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John Street Roundhouse: Toronto Railway Heritage Centre, Steam Whistle, The Rec Room

It depends. A lot of people are looking for things to do in this city. There is a lot of untapped potential here. Entertainment is kind of monotone here. This will provide a bit of variety of it is planned well.

Cineplex seems like it knows what it's doing, and there are plenty of models for this type of business in Asia. So all they have to do is just copy it and bring it here. Unfortunately it won't have the gambling aspect like that ones in Japan though.

I agree that this model has worked in the States, but Cineplex clearly doesn't know what they're doing. Their Edmonton location is not a professional operation. There is a chain called Dave and Busters that's popular in America and has a location in Vaughan, but they also have bad reviews across the board. Even if this is done well, I suspect it will be a hard sell in Toronto.
 
I agree that this model has worked in the States, but Cineplex clearly doesn't know what they're doing. Their Edmonton location is not a professional operation. There is a chain called Dave and Busters that's popular in America and has a location in Vaughan, but they also have bad reviews across the board. Even if this is done well, I suspect it will be a hard sell in Toronto.

Ah I haven't seen the Edmonton one. I am sorry to hear it isn't good, because I'm hoping the Toronto one is. There is Dave and Buster's and Playdium, but they were always to me a bit mediocre compared to what's out there in the rest of the world. Plus they are so far away.

One thing I could see definitely going wrong is the price. Toronto has such high rents for businesses, it may be super expensive to do anything in this place.
 
One thing I could see definitely going wrong is the price. Toronto has such high rents for businesses, it may be super expensive to do anything in this place.

Really? Toronto retail rents do not come close to matching other major international markets. Below is a comparison of top retail streets around the world......now this project is not on a major street/node, so finding comparisons will be tough but if you subscribe to the theory that every other retail rent becomes a derivative of, or discount to, the top rents then I am not sure anything in Toronto would be priced higher than other markets:

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Really? Toronto retail rents do not come close to matching other major international markets. Below is a comparison of top retail streets around the world......now this project is not on a major street/node, so finding comparisons will be tough but if you subscribe to the theory that every other retail rent becomes a derivative of, or discount to, the top rents then I am not sure anything in Toronto would be priced higher than other markets:

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Well I was talking about mainly in Canada it is the most expensive for rental at an average of $68.19 per sq foot. (http://www.financialpost.com/m/wp/n...ity-for-office-space-while-calgary-drops-fast)

I can only speak to the places I am familiar with on that list of most expensive. I'm not surprised to see Ginza on there, but that's because Ginza is Tokyo's Yorkville. Also remember Tokyo has a population of 30,000,000 so you get a lot of foot traffic. But on average per square foot in other areas of Tokyo the price drops significantly, and if you search for commercial property in other areas it averages out to about 50-60 bucks for square foot a annually, probably making that around the city wide average. Or you can open up little stands in malls and parks for about $5 a day. That's mainly because most of Japan is over developed, and on average property is cheaper there than it is here; unless of course you focus on areas like Ginza.

As for European countries I cant say much. Never looked into their commercial rates very much. I've looked into residential rates, some places are way more expensive than here, some are way cheaper. Just depends on the city.
 
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I dunno. It just sounds like a tourist trap to me, with overpriced food and activities. Maybe the location near CN Tower, SkyDome and the aquarium, right downtown, will be enough to sustain it. But it strikes me that locals have many, many options in town to play pool, etc. and get good food, without the high prices, and without needing to go right downtown to some costly emporium which has all the charm of a multiplex. The cavernous space is beautiful, but for this type of thing it just strikes me as though it is going to be l-o-u-d. Who knows, maybe it will be a tremendous success - I have overestimated the discernment of consumers before.
 
I dunno. It just sounds like a tourist trap to me, with overpriced food and activities. Maybe the location near CN Tower, SkyDome and the aquarium, right downtown, will be enough to sustain it. But it strikes me that locals have many, many options in town to play pool, etc. and get good food, without the high prices, and without needing to go right downtown to some costly emporium which has all the charm of a multiplex. The cavernous space is beautiful, but for this type of thing it just strikes me as though it is going to be l-o-u-d. Who knows, maybe it will be a tremendous success - I have overestimated the discernment of consumers before.
You're right it has a large possibility to be exactly what you just said. I'm hoping it turns out to be more a place to hang out. I spent many nights in the arcades in Japan because they were so fun. They were built for the local population as a place to hang out in. I'm hoping Cineplex mirrors that design with their rec room.
 
I dunno. It just sounds like a tourist trap to me, with overpriced food and activities. Maybe the location near CN Tower, SkyDome and the aquarium, right downtown, will be enough to sustain it. But it strikes me that locals have many, many options in town to play pool, etc. and get good food, without the high prices, and without needing to go right downtown to some costly emporium which has all the charm of a multiplex. The cavernous space is beautiful, but for this type of thing it just strikes me as though it is going to be l-o-u-d. Who knows, maybe it will be a tremendous success - I have overestimated the discernment of consumers before.
Largely agree....but having things for tourists to do is hardly a bad thing.....even nearby tourists...people who come in from other parts of Ontario to catch a Jays game/series....having another entertainment option to round out their visit is not a bad thing.

As for loud...it is in the new "loud district" of Toronto...so it might be well placed to succeed.
 
Interesting article in the Globe with a section on the Rec Room. The location in Edmonton has been exceeding expectations ([insert what-else-is-there-to-do-in-Edmonton joke here]).

Game On: Why Cineplex is betting big on eSports
Think Cineplex is all about movies? Think again. It’s rapidly becoming a diversified entertainment company, and competitive gaming is the next stop
Andrew Willis, ROB Magazine, The Globe and Mail, 28 April 2017

The section on the Rec Room:

"Standing on a patch of sidewalk destined to be part of a 300-seat outdoor patio serving 25 brands of draft beer, the 63-year-old Jacob points to where his audience will come from. The Rogers Centre, home to baseball’s Blue Jays, is across the street. The Air Canada Centre and Bay Street’s office towers are a few blocks away, and condos soar in every direction.

Welcome to Toronto’s Rec Room. Still under construction, the former site of a Leon’s furniture outlet will be the new chain’s second location when Cineplex opens its doors this summer. “I’ve got an accounting firm and one of the law firms pushing to be the first to hold a function at Rec Room,” says Jacob, who worked as an accountant before joining a predecessor to Cineplex. “And we’re surrounded by young people with small apartments whose social life is all about gaming with friends.”

Cineplex opened its first Rec Room in Edmonton last September, hiring an executive who built the Planet Hollywood chain to run the project. The concept combines high-end food and live entertainment with the latest cutting-edge games, and a dash of retro arcade entertainment. Along with what’s billed as Canada’s largest wood-fired grill, and Italian-made pizza ovens that cook a thin-crust pie in 90 seconds, Rec Room offers private rooms and a stage for music or comedy acts.

When it comes to games, there is everything from state-of-the-art Formula One race-car simulators to axe-throwing, as well as vintage attractions such as pool tables, Ping-Pong, air hockey and pinball. The one thing that’s missing is a movie screen: Cineplex won’t show films at Rec Room.

Just the thought of flipping flippers and ringing ringers brings a smile to the face of Cineplex’s CEO as he leads a tour though the almost-complete facility. “I used to blow off steam playing a lot of pinball,” he says, recalling his days as an MBA student at York University.

Thanks to a steady stream of like-minded pinball enthusiasts and other fun-seekers, Edmonton’s Rec Room is already exceeding internal expectations, notching $2.2 million in sales during its first three-and-a-half months in business. On Alberta’s coldest winter nights, patrons line up to get in. Cine-plex plans to spend up to $150 million launching 15 locations over the next five years, with a second facility planned for Edmonton and sites already chosen in Toronto, Calgary and London, Ontario.

Based on results at rivals such as the Dave & Buster’s restaurant chain, where sales are growing at a 16% annual clip, analysts project a return of 25% a year; three years out, Rec Room is expected to generate $110 million in revenues, which translates into $27 million in bottom-line profit.

While that would make a significant contribution to Cineplex’s financial results, the bigger prize could be eSports, where Jacob and his team are among the first major entertainment companies to invest in a sector that looks like it’s about to ignite"
 
I don't know what fits in that space, having seen it in the Leon's days, but looking at those ceilings and a bunch of plasticky arcade machines crammed in below, my instant reaction is "not that."

It's like when iPhone UI started ditching the "leather and felt" skeuomorphism in favour of white and modern but only did it half way initially, and even the modern half instead of Apple white ends up as Dell white which is Not Good. (Seeing an iMac and a Dell all-in-one sat next to each other at Best Buy some years back sticks in the mind as an example of terrible merchandising)
 
(Seeing an iMac and a Dell all-in-one sat next to each other at Best Buy some years back sticks in the mind as an example of terrible merchandising)

Weren't they competing models? There's nothing more satisfying than a side-by-side comparison test of competing models of the same kind of product.
 
I wonder if Cenplex is donating money to the railway museum like Leons did in the past and Steamwhistle currently does. Personally I don't see a need for this type of place down there. Plus I don't know how viable a space like this really is Disney tried to do it at one point and closed the one in Chicago and will soon be closing the one in Walt Disney World.
 

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