Ontario Northland/Northern Ontario Transportation

[lenaitch]

guessing this goes here? Highway 11's 2+1 pilot contract has been won be Aecom and is now moving to design phase: https://northernontario.ctvnews.ca/...passing-lane-project-into-high-gear-1.6480306

Good to see this moving forward. They will obviously have to have breaks in the barrier for at-grade roads and businesses but there aren't a huge number in those areas. It will add costs and time to the school board because they will now have to do uni-directional school bussing. This is very limited in the two test areas but will be become more of an issue in other areas if the concept moves forward. Regardless, it will improve safety as residents have been complaining about trucks ignoring the school buses.

 

[dowlingm]

Let Ontario Northland take over VIA Rail's Sudbury to White River service

It's time to put the essential remote service into the hands of a competent agency that understands the region

open.substack.com

Since when are the RDCs maintained in North Bay? I thought it was Capreol, and then heavy work in TMC?

The TVO documentary did a great service in showing the reality of Train 185 - ridership, speeds, logistics - and the operational challenges of flag stop service. There would be synergy to having this service operated by ONTC with integration to its bus service at both ends, and fully maintained in North Bay (with the feds continuing to provide ONTC with the funding formerly provided for 185 and VIA transferring a sufficient Budd fleet and spares) but do ONTC even want it?

 

[lenaitch]

Since when are the RDCs maintained in North Bay? I thought it was Capreol, and then heavy work in TMC?

The TVO documentary did a great service in showing the reality of Train 185 - ridership, speeds, logistics - and the operational challenges of flag stop service. There would be synergy to having this service operated by ONTC with integration to its bus service at both ends, and fully maintained in North Bay (with the feds continuing to provide ONTC with the funding formerly provided for 185 and VIA transferring a sufficient Budd fleet and spares) but do ONTC even want it?

I misses the maintenance part. There might be some advantages to linking to their bus service, particularly at the White River end but matching schedules to a flag stop-type service might be a challenge. As it stands now it is isolated from the rest of the ONR rail network. If they were to maintain the units as well they would have to be hauled back to North Bay (or possibly even Cochrane - I vaguely recall reading that their fleet maintenance is done up there) and require running rights from OVR which might come at a cost.

I'm still not seeing a compelling argument that changing operators would result in a significant benefit.

 

[micheal_can]

It is operated by VIA under its 'remote service' mandate. Anything beyond that would require additional funding. I'm not sure I get the author's argument that, dollar-for-dollar, putting it under ONTC would magically make it better. It would still be a flag-stop service on somebody's else's trackage.

I know additional funding would be needed. Maybe Ford needs a pet project to get more N Ontario seats?

The question is .... IS the demand there?

For those wanting out of Toronto, a massive condo in a small town might be what is wanted.

Since when are the RDCs maintained in North Bay? I thought it was Capreol, and then heavy work in TMC?

The TVO documentary did a great service in showing the reality of Train 185 - ridership, speeds, logistics - and the operational challenges of flag stop service. There would be synergy to having this service operated by ONTC with integration to its bus service at both ends, and fully maintained in North Bay (with the feds continuing to provide ONTC with the funding formerly provided for 185 and VIA transferring a sufficient Budd fleet and spares) but do ONTC even want it?

The RDCs are maintained in New Sudbury, ironically, near the Sudbury Junction station.

 

[lenaitch]

I know additional funding would be needed. Maybe Ford needs a pet project to get more N Ontario seats?

Meh. He can rest on his promise to reinstate the Northlander, expanded bus service and his support for the mining sector, including the RoF. The north was a big swath of orange last election and some of the ridings are traditionally so, so I doubt tossing around some money will shift much from the left to the right.

For those wanting out of Toronto, a massive condo in a small town might be what is wanted.

I would suspect that for those wanting out of Toronto, a "massive condo" would be the last thing they want.

Most small towns have neither the infrastructure nor tax base to support anything close to something like this. I suppose a developer could pay for everything required to support this, from upgraded water and sewer (assuming the town has a sanitary system) to fire services, then pass that cost on to the buyers, or the buyer could buy their own lot , maybe on a lake, for fraction of the cost.

I people are expecting the Northlander to begin some kind of long-distance commuting boom, they may be disappointed.

 

[micheal_can]

Meh. He can rest on his promise to reinstate the Northlander, expanded bus service and his support for the mining sector, including the RoF. The north was a big swath of orange last election and some of the ridings are traditionally so, so I doubt tossing around some money will shift much from the left to the right.

He switched Timmins and SSM, so he can make inroads.

I would suspect that for those wanting out of Toronto, a "massive condo" would be the last thing they want.

Most small towns have neither the infrastructure nor tax base to support anything close to something like this. I suppose a developer could pay for everything required to support this, from upgraded water and sewer (assuming the town has a sanitary system) to fire services, then pass that cost on to the buyers, or the buyer could buy their own lot , maybe on a lake, for fraction of the cost.

I people are expecting the Northlander to begin some kind of long-distance commuting boom, they may be disappointed.

I was more being sarcastic, but they could revitalize their downtown.

 

[lenaitch]

I was more being sarcastic, but they could revitalize their downtown.

Outside of Muskoka (and much of the new builds in Huntsville are already condos - just not highrise), and the proposed GTA stops, your idea of "downtown" might differ from those of most of the communities the Northlander will stop. Of the two cities that actually have a traditional downtown, the train won't go there.

Any "massive condo" would need parking for a pickup, ATV, MSV and probably a trailer and an ic hut, because that's what a lot of small town northern residents have.

 

[micheal_can]

Outside of Muskoka (and much of the new builds in Huntsville are already condos - just not highrise), and the proposed GTA stops, your idea of "downtown" might differ from those of most of the communities the Northlander will stop. Of the two cities that actually have a traditional downtown, the train won't go there.

Any "massive condo" would need parking for a pickup, ATV, MSV and probably a trailer and an ic hut, because that's what a lot of small town northern residents have.

What is so bad with doing all of that?

 

[lenaitch]

What is so bad with doing all of that?

I tire of this. I suppose we can all sit back and wait for the first developer to build a "massive condo" in Washago or Englehart, then one of us will be vindicated.

 

[Towered]

Of the two cities that actually have a traditional downtown, the train won't go there.

Which two?

 

[micheal_can]

I tire of this. I suppose we can all sit back and wait for the first developer to build a "massive condo" in Washago or Englehart, then one of us will be vindicated.

I don't think it will ever happen, but, what is wrong with thinking about what if it did?

 

[lenaitch]

Which two?

North Bay and Timmins.

I don't think it will ever happen, but, what is wrong with thinking about what if it did?

Because it isn't a fantasy thread?

 

[micheal_can]

Because it isn't a fantasy thread?

Until the Northlander actually returns, it is still a fantasy.

 

[roger1818]

Until the Northlander actually returns, it is still a fantasy.

While I agree there is a grey line between fantasy and reality, the fact that new passenger trains have been ordered from Siemens for the Northlander, it has been pushed from fantasy into reality. Could something happen to scuttle the whole thing? Yes, but I would put the probability that the service will return well above 50% (probably even above 90% at this point). A fantasy isn't anything that doesn't exist, but something that likely won't exist.

 

[Allandale25]

There were also posts from LinkedIn showing a visit to several stations with location officials. South River, Bracebridge, Gravenhurst.