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GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)

It would seem that the question of whether or not the 2 trains serving Kitchener will be new trips have been clearly answered - "two trips each peak extended". Meaning 2 of the existing trains will run the additional length to Kitchener. Those are going to be some packed trains…
Will they though? Later in the report (page 21) they also say that in addition to the peak service from Kitchener, that "The morning Georgetown service will be improved by adding a morning late-rush hour shoulder train". And if you look at the estimated 2011 GO demand in the EA, there's only 575 to 1000 additional passengers at Georgetown; extending these trains from 10 cars to 12 cars will add about 600 seats. Sounds like they are adding more capacity between Georgetown and Union than they going to use up.
 
So it would appear that basically one of the morning trips to Kitchener will be a new run, but none of the evening trips. Well, they're 1/4th closer that helps a bit.
 
Will they though? Later in the report (page 21) they also say that in addition to the peak service from Kitchener, that "The morning Georgetown service will be improved by adding a morning late-rush hour shoulder train". And if you look at the estimated 2011 GO demand in the EA, there's only 575 to 1000 additional passengers at Georgetown; extending these trains from 10 cars to 12 cars will add about 600 seats. Sounds like they are adding more capacity between Georgetown and Union than they going to use up.

Sometimes the wording they use is/can be confusing. So that bolded part could lead to two (that I can see) possible conclusions:

1. The one you seem to make that in addition to/conjunction with the extension to Kitchener there will be one new train added as a late rush hour train.
2. The train that currently leaves Bramalea at 9:20 may very well be one of the trains extended to K-W. If that is the case you have added a late rush train to "Georgetown" without actually adding any new trains at all (in a funny sort of way).

Even if that train itself is not one of the ones extended......extending two others frees up space in Georgetown that would allow that train to start in GTown....no? So, extend two trains so that they start in K-W, extend the 9:20 so that it starts in GTown and, I guess, that page 21 reference is satisfied without adding a train.

While we are on page 21.....this is an interesting bit (I think someone touched on above):

Increased service (including pilot service on limited service corridors) to special events, including the Indy Auto Race,
Caribana, CNE, and the Santa Claus Parade, will respond to demand for travel to these activities.

As a passenger/customer on one of those limited service corridors, it always is/was frustrating to listen/read promotions for going to events via GO knowing that they were not really serving me. In particular, the events that cause road closures like Caribana and the Indy. It just grates a bit when you think "sure I could sit on a bus not moving on the gardiner because of the Lakeshore closure to allow the event that I am trying to get to happen" I know it is a bit irrational but it always had that effect on me.

So, great to hear that they are looking at running trains on those lines (I have also never understood nor had anyone give me any good reason why all the limited service lines don't just run the same trains on the weekend as they do during the week......there is no capacity issue on the tracks.....they have the equipment and, surely, if there is enough demand on the Lakeshore to support hourly service on the weekends there must be some demand on the other lines for some service...but that is another gripe for another time).

What would really help weekend utilization on the Milton and GT lines (assuming they are considering/testing weekend trains) would be a shared station in/around Liberty Village. I have been on this for years and it just does not seem to rise up on anyone's priority list. A station near West Elm/Mildred Pearce would serve the Exhibition area very well. The Ex grounds have seen a very large amount of growth and the combination of BMO/the QE theatre/the convention centre/Ricoh have meant that more and more of the large scale "avoid traffic take the train" sort of events in the city take place here......giving two additional high traffic rail corridors the ability to serve that area is the sort of traffic driver that could make weekend/off-peak service more financially viable........asking those customers to take the train past the event they are going to and taking the streetcar back might just make the thing unpalitable to some and drive usage down and make people think "see, we did not need to give them trains".

Pretty sure it would not have to be an overly fancy station either....and could be utilized as just a "special events stop" (ie. the weekday core service would not have to be slowed down by stopping there - well, perhaps during the ex they should).
 
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Page 33 is amusing:

Bombardier has been an integral part of the GO Transit operation since 20?? when it assumed the maintenance of the GO
Transit rail fleet.

Looks like someone put the question marks as a placeholder but forgot to actually check what year Bombardier took over.
 
2. The train that currently leaves Bramalea at 9:20 may very well be one of the trains extended to K-W. If that is the case you have added a late rush train to "Georgetown" without actually adding any new trains at all (in a funny sort of way).
Though we've already heard that the train time departing Kitchener is 6:30 AM and 7:45 AM (if I remember correctly from what I posted above), so it seems likely that this wouldn't match the 9:20 train ... or be a shoulder train. But who knows what they will actually do ... especially if they are short crews.
 
Though we've already heard that the train time departing Kitchener is 6:30 AM and 7:45 AM (if I remember correctly from what I posted above), so it seems likely that this wouldn't match the 9:20 train ... or be a shoulder train.

Which is why I went on to say:

Even if that train itself is not one of the ones extended......extending two others frees up space in Georgetown that would allow that train to start in GTown....no? So, extend two trains so that they start in K-W, extend the 9:20 so that it starts in GTown and, I guess, that page 21 reference is satisfied without adding a train.
 
But who knows what they will actually do ... especially if they are short crews.
They're short but they should still be able to manage 2 crews for 2 more trains by December. If it doesn't happen I'd have to assume its more a capacity constraint issue due to the construction along the line.
 
What I find most interesting is the mention of "double berthing of trains" in Union station. Its seems this is how they plan on dealing with the future capacity crunch. As there is only space for one additional platform at Union and tunneling new platforms under Union would be prohibitively expensive due to the future retail level. It would seem they’ve acknowledged that this is the only realistic option left. Although due to the location of switches and space constraints within the USRC, only tracks 5-10 have enough space to accommodate 2 GO trains.


Would they have to add stairwells to Yonge Street for example to allow for double berthing? It would certainly increase the walk.

Would this be on the far South of the station? Would they have to eliminate one of the by-pass tracks to fit it in?
 
Would they have to add stairwells to Yonge Street for example to allow for double berthing? It would certainly increase the walk.

I was thinking the exact same thing. What will end up happening is the coaches under the shed will become packed while the ones towards either end will be almost empty. I'd imagine they would have to add stairs at Young on the east side & Simcoe on the west to prevent this. Also because there will be a huge crush of pedestrian traffic at union for those tracks. Tracks 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 & 10 would be able to accommodate 2 trains. Though 5 & 10 would only have room for 2 '10 packs' not 12's. It wouldn't be physically possible to do so with tracks 1 through 4 as the rail corridor narrows before Young on the east side(where a condo called Backstage will be going up shortly) and Simcoe on the West(before the Intercontinental Hotel). It may be possible to use tracks 11 to 14 in this way but not as they are currently configured. The platforms would have to be rebuilt and the corridor widened.


Would this be on the far South of the station? Would they have to eliminate one of the by-pass tracks to fit it in?

You got it, the additional Platform will replace the southern by-pass track. While the northern by-pass track will become a station track and service the new platform.
 
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I'm not sure whether this has been mentioned, but GO Transit staff have said that the Kitchener extension will allow them to park two 12-car trains overnight, which Georgetown cannot fit. So if no new runs are being added, they could still be adding 4 cars of capacity if Georgetown has a maximum length of 10 cars.
 
By the looks of things, Lakeshore is finally going to see 30 minutes starting in September. Not sure if it weekedays only or 7 days.

I have asked for more info, but some of the lines will see special train service this year for events like the CNE, Caribana, Indy and the Santa Claus Parade. This is a test pilot with other events that could be added to this list later on.
 
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By the looks of things, Lakeshore is finally going to see 30 minutes starting in September. Not sure if it weekedays only or 7 days./QUOTE]

Quite frankly I don't see how that's possible considering the crewing shortage issue won't be resolved for another year. But this wouldn't be the first time GO's wanted to implement something that they're not really ready for. :rolleyes:

I have already asked for feed back on this 30 minutes service based on your comments without using you in writting. My take, they already know about your comments just from what was said to me in person.

I think KW will be another and why it and Barrie are push to end of the year.
 
From the way the text was written in the report, it sounded like the additional 4 shoulder runs coming on-line in September were the start of the 30-minute service ... and I'd think that they'd slowly start to dribble these in over the years (decades?? LOL)

If I was a betting man, I'd guess they'd add a 8:43 and 18:43 EB from Union (starting Oakville?) and a 9:13 and 18:13 and WB from Union (starting Pickering?). But I'm sure I'm wrong!
 
Going back to the text of the report. It says:
Four additional Lakeshore east and west shoulder-peak trips will be introduced, increasing service during periods of healthy demand, and beginning to infill the current hourly off-peak and evening service with a trip every 30 minutes
(September, 2011).

Now you could read that two ways. 4 additional Lakeshore services. Or 4 Lakeshore East and 4 Lakeshore West services. The first would give you an additional train on Lakeshore in both directions for both near AM and PM rush. The second would give you TWO additional trains ...

Oh ... and in regards to them going full 30-minutes in September. The word "beginning" in there should put that to rest. Perhaps they weren't clear when they were speaking to this at the meeting.

(I suppose I could fantasize that it will go full 30-minutes ... I'm often travelling between Danforth and Exhibition off-peak ... a full 30-minute service would save me a lot of painfully long streetcar rides).
 
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The sooner Lakeshore gets half-hourly off-peak service the sooner the rest of us can worry about any off-peak rail service.
 

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