GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)

[mpd618]

Guelph Transit and GRT have this on the radar this year. There are complications (i.e. Greyhound and the OHTB). GO Transit COULD technically set up a local service, but were are the funds for operation and buses? Still needs a lot of work.

I think they've had service between Waterloo Region and Guelph on the radar for years, without it being clear who is the party to take the lead on it. With budget pressures as they are, it doesn't seem like this is the year for it to go anywhere. If you have details otherwise, please share!

 

[gweed123]

You mean by ending service at Bramalea the train service is reduced by 30-40 minutes? Yes, but nobody wants to go to Bramalea in the morning. If the express train was the one extended to Kitchener that might make sense if there is space on that train or if they had enough to create another. If the 8:01am arrival at Union started in K-W that would be a 6:10am departure that is 13 minutes shorter which is a bit better. If the full improvements to the corridor outlined in the EA including double tracking and signaling, the ARL improvements, and eventually electrification then the improvements might be noticable enough to drastically change things. If you look at a bus driving the same route as the train the train is faster. The advantage Greyhound has is no stops and never getting off the freeway.

I think that's what he meant. That the train would run local from Kitchener to Bramlea, and then express to Union from there, as opposed to running local the entire way, because that's a really long trip.

 

[EnviroTO]

I think so too but his math is off. It saves 13 minutes if you are talking trip time, and 21 minutes if you are just talking about waking up later and catching the train that gets in at 8:01am.

 

[royalrivers]

I think so too but his math is off. It saves 13 minutes if you are talking trip time, and 21 minutes if you are just talking about waking up later and catching the train that gets in at 8:01am.

OKAY let me be clear: its a MIND thing not a actual TIME thing - sigh based on what peoples eyes from Kitchener see, that not stopping after Bramalea until Toronto "saves time"

However, based on facts, It will save a up to 30 minutes with the following things coming on stream: CTC installed in 2013, additional sidings in 2013, Georgetown track improvement with getting into/out on/off Guelph Sub, and of course the 13-15 mins it shaves off the normal run.

There are also several blogs from respected transit authorities who point out that, yes indeed, it would save up to 30 minutes with the train from Kitchener to Bramalea and then no stops until Toronto. Clear enough? gokw.or tritag.ca

 

[Woodbridge_Heights]

Interesting, a couple hundred rider increase on the Kitchener extension is considered a grand success. Yet a projected ridership of 4400 period riders in 2031 on the proposed Bolton line does not qualify this route as a priority. Sheesh sometimes I wonder about transit planning in this province.

 

[innsertnamehere]

Ahah, but the Bolton line would likely have very little ridership today. Likely barely enough for a bus route, yet alone a train line. Again, if the transit tax gets passed, your beloved Bolton line will likely happen.

 

[wolfewood]

Isn't Bolton being held up because CP rail traffic is too heavy to allow a new line without significant amounts of trackage updates first? Or is that one of the proposed lines?

The point I'm making being that past Georgetown there are only three regular freight trips daily, sometimes more or less depending, so it was easy to add two GO trains to the mix, especially now that one of the morning VIA trains has been cancelled. It makes sense that a government that is obviously inclined to flashy projects would want the Kitchener extension first. Not good transit planning but not outright bad either.

 

[Dan416]

Not sure if I mentioned on here before, but the night train on the Milton line to Union was decently used. Kind of like a quiet regular train on the Lakeshore Line.

I did not ride the night train back from Union, so I can't comment on that one.

My only problem with it was that I tapped my Presto card for it, when it turned out when I got to Union that all the Presto machines there were covered saying not to tap because it was free. But I had to tap off ... kinda pissed I wasted money on that.

Anyway, back to my original point, if we had the same kind of service Lakeshore does, I'm sure we could match their ridership levels relatively quickly.

 

[Woodbridge_Heights]

Ahah, but the Bolton line would likely have very little ridership today. Likely barely enough for a bus route, yet alone a train line. Again, if the transit tax gets passed, your beloved Bolton line will likely happen.

I don't think GO publishes ridership #'s for it's bus routes, however there are currently 8 buses currently operating out of Bolton. 6 on the 38 route which terminates at Milton rail station, and 2 on the 38A route which serves Etobicoke North station and terminates at Yorkdale. With a capacity of 57 riders per bus (according to wikipedia) even at 2/3's capacity that means that there are at least 320 riders on the Bolton line. That's a little over 10% of a train. Furthermore train service should increase demand to a few hundred if not more.

The difference being that the Bolton line does not have an already busy line downstream the way that Kitchener does with service through Brampton to augment the few people at the end of the line. However building a couple of stations on Finch and Eglinton and connecting them to those proposed TC lines should really boost ridership. Also that the Bolton line would require some track work that the Kitchener line does not, or has already had done.

Still I'm just saying, it is interesting how 100 riders or so are valued more than a few hundred.

 

[SGHA504]

Wouldn't Bolton Line ridership be bolstered by the fact the CP Mactier Sub passes through Woodbridge as well? Surely a stop would be put in place somewhere in that community, should the line ever come into existence.

 

[Woodbridge_Heights]

Wouldn't Bolton Line ridership be bolstered by the fact the CP Mactier Sub passes through Woodbridge as well? Surely a stop would be put in place somewhere in that community, should the line ever come into existence.

Yes GO plans call for stations in Bolton, Kleinburg, Elder Mills (Rutherford and hwy 27 area), and Woodbridge (407 and Islington area). York Region has been pushing for an urban station to be built in the Woodbridge core and for a connection to it's VIVA network.

 

[TOareaFan]

I don't think GO publishes ridership #'s for it's bus routes, however there are currently 8 buses currently operating out of Bolton. 6 on the 38 route which terminates at Milton rail station, and 2 on the 38A route which serves Etobicoke North station and terminates at Yorkdale. With a capacity of 57 riders per bus (according to wikipedia) even at 2/3's capacity that means that there are at least 320 riders on the Bolton line. That's a little over 10% of a train. Furthermore train service should increase demand to a few hundred if not more.

Typo? Surely it is Malton?

 

[nfitz]

I don't think GO publishes ridership #'s for it's bus routes, however there are currently 8 buses currently operating out of Bolton. 6 on the 38 route which terminates at Milton rail station, and 2 on the 38A route which serves Etobicoke North station and terminates at Yorkdale. With a capacity of 57 riders per bus (according to wikipedia) even at 2/3's capacity that means that there are at least 320 riders on the Bolton line. That's a little over 10% of a train. Furthermore train service should increase demand to a few hundred if not more.

I was on the 38A in PM rush last month, and the bus didn't even look half-full leaving Etobicoke North. Only about 10-15 people got on at Etobicoke North, but a few others were already on the bus. I assume some more got on at Humber College, but I got off near there. Perhaps there's a regular rider who could comment?

Though I'd expect the bulk of the traffic to be coming from Vaughan and Woodbridge, rather than from Bolton. Still, it's all pretty low rise ... would be a few years I'd think before it supports more than a couple of trains a day.

Typo? Surely it is Malton?

Most of the buses are from Malton.

 

[gweed123]

I was on the 38A in PM rush last month, and the bus didn't even look half-full leaving Etobicoke North. Only about 10-15 people got on at Etobicoke North, but a few others were already on the bus. I assume some more got on at Humber College, but I got off near there. Perhaps there's a regular rider who could comment?

Though I'd expect the bulk of the traffic to be coming from Vaughan and Woodbridge, rather than from Bolton. Still, it's all pretty low rise ... would be a few years I'd think before it supports more than a couple of trains a day.

I think that GO should try running an O-Train style DMU service on that corridor between Mt. Dennis and Bolton, or at least Woodbridge. The reason why I suggest Mt. Dennis is because once the ECLRT is there and the Georgetown corridor is electrified, it's going to be a pretty major hub. By ending it there, you give passengers the option of transferring onto several pretty major routes (Brampton-Markham GO REX for a trip to Union, ECLRT for a trip elsewhere), but don't add any more train trips into Union itself. Besides, south of Mt. Dennis it would just be an unnecessary duplication of service.

Heck, by that time Ottawa will likely be in the process of electrifying the N-S LRT (the current O-Train line), so GO may even be able to just use those vehicles and repaint them.

 

[Markster]

Though I'd expect the bulk of the traffic to be coming from Vaughan and Woodbridge, rather than from Bolton. Still, it's all pretty low rise ... would be a few years I'd think before it supports more than a couple of trains a day.

Also consider that with the Spadina Subway extension, options for high order transit aren't that far away from these neighbourhoods.
The 407 Park and Ride, depending on the pricing scheme, could totally cannibalize GO ridership.