Palma
Senior Member
So does tHis mean that federal gov't need to put forth new money correct? If they take it from sheppard LRT where it is previously committed, then it reverts back to LRT.
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AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
Palma:
Yes, and no maybe? It basically puts the onus on the Feds to come up with new funding. If they don't, it would be interesting to see how council finesse THAT one.
AoD
Yes, and no maybe? It basically puts the onus on the Feds to come up with new funding. If they don't, it would be interesting to see how council finesse THAT one.
AoD
Silence&Motion
Senior Member
From what I understand, council made the following decision:
1. Subway over LRT
2. Increase property taxes to the level suggested by the city manager (not the lower level suggested by Ford)
3. To protect all other transit projects (including the SELRT)
4. If sufficient money is not provided by Feds and Province, to revert to the original Scarborough LRT plan.
Please correct me if I got anything wrong. If not, then I'm generally happy with the outcome. Even though I was leaning toward the LRT, this subway may provide a release valve for the pro-subway politicians so they leave the three LRT lines (Finch, Eglinton, and Sheppard) alone.
1. Subway over LRT
2. Increase property taxes to the level suggested by the city manager (not the lower level suggested by Ford)
3. To protect all other transit projects (including the SELRT)
4. If sufficient money is not provided by Feds and Province, to revert to the original Scarborough LRT plan.
Please correct me if I got anything wrong. If not, then I'm generally happy with the outcome. Even though I was leaning toward the LRT, this subway may provide a release valve for the pro-subway politicians so they leave the three LRT lines (Finch, Eglinton, and Sheppard) alone.
Palma
Senior Member
But if no new federal funding, i believe ford and any others said no subway will be built. What do you mean how council finesses it.
TheTigerMaster
Superstar
Hopefully the feds don't fund this boondoggle (I dont use that word lightly). Glad to see SELRT protected.
bobbob911
Active Member
I'm not sure if this means "if sufficient funding arrives to satisfy the 2.4% increase recommended by the city manager", or "if sufficient funding arrives to satisfy the 1.1% increase recommended by the city manager". if the former, Ford is going to have a lot of 'splainin to do to Ford Nation.
Tulse
Senior Member
Also, the province has to kick in the full $1.8 billion it had earmarked for the LRT option, which they had previously said they'd reduce if it got turned into a subway.
Or they may smell blood in the water, and now fight to extend Sheppard East as a subway, extend it west, build one on Finch...
Let's hope this at least makes a Relief Line easier.
Silence&Motion
Senior Member
If the Feds refuse to pay for the Scarborough Subway, not only will it make Rob Ford look impotent, it will also make the Feds look completely hostile to suburban Toronto (where they now have several seats to protect from the ever more popular federal Liberals). In that sense I think it's a win-win situation. Either the Federal conservatives cough up money for an expensive, socialist public transportation plan, or they make enemies of the very suburban voters they're counting on to survive the next election... and we still get an LRT.
kEiThZ
Superstar
Fully agree. Fare by distance should be implemented. And it won't happen as long as the TTC manages the long-haul subway network. I'd like to see the TTC broken up, with the subway and LRT network run by Metrolinx, in conjunction with GO and the buses and streetcars left to the TTC. The feeder network demands the largest subsidy and service is largely determined by local ratepayers. The subway network is more capital intensive and will usually require provincial investment. It's time to put the chickens in the proper pots.
kEiThZ
Superstar
Agree. I expect the Feds will pony up. And so will Queen's Park. It's huge that Toronto has agreed to raise taxes to pay for the subway. I doubt Queen's Park and Ottawa want to discourage that.
Tulse
Senior Member
Right, because the problem is the system is way too integrated...
Tulse
Senior Member
And how will Harper tossing a cool half-billion bag of cash at Toronto that was previously unbudgetted play with his Western base?
Silence&Motion
Senior Member
It's going to be very hard for them to make the case that Scarborough needs TWO subway lines. The whole "Scarborough needs a subway" argument has now been used up. Also, I doubt Ford would dare propose an additional transit tax on top of the one that just got approved, which would be necessary for any new subway line.
I doubt we will start building more subways in Scarborough before this line is finished in 2023 (or whenever it's supposed to be done). By that time all of the LRT lines should be built (I think).
Silence&Motion
Senior Member
His Western base is safe. His government is riding on the GTA. And rejecting this subway wouldn't be pissing off NDP voters, it would be pissing off exactly the pro-Ford suburban voters that shifted from the Liberals to the Conservatives in the last election and gave Harper his majority.
historydude2012
New Member
It would be nice if council spent two days debating how to build the downtown relief line (and actually come up with some kind of a solution).