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GO Transit: Construction Projects (Metrolinx, various)

anb said:
I biked from Kitchener to Guelph via Hwy 24 once and i was riding on the tight shoulder. I still felt more safe then compared to riding on steeles.




I know there’s a lot of food and amenities at BCC and there’s a ton of buses that connect between the two hubs frequently but having even just a Tims at the station would go a long way with making the experience better.



I am willing to give this overbuilt project a pass, it’s technically the terminus of the metro style portion of the line and a “Union Part 2” to all trains as they all stop here on the corridor. The bus terminal better include Zum and the airport express bus as well espcially the former because Humber/Sheridan students really get robbed out of the time it takes to walk to Steeles/Bramalea with crossing at the intersection to hopefully catch the bus that Brampton transit drivers never takes a second to wait for passengers. The garage could also be used for both Zum and the Airport riders so it does have its use in that case.
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I believe at least the airport express was properly serving the station before covid
 
Allandale25 said:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1439989645119528961
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Some improvement.

I notice no mention of the community's request with regards to a human and/or wildlife passage under the tracks connecting the north and south sides of the ravine.
That's not a cheap exercise, and was only raised late in the process, so much as I might like to see it I would understand if there was resistance to that idea.

But it doesn't serve Mx well not to address it at all.

If such a connection is to be built in the next 30 years, now surely would be the time.
There has also been a request to look at improving the western end of the current path (no boardwalk, and quite muddy), and again no comment.
Nor any discussion of acquiring one or more properties on a willing buyer/willing seller basis to enhance the ravine.

There are lots of paths to greater community acceptance here.......
Mx has had many meetings with the community, albeit belatedly; but its not the meeting part that's key; its the listening and proving a meaningful response that matters.
 
I disagree that the problem with the new Smarttrack stations are that not all services stop at them. Different services should serve different audiences and not all routes should be turned into a milk run. Every stop a train makes will have some positive and some negative benefits. Once you have achieved most of the positive benefit of serving a location (i.e met the capacity and most of the trips), the detractors of having more an more trains stop there start to outweigh the positives. An express that stops everywhere is not express. There needs to be stations where people can transfer between two lines running on the same path... but those don't need to be all stations any more than it would make sense to say all routes must go to the same places.

The problem with Smarttrack stations are:
  1. They don't exist yet. Caledonia supposedly figured out qualified vendors more than a year ago and nothing has occurred since. So far these stations are a paper based exercise where no money has been given out in terms of a construction contract that will make it actually happen.
  2. There is no fare framework defined. How are local routes, express routes, streetcars, LRTs, subways, frequent trains, express trains, and commuter trains going to be priced and how are the transfers handled. In Japan they have a great system of fare zones, base fare, and additional service upgrade (local vs express vs super-express vs shinkansen, and class of service) fares on top. Here we have regional transit companies with their own fares, no shared definitions of zones across them all, and while there has been discussion on fare strategy... since the last provincial election those presentations to the board have stopped.
  3. Little thought about treating these stations similar to subway stations with bus loops, redirected surface routes, and sheltered connections between modes.
The problem is definitely not:
  • All trains don't stop at a particular station.
 
EnviroTO said:
I disagree that the problem with the new Smarttrack stations are that not all services stop at them. Different services should serve different audiences and not all routes should be turned into a milk run. Every stop a train makes will have some positive and some negative benefits. Once you have achieved most of the positive benefit of serving a location (i.e met the capacity and most of the trips), the detractors of having more an more trains stop there start to outweigh the positives. An express that stops everywhere is not express. There needs to be stations where people can transfer between two lines running on the same path... but those don't need to be all stations any more than it would make sense to say all routes must go to the same places.

The problem with Smarttrack stations are:
  1. They don't exist yet. Caledonia supposedly figured out qualified vendors more than a year ago and nothing has occurred since. So far these stations are a paper based exercise where no money has been given out in terms of a construction contract that will make it actually happen.
  2. There is no fare framework defined. How are local routes, express routes, streetcars, LRTs, subways, frequent trains, express trains, and commuter trains going to be priced and how are the transfers handled. In Japan they have a great system of fare zones, base fare, and additional service upgrade (local vs express vs super-express vs shinkansen, and class of service) fares on top. Here we have regional transit companies with their own fares, no shared definitions of zones across them all, and while there has been discussion on fare strategy... since the last provincial election those presentations to the board have stopped.
  3. Little thought about treating these stations similar to subway stations with bus loops, redirected surface routes, and sheltered connections between modes.
The problem is definitely not:
  • All trains don't stop at a particular station.
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Let me ask you something. What's so different about the Kitchener and Barrie Lines that stopping at Spadina-Front only makes sense for Barrie, and King-Liberty only makes sense for Kitchener? The answer is there is none. The lines these stations serve are completely arbitrary and designing these stations in such a way where you're locked to only these lines is extremely short sighted. For King-Liberty, there isn't enough room for Barrie Line platforms because they wanted to make room for Express platforms. King-Liberty does not need Express platforms, its the definition of a station that should be local trains only.
 
There is no difference and it is arbitrary. If you want to pick the lines differently then that is fine. They can both be Milton line. They could both be Barrie. They could be any line. But what makes Liberty Village the center of the universe that all lines should go there? You could extend the Richmond Hill line three stops to go to Spadina, Liberty, and St.Clair West, you could break up the Lakeshore East and West so that Lakeshore East stops at Spadina, Liberty Village, St.Clair. Lakeshore West could go to Union and then put the train in reverse and hit all these stations too. Every station could be Union station... but do we need that and is it beneficial?

We don't need all stations too be serviced by all lines. It is less convenient to not be able to pick a path that doesn't stop everywhere.
 
EnviroTO said:
There is no difference and it is arbitrary. If you want to pick the lines differently then that is fine. They can both be Milton line. They could both be Barrie. They could be any line. But what makes Liberty Village the center of the universe that all lines should go there? You could extend the Richmond Hill line two stops to go to Liberty, you could break up the Lakeshore East and West so that Lakeshore East and have Lakeshore East stop at Spadina, Liberty Village, St.Clair. Lakeshore West could go to Union and then put the train in reverse and hit all these stations too. Every station could be Union station... but do we need that and is it beneficial?
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You seem to be missing the point. The point isn't that all trains should stop at Liberty Village, the point is that all trains that pass by Liberty Village should have the option to stop at Liberty Village. Something that could be done is what Sydney does where you can have half of the Kitchener Line trains stop at Liberty Village, half at Spadina-Front, and do the same for the Barrie Line. Why should this be done? To increase options for how people get around the city. We are getting electric regional rail trains, we can afford to have trains stopping more frequently and offer a bit more of a subway like service.
 
ARG1 said:
You seem to be missing the point. The point isn't that all trains should stop at Liberty Village, the point is that all trains that pass by Liberty Village should have the option to stop at Liberty Village. Something that could be done is what Sydney does where you can have half of the Kitchener Line trains stop at Liberty Village, half at Spadina-Front, and do the same for the Barrie Line. Why should this be done? To increase options for how people get around the city. We are getting electric regional rail trains, we can afford to have trains stopping more frequently and offer a bit more of a subway like service.
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These tracks come with this interesting switch technology that allows other trains to stop there if they wanted to pull onto a station track. This is the same discussion as the interlining discussion and the reality is that such arrangements are in most cases sub-optimal. The stations need to be much bigger because more tracks need platforms, the passenger flows are not simple, if a platform keeps switching where the next train is going the platform needs to be much wider to hold people mulling around waiting, trains take longer to get to their destination because they are stopping more, etc.

What if Metrolinx put a station at Lansdowne, Dufferin, Liberty, Strachan, Bathurst, and Spadina. Would we have Milton Line stop at Lansdowne and Strachan, Kitchener Line stop at Dufferin and Bathurst, and Barrie Line stop at Liberty and Spadina, or would all the lines make all the stops? Each line to be efficient needs to limit the number of stops it makes for the sake of the entire ridership that doesn't use a particular station.
 
EnviroTO said:
These tracks come with this interesting switch technology that allows other trains to stop there if they wanted to pull onto a station track.
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News to me. Earlier plans show very limited switches between the Barrie and Kitchener Lines.
EnviroTO said:
This is the same discussion as the interlining discussion and the reality is that such arrangements are in most cases sub-optimal. The stations need to be much bigger because more tracks need platforms, the passenger flows are not simple, if a platform keeps switching where the next train is going the platform needs to be much wider to hold people mulling around waiting, trains take longer to get to their destination because they are stopping more, etc.
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We are already going to get this on LSE and Stouffville because a few nimbys complained about OL. Having a display at the station entrance that shows which platform the next train will arrive on is not hard, its 2021 we have electronic screens.
Furthermore, my main argument is that we don't need platforms for the express tracks. Instead of having larger island platforms that serve both the fast and slow Kitchener Line tracks, we could place the platforms in such a way to serve the Barrie Line and the Kitchener Line slow tracks - shouldn't take more space.
EnviroTO said:
What if Metrolinx put a station at Lansdowne, Dufferin, Liberty, Strachan, Bathurst, and Spadina. Would we have Milton Line stop at Lansdowne and Strachan, Kitchener Line stop at Dufferin and Bathurst, and Barrie Line stop at Liberty and Spadina, or would all the lines make all the stops? Each line to be efficient needs to limit the number of stops it makes for the sake of the entire ridership that doesn't use a particular station.
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Perhaps? At least the option to have flexibility in terms of operations would be nice.
 
TRONto said:
I believe at least the airport express was properly serving the station before covid
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No, the 115 Airport Express never entered Bramalea Station; the bus loop configurations and the long exit north to Bramalea Road via Steeles likely was the reason. The bus was never suspended during COVID either; it mostly serves airport and industrial workers, and it was one of the first BT routes to be restored to pre-2020 levels. The new bus loop is supposed to have direct access to Steeles and Bramalea Road (which will have a new signalized entrance) which will make it easier to route buses through. I understand that the 511 Steeles and 115 will enter once that is complete, though I am not 100% certain.
 
Allandale25 said:
Metrolinx is delegating at tomorrow's Brampton Council meeting on two-way, all-day GO train service.

Here's the presentation deck: https://pub-brampton.escribemeetings.com/filestream.ashx?DocumentId=33058
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From the above-linked presentation:

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1632261458542.png


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