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Metrolinx $55 Billion Plan

I'd like to see how the ridership figures subdivide into walk-ins, transfers from other routes, new riders lured away from their cars, etc., for each line.

That Stouffville GO ridership projection is ridiculous and could be reached by running 8 trains per rush hour instead of 5...maybe that's their vision of all-day service for the line.
 
Did Metrolinx ever bother stating why the downtown core subway is basically the last on the list?

Clearly from these ridership projections it should be started... now?
 
It's too bad the Downtown Core line isn't proposed to continue up Don Mills to Fairview Mall. It would rival even the Yonge line for ridership. As proposed it would be the most efficient subway line in Toronto - carrying way more people per kilometre than Yonge, Bloor, or Sheppard.
 
ShonTron said:
Agreed that the DRL needs to be put at the start of the line.

Also note they only expect that Stouffville will only get 4.5 million riders a year with "regional rail", while Bolton, yes, Bolton, will get 8.3 million. And Richmond Hill 51.3 million? Where are they pulling the figures out of? Markham's light years ahead of Caledon and Vaughan in attempting to urbanize its core areas, even though it's far from perfect (it should be the "express rail" line, not RH). Richmond Hill will not attract riders like Stouffville will, partly because you're not going to get many riders unless you build ridiculously elaborate stations at Don Mills and Bond and Eglinton and Wynford to get people off TTC buses there, not to mention full fare integration, as you're not going to get much walk-up traffic unless you pulverize the Don Mills and York Mills neighbourhoods to make them ToD.
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Yeah, the deferral of Downtown Core subway and the omission of Stouffville GO line from the list of Express services are the two biggest issues in this plan.

Stouffville Express service would do a great job for Toronto's north-east, not just for Markham. I wonder why is it omitted - are there any trackage limitations for that route?

Interestingly, Table C contains two entries for Richmond Hill service: one in Express section, other in Regional Rail. The annual ridership is projected at 51.3 million for Express version, but only 1.2 million for Regional version. How is that possible?

And naturally, how much would the Stouffville's ridership grow if it got Express service?
 
taal said:
So i had a good look through the stats seems pretty reasonable overall.

What's the current ridership on Hurontario though - the # of boardings seemed high, higher then finch west:

Page 27 on onward:
http://www.metrolinx.com/Docs/DraftRTPandIS/Modelling Backgrounder - Final.pdf

First part for rail / subway - then LRT/BRT
Click to expand...

The last numbers I have on Hurontario was over 25,000/day. Dundas see 750/hr going north on the 19's and 202. 25% bypass Sq One.

Will have better numbers when MT presents to the budget committee ridership numbers and cost ratio on Wed Oct 15 for the worst 30 routes as well the top 10 routes waiting for more service.

#43, 37, 74, 62 current routes to be cancel in 2009 that I support. Surprise 63 was drop from first plan.

If redevelopment takes place along Hurontario over the next 25 years along with new development as plan, it will see 75-100,000 riders daily. Even without this, ridership will increase to over 40,000/day.

No way a BRT will support the ridership number unless it is an express service for the long haul riders with local service. Using the numbers for Dundas and Sq One now, MT needs a (14) bus every 4 minutes using 40' or 5 minutes using 60'.

And LRT would need 12 cars every 5 having room for 1,560/hr. Because Brampton is the weak link, service would be every 10 minutes north of Steeles. This for all day service.
 
With those type of ridership numbers, perhaps the Downtown Core Line should be constructed with New York-style 4-track tunnels instead of 2-track tunnels to allow for express services (that say only stop at Pape/Yonge/University/Dundas West).
 
After seeing the numbers, I'd agree that the DRL should have been prioritized. But it is likely that the DRL was deferred in favour of Metrolinx seeking a more regional approach. Their mission after all was to connect the whole region.
 
Coruscanti Cognoscente said:
The open house is scheduled from 5-7pm. So basically anyone who wants to go has to be someone who lives on the Georgetown line and commutes to Toronto every day and they have to go on their way home from work, i.e. no time to eat dinner.

What awful planning. Malton is the only Mississauga station on that line. Just so, so bad.
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All of the open houses are from 5 - 7 ......then the meetings.

I think it is safe to say that no matter where you hold the meetings, most workers that are commuters are skipping dinner if the open house is important for them.

Rather than quibble about the location, maybe we should wonder about a system that pretends to want inform and then accept the opinion of commuters then have those gatherings start at 5 p.m. on a weeknight.....making it very difficult for anyone other than retirees, students, academics or politicians to attend.
 
TOareaFan said:
All of the open houses are from 5 - 7 ......then the meetings.

I think it is safe to say that no matter where you hold the meetings, most workers that are commuters are skipping dinner if the open house is important for them.

Rather than quibble about the location, maybe we should wonder about a system that pretends to want inform and then accept the opinion of commuters then have those gatherings start at 5 p.m. on a weeknight.....making it very difficult for anyone other than retirees, students, academics or politicians to attend.
Click to expand...

I agree. The commuters who use these services should be consulted, but it doesn't look like that's truly happening.
 
Coruscanti Cognoscente said:
I agree. The commuters who use these services should be consulted, but it doesn't look like that's truly happening.
Click to expand...

That being said, there is no rule that says " you have to go to the meeting closest to your house"...is there?

At each meeting, I presume, they will discuss the whole plan not just the part specific to where the meeting is held....no?

If that is the case, there seems to be a meeting convenient for everyone!
 
Keith: I think too much focus is given to expensive network improvements in the burbs. I think extending the SRT beyond STC is a crime.

Improving capacity downtown is a foundation for all this network expansion to drive ridership growth.
 
WRT to the "downtown core line", we should create two different "teams." Each would represent the businesses and land owners around the two most often cited corridors for such a route, Queen and the Rail Corridor. Whichever group promises to cover a greater share of the total costs, gets the route.

And yes, ignoring some kind of drl is nearly criminal. The best part? By the TTC's own United Way method of transit planning, the DRL should be priority number 1. It clearly has the most low income persons AND seniors living within 500m of a station! Double win!
 
Whoaccio said:
By the TTC's own United Way method of transit planning, the DRL should be priority number 1. It clearly has the most low income persons AND seniors living within 500m of a station! Double win!
Click to expand...

This is a wise approach. I am about to submit my suggestions for Draft RTP to Metrolinx, and will add the above argument.
 
my guess as to why the DRl is deferred, is because by using the money that would be spent on it now they can make the 15-year map look bigger in the 905, where they could put more lines on the map for less money
 
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