Danforth Line 2 Scarborough Subway Extension

[quicksilver]

And that means jack because they have spent the past 5 on debate and nothing and they still voted liberal. It's over. Time to move the DRL construction. The SRT can be open in time if interlined and Eglinton East is elevated. Scarborough cares more about jobs then anything.

Given your peculiar fascination with the good people of Scarborough, I don't think it would be a good idea for you to presume what east Toronto cares most about. Jobs are good, but getting to those jobs would be helpful too.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

I have to ask, representing the former borough myself, why the big hate on for the eastern 40% of Toronto? And what's all this about what Scarborough deserves? Are you looking for retribution? Did you stick your finger in a bird cage at the Zoo as a child? The GTA, and all of Ontario for that matter, are hurting for better non-car transportation. East Toronto is no different. Come for a visit sometime. Crossing Victoria Park doesn't mean you're going to get mugged. Subways, LRTs; we need all of them. I hope the banter settles down now and we start building instead of sabotaging each other's plans.

Yup, I agree - at this point, we can all step back a little and start building. Don't let perfect be the enemy of the good.

AoD

 

[Solid Snake]

Province be I'll only pony up 1.48b and fed 660m. city has to make up rest of cost with 1.6% levy. Until the master agreement is finally amended and approved, city can pull out its funding via council discretion. Province would have to pick up remaining tab or broker deal with council to keep city funding. Province can't compel city to fund their part unless amended master agreement is approved.

Without the city and Feds funding, it's the Murray plan

 

[gweed123]

Without the city and Feds funding, it's the Murray plan

At this point, what I'd like to see most is the SRT just get rolled into the implementation of GO REX. Chances are the Stouffville line will be electrified before the subway is ready to go anyway. If you're looking at similar timelines, I think GO REX is the better, and more cost effective, option.

It also solves the problem of being seen as "reverting" back to the LRT. The support for Tory's SmartTrack in the general public has been pretty positive. The Scarborough GO REX could be marketed the same way, as an express above ground subway. Subway advocates are happy because as far as they're concerned it's a subway. LRT advocates are happy because it would follow the same alignment as the SRT + extension, and would cost about the same.

As an interim solution (while the SRT is shut down), get GO to install an extra track between Kennedy and Agincourt, and run a smaller GO train set between the two, with a temporary station at Ellesmere. It would be accessible with a TTC fare, and would drastically reduce the number of shuttle buses needed while the SRT is shut down. Basically the same type of implementation as the O-Train pilot project, only using existing GO rolling stock.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

I have to ask, representing the former borough myself, why the big hate on for the eastern 40% of Toronto? And what's all this about what Scarborough deserves? Are you looking for retribution? Did you stick your finger in a bird cage at the Zoo as a child? The GTA, and all of Ontario for that matter, are hurting for better non-car transportation. East Toronto is no different. Come for a visit sometime. Crossing Victoria Park doesn't mean you're going to get mugged. Subways, LRTs; we need all of them. I hope the banter settles down now and we start building instead of sabotaging each other's plans.

Given your peculiar fascination with the good people of Scarborough, I don't think it would be a good idea for you to presume what east Toronto cares most about. Jobs are good, but getting to those jobs would be helpful too.

Sorry, I just don't get why people would complain about Liberal Corruption, which is no worse then any other government, and then vote them. My problem is demanding a subway because everyone has one, and then voting for the party that only tepidly gave you one, and then saying the government does not work when city council votes again the subway again because said party now has a majority and the mayor will want SRT Scarborough is only an example of this. I'm sorry if I offended you. You're a great poster and I enjoy talking with you.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Without the city and Feds funding, it's the Murray plan

At this point, what I'd like to see most is the SRT just get rolled into the implementation of GO REX. Chances are the Stouffville line will be electrified before the subway is ready to go anyway. If you're looking at similar timelines, I think GO REX is the better, and more cost effective, option.

It also solves the problem of being seen as "reverting" back to the LRT. The support for Tory's SmartTrack in the general public has been pretty positive. The Scarborough GO REX could be marketed the same way, as an express above ground subway. Subway advocates are happy because as far as they're concerned it's a subway. LRT advocates are happy because it would follow the same alignment as the SRT + extension, and would cost about the same.

As an interim solution (while the SRT is shut down), get GO to install an extra track between Kennedy and Agincourt, and run a smaller GO train set between the two, with a temporary station at Ellesmere. It would be accessible with a TTC fare, and would drastically reduce the number of shuttle buses needed while the SRT is shut down. Basically the same type of implementation as the O-Train pilot project, only using existing GO rolling stock.

The SRT can be ready to go in 3 to 4 years. Connect it to eglinton

 

[M II A II R II K]

And arrange to have a transfer to the GO Kennedy station at no extra fare, even if it's just for rush hour.

 

[nfitz]

With a Liberal majority government now, the Bloor-Danforth subway extension will happen for sure. I have no doubt about this. I think Olivia Chow and David Soknacki need to start rethinking the transit plans they have put forward...

The province has caved, and caved again to whatever City Council goes with. If the city changes their mind yet again, and goes with LRT, then they still have the current agreement with the Province, where the province is building the LRT at the province's cost.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

The province has caved, and caved again to whatever City Council goes with. If the city changes their mind yet again, and goes with LRT, then they still have the current agreement with the Province, where the province is building the LRT at the province's cost.

Doubtful the province will cave now that they have a majority. It's a done deal.

AoD

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Doubtful the province will cave now that they have a majority. It's a done deal.

AoD

The province is the one with the power now. They can cave and lose nothing.

 

[nfitz]

Doubtful the province will cave now that they have a majority. It's a done deal.

It is a done deal though. The signed deal between the province and City is to build LRT.

Given the City hasn't even started the EA yet, and the TTC has said everything they are doing until after the election, allows for both options, it's pretty clear that there won't be a new deal signed before the municipal election.

 

[BurlOak]

The province is the one with the power now. They can cave and lose nothing.

Look at the Liberal intentions when they had a Majority. The SRT/LRT is their preference. If Chow wins, the subway extension will eventually be seen as a Ford thing and there will be enough support to switch it back to LRT.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

The province is the one with the power now. They can cave and lose nothing.

Except those Liberal MPs elected in Scarborough will have a fit - and it's pretty clear that the Liberals need the urban vote to stay in power. They are not going to blow up their brand by going back on the decision. And assuming Olivia Chow gets elected, the province can tie additional transit/housing/whatever funding to keeping the BD extension, Chow would not be in a position to contest that so long as she gets something to show for it. Hell she can even play it out as if she is the one who brought home the subway bacon. From her perspective she would have lost nothing - she wasn't the one who implemented the subway surtax and she can use it to leverage additional transit from the province. It's a win-win.

AoD

 

[rbt]

Look at the Liberal intentions when they had a Majority. The SRT/LRT is their preference. If Chow wins, the subway extension will eventually be seen as a Ford thing and there will be enough support to switch it back to LRT.

Subway or not, Chow needs to remove the cities responsibility for project cost overruns. Toronto would struggle to carry a 20% cost escalation of the project without substantial tax increases, and Chow can't afford to significantly increase taxes for a Ford promise (neither can Tory for that matter).

What the province does with the remaining pieces is up to them.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Look at the Liberal intentions when they had a Majority. The SRT/LRT is their preference. If Chow wins, the subway extension will eventually be seen as a Ford thing and there will be enough support to switch it back to LRT.

Except those Liberal MPs elected in Scarborough will have a fit - and it's pretty clear that the Liberals need the urban vote to stay in power. They are not going to blow up their brand by going back on the decision. And assuming Olivia Chow gets elected, the province can tie additional transit/housing/whatever funding to keeping the BD extension, Chow would not be in a position to contest that so long as she gets something to show for it. Hell she can even play it out as if she is the one who brought home the subway bacon. From her perspective she would have lost nothing - she wasn't the one who implemented the subway surtax and she can use it to leverage additional transit from the province. It's a win-win.

AoD

I'm not sure Chow wants to be all about taxes on day one. The Liberals MPPs in Scarborough were just elected, what is going to happen in three years? Who will be the PC leader that will promise them subways? Brad Duguid and the Scarborough Liberal caucus have nothing to fear. The subway is a Ford project and and it barely passed last time too. Besides if Olivia is smart, she comes out and interlines it with the Crosstown? The transfer is gone, which is what this is really about.