missing economic resources or the parents physical presence, the ability of one parent to keep tab on the kid, etc?
AoD
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js97
Senior Member
Wow...People need to calm down.
Anyone that's taken Sociology 101 can tell you that how you're brought up, DOES affect how you interact with the world. This includes if you have one or two parents, of the same/opposite gender etc.
But I think we've progressed to a point (at least toronto) where does it really matter if someone has one or two dads? Society will not crumble as some on the right say, it will just 'evolve' with the times.
That being said, people that believe the in the sanctity of marriage between man and women shouldn't be labelled as bigots and hateful either. It's their belief. Just like some parents believe in spanking their children, other see it as 'child abuse'.
And yes, having interactions with BOTH genders helps in the development of the child. It's called socializing and to deny that fact is not being objective enough. Children learn from watching how their parent's interact with each other, this has a huge affect on their adult personalities. This doesn't mean Same Sexed parent's dont' have that.
A comparison between a traditional family to same sexed parents raising kids is not better or worse, it's just different. Does it really matter? NOPE!
Will kids raised in a gay family be more likely to be gay? Perhaps!, but again... does it really matter? NOPE!
As long as the parent instills good core values, like integrity and compassion...and fiscal planning lol... it really shouldn't matter!
That's my 2 cents!
This was like what i said from teh begining. Ford has fiscally the right idea, BUT, he's a little too ideologically driven and hard headed.
Why the hell thsi is even a municipal issue is way beyond me!
It's turning into quite the drama!
Anyone that's taken Sociology 101 can tell you that how you're brought up, DOES affect how you interact with the world. This includes if you have one or two parents, of the same/opposite gender etc.
But I think we've progressed to a point (at least toronto) where does it really matter if someone has one or two dads? Society will not crumble as some on the right say, it will just 'evolve' with the times.
That being said, people that believe the in the sanctity of marriage between man and women shouldn't be labelled as bigots and hateful either. It's their belief. Just like some parents believe in spanking their children, other see it as 'child abuse'.
And yes, having interactions with BOTH genders helps in the development of the child. It's called socializing and to deny that fact is not being objective enough. Children learn from watching how their parent's interact with each other, this has a huge affect on their adult personalities. This doesn't mean Same Sexed parent's dont' have that.
A comparison between a traditional family to same sexed parents raising kids is not better or worse, it's just different. Does it really matter? NOPE!
Will kids raised in a gay family be more likely to be gay? Perhaps!, but again... does it really matter? NOPE!
As long as the parent instills good core values, like integrity and compassion...and fiscal planning lol... it really shouldn't matter!
That's my 2 cents!
This was like what i said from teh begining. Ford has fiscally the right idea, BUT, he's a little too ideologically driven and hard headed.
Why the hell thsi is even a municipal issue is way beyond me!
It's turning into quite the drama!
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doug
Active Member
Still true?
js97
Senior Member
Good point! never thought of it that way.... actually great point...
Glen
Senior Member
Yep. I would also add that the inherent advantage of a two parent family (outside of the ones you listed) is the in the diversity of character role models the parent provide. While this may be more easily achieved by more natural differences between genders, there is no reasonable argument that can be made that it cannot be provided for in a same sex couple. Two people can, more easily, bring more to the plate than one. Two different people bring more than two similar ones. Gender is not an issue.