GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)

[ShonTron]

^ Good post.

I'd love if your mayor could push to get the trail (the rest of the former CN Uxbridge Sub) in good shape for cycling - fix or replace the first bridge out of town, and replace the rough gravel with smooth crushed stone, like it is when you get past Simcoe Street into Kawartha Lakes.

I wrote about my bike ride from Uxbridge to Peterborough (via Lindsay) here back last September. I did find the GO service on both ends great for transporting me and my bike to and from Toronto.

 

[dunkalunk]

GO already has Guelph-Mississauga and Kitchener-Mississauga bus routes. I think Guelph-Hamilton and Kitcher-Hamilton are only a matter of time.

If this kind of route is in the cards, I'd suggest the following routing:

UW-Charles St Terminal-Sportsworld-Smartcentres Cambridge-Aberfoyle-Aldershot-Hamilton GO

If an agreement could be reached between GO and Guelph Transit, a timed transfer could be set up at Aberfoyle for an express shuttle serving Guelph Centre Terminal and U of G

 

[doady]

If this kind of route is in the cards, I'd suggest the following routing:

UW-Charles St Terminal-Sportsworld-Smartcentres Cambridge-Aberfoyle-Aldershot-Hamilton GO

I think it would make more sense to serve McMaster University, instead of Aldershot. McMaster is already in the direct path between the two cities, after all. A route connecting Waterloo/Kitchener/Cambridge/Hamilton, and serving both universities, it would be a good route.

Likewise, Guelph-Hamilton route should also serve both McMaster and University of Guelph.

 

[nfitz]

I think it would make more sense to serve McMaster University, instead of Aldershot. McMaster is already in the direct path between the two cities, after all. A route connecting Waterloo/Kitchener/Cambridge/Hamilton, and serving both universities, it would be a good route.

That's already the route of the frequent Canada Coach service though (other than not connecting up to UW. I'm not sure why you'd duplicate a private service that's been running for years with a cheaper GO service.

 

[ShonTron]

There's also a scheduled bus service between Guelph, Guelph U and Hamilton/McMaster, which took over a route that Coach Canada abandoned.

Three round trips weekdays, two round trips weekends, no holiday service though. I wonder how much Aboutown is making operating that service (or any of them). This would be a natural route for GO Transit, I do wonder if Aboutown would be willing to give it up, or for how much.

http://www.aboutown.ca/northlink/Route8Schedule.php

 

[TOareaFan]

There's also a scheduled bus service between Guelph, Guelph U and Hamilton/McMaster, which took over a route that Coach Canada abandoned.

Three round trips weekdays, two round trips weekends, no holiday service though. I wonder how much Aboutown is making operating that service (or any of them). This would be a natural route for GO Transit, I do wonder if Aboutown would be willing to give it up, or for how much.

http://www.aboutown.ca/northlink/Route8Schedule.php

What is the advantage of the public taking over an existing private sector route?

 

[ShonTron]

Several. Forgetting for a moment that GO is a public operator, GO is one of the largest coach operators in the province, with garages in Guelph and Hamilton, so there's economies of scale in having it operate the service and a natural operator for that service, connecting two or three of its other services with this Through-ticketing is easier. It is odd that a small London-based operator now offers this service and Coach Canada couldn't or wouldn't make it work, and I am curious as to how well they are doing.

GO has been doing quite well with its Waterloo-Square One service, and Trent U-Peterborough-Oshawa service, which are quite similar in their university-centric operations. Simply, I could see the Guelph-Hamilton market better served by GO.

 

[dunkalunk]

I think it would make more sense to serve McMaster University, instead of Aldershot. McMaster is already in the direct path between the two cities, after all. A route connecting Waterloo/Kitchener/Cambridge/Hamilton, and serving both universities, it would be a good route.

Likewise, Guelph-Hamilton route should also serve both McMaster and University of Guelph.

If you are looking for the fastest route between Kitchener and Hamilton, it is actually via the 401 and Highway 6, bringing the route very close to Aldershot regardless. Bringing the route to Aldershot would also provide connecting service to the Lakeshore GO and VIA Corridor routes.

 

[nfitz]

If you are looking for the fastest route between Kitchener and Hamilton, it is actually via the 401 and Highway 6, bringing the route very close to Aldershot regardless. Bringing the route to Aldershot would also provide connecting service to the Lakeshore GO and VIA Corridor routes.

The current service goes down Highway 8, through downtown Cambridge, and stops at McMaster. I believe that they've been running on this route for over 75 years.

Surely McMaster is a major node. What percentage of the current ridership would be alienated by cutting off the stops in Cambridge and at McMaster?

 

[trainiart]

Schedule changes are now online: http://www.gotransit.com/public/en/updates/schedulechanges.aspx#April

The new Richmond Hill schedule is a disaster. They cancelled 6 morning buses that form a semi-usable shoulder-rush schedule (8:30 Exp, 8:35 Exp, 8:40, 9:10 Exp, 9:20 and from Langstaff 8:55) and replace it with one train at.... 9:20!
8:30 and 8:35 buses are usually full. At Langstaff, 8:55 is full and 9:00 (8:40 from RH) is 3/4 full most of the time. 9:10 is becoming more and more full recently.
Now, from the schedule perspective, what does 9:20 train do for people boarding a 8:30 bus? Nothing. They're late to work, period. They'll have an option of getting up earlier and cramming an already overloaded 7:55 train, or drive. Guess what they'll choose? Same goes for 8:40 and 8:55 Langstaff. While 9:10 bus is very close to 9:20 train, it usually arrives in Toronto before 10AM. The train will arrive 10:06 by schedule, meaning that in reality it will be 2-5 minutes late every time. It's completely useless for people who start to work between 9 and 10 AM, many businesses with flexible hours have a policy of "everybody in by 10".
This fiasco is even worse than 5:30-6:45 gap in the evening.
I've been a supporter of GO transit for a long time, but this time I'm really thinking of driving. Thanks but no thanks, homo bureaucratis.

 

[ShonTron]

The current service goes down Highway 8, through downtown Cambridge, and stops at McMaster. I believe that they've been running on this route for over 75 years.

Surely McMaster is a major node. What percentage of the current ridership would be alienated by cutting off the stops in Cambridge and at McMaster?

Kitchener-Hamilton Coach Canada bus is also part of the Hamilton-St. Catharines-Niagara corridor. It's schedule has been relatively consistent over the last decade, but used to be more frequent before Grand River Transit operated local buses between Cambridge and Kitchener, which had no other link for decades other than the CCL/TW bus until 2001.

Historical trivia: The Kitchener-Hamilton route is one of two routes left over from the Hamilton-based Canada Coach Lines company. CCL also owned and operated the Hamilton Street Railway for a lengthy period during the era through the 1940s and 1950s when thelast streetcar lines were replaced by trolley buses. Hamilton was late in the game for having publicly controlled transit, buying CCL/HSR in 1960. CCL was owned by the City of Hamilton/Hamilton Wentworth through HSR until the 1990s, and sold to Trentway-Wagar, which evolved into present day Scottish-owned Coach Canada.

 

[dunkalunk]

If GO were in a position in which it could take over service on Highway 8, then by all means, they should take over that route. However, I don't think that Coach Canada would be that willing to give up their monopoly in the same way that Greyhound would not be that willing to give up their monopoly on Kitchener-Guelph trips.

 

[andrewpmk]

The new Richmond Hill schedule is a disaster. They cancelled 6 morning buses that form a semi-usable shoulder-rush schedule (8:30 Exp, 8:35 Exp, 8:40, 9:10 Exp, 9:20 and from Langstaff 8:55) and replace it with one train at.... 9:20!
8:30 and 8:35 buses are usually full. At Langstaff, 8:55 is full and 9:00 (8:40 from RH) is 3/4 full most of the time. 9:10 is becoming more and more full recently.
Now, from the schedule perspective, what does 9:20 train do for people boarding a 8:30 bus? Nothing. They're late to work, period. They'll have an option of getting up earlier and cramming an already overloaded 7:55 train, or drive. Guess what they'll choose? Same goes for 8:40 and 8:55 Langstaff. While 9:10 bus is very close to 9:20 train, it usually arrives in Toronto before 10AM. The train will arrive 10:06 by schedule, meaning that in reality it will be 2-5 minutes late every time. It's completely useless for people who start to work between 9 and 10 AM, many businesses with flexible hours have a policy of "everybody in by 10".
This fiasco is even worse than 5:30-6:45 gap in the evening.
I've been a supporter of GO transit for a long time, but this time I'm really thinking of driving. Thanks but no thanks, homo bureaucratis.

The VIVA bus exists for a reason. Not that you can really expect the GO buses to be on time anyway because the DVP/404 is severely congested.

 

[trainiart]

The VIVA bus exists for a reason.

Har-d-har-har

 

[ShonTron]

The VIVA bus exists for a reason. Not that you can really expect the GO buses to be on time anyway because the DVP/404 is severely congested.

Richmond Hill is fortunate to have an alternative direct bus to the subway. But I get the gripe about replacing the buses, with more flexible schedules, with one train that does arrive too late to be an effective shoulder-peak service for commuters on flex time and students with 10AM classes, and a 85 minute gap in the schedule.

I disliked the introduction of the few midday Bramalea trains a decade ago for similar reasons: a lousy schedule and a crummy transfer from the bus at Bramalea GO, when the buses they replaced gave a direct, faster ride to Union.

Brampton, of course, had no easy alternative that Richmond Hill had, and had to deal with a forced transfer that added 20-30 minutes to the trip.