SunriseChampion
Senior Member
In any case, the single thing I "can't stand about Toronto" is the existence of Ford Nation.
Not even lying right now.
Not even lying right now.
FWIW, I was very much an anti-Ford vote, and I would have voted for Chow or Tory or a lamp, depending on who was leading in the last polls.
I'm still gobsmacked by (a) right-leaning posters who call Ford 'centre-right' and have a scorched earth policy towards Chow and (b) left-leaning posters who wouldn't vote for the devil John Tory, 'cause, you know, horns. And he's just Ford in sheep's clothing.
well, if that's pride then we're back in the 50s. don't talk about abuse at home, depression, the uncle that drinks too much, or that the priest touched you, etc. It's embarrassing! Sweep it under the rug.
Of course poverty is a relative term -- no one thinks Toronto is equal to Mumbai. But the attitude you described is one reason Chow's message is not resonating. People don't want to talk about hungry kids in Toronto; they don't want to believe that there are hungry kids in Toronto -- it makes them uncomfortable. Nervous laughter, "how about those Leafs, eh?" -- change the subject; "Are you getting the new iPhone? Did you watch Game Of Thrones?" everything is fine, no one is hungry here!
You can't solve problems if you're going to pretend they don't exist.
How about the fact that the city is becoming unlivable for working, lower-middle class people?
Poverty in Toronto is a serious issue, but also something that doesn't affect vast portions of this city and probably why Chow's message is not resonating well, not due to willful ignorance. Those social policies Chow admires so much have never done a single thing for my lower-middle class family, we've never received any benefits because we never qualified for them. All while throughout my childhood my parents struggled to maintain our standard of living. I am sure my story is something a large portion of the electorate can identify with more than the issue of poverty is.
I'm not seeing the disappearance of the middle class, at least not in my neighbourhood in Cabbagetown. Sure, we have lawyers and doctors, but my next door neighbour is a school teacher, the other side is a hairdresser, across the street is a university prof, two houses down is a home renovator/contractor, two houses up is a small consulting biz owner. There's a police officer and school teacher couple up the road. Myself, I'm a marketing manager in CPGs, while my wife works as an office admin. In my area many own and many rent their homes.While the disappearance of the middle class is a problem of great concern to me....
How about the fact that the city is becoming unlivable for working, lower-middle class people?
Poverty in Toronto is a serious issue, but also something that doesn't affect vast portions of this city and probably why Chow's message is not resonating well, not due to willful ignorance. Those social policies Chow admires so much have never done a single thing for my lower-middle class family, we've never received any benefits because we never qualified for them. All while throughout my childhood my parents struggled to maintain our standard of living. I am sure my story is something a large portion of the electorate can identify with more than the issue of poverty is.
I'm not inclined to be a Chow supporter, but I'm finding some of the response here to her statements strange. Some of the same people who express doubt that a family can live in Toronto on $60,000 annual income also want to dismiss the idea that poverty is a problem. If you believe it takes a hundred thousand or more a year for a family to live decently, shouldn't you also recognize that large swaths of people don't have the ability to make anywhere near that? Isn't that a problem? Or are you just willing to write all those people off? Do you think they should all be living elsewhere?
I'm not seeing the disappearance of the middle class, at least not in my neighbourhood in Cabbagetown. Sure, we have lawyers and doctors, but my next door neighbour is a school teacher, the other side is a hairdresser, across the street is a university prof, two houses down is a home renovator/contractor, two houses up is a small consulting biz owner. There's a police officer and school teacher couple up the road. Myself, I'm a marketing manager in CPGs, while my wife works as an office admin. In my area many own and many rent their homes.
I would consider a household income of about $100K as middle class, but that's just IMO, with no stats or demographic/economic info to back it up with. Sure, the days of the blue collar middle class person are likely gone from my area, as are the employers in that category, but if you've got marketable skills, and can pull in $100K or more as a household, you can certainly live in downtown east.
Here are some houses in the east part of the city a couple earning a combined $100-$120K could afford.
$499K - http://www.realtor.ca/propertyDetails.aspx?PropertyId=14938080
$679K - http://www.realtor.ca/propertyDetails.aspx?PropertyId=14284077
$699K - http://www.realtor.ca/propertyDetails.aspx?PropertyId=14647410
$60,000 is just about right for a comfortable living style. You don't need two cars in Toronto, nor change the car model every one or two or three or four years. You don't need to eat out every day at a fast food restaurant. You don't need to smoke. You don't need new clothing every change of season, because the styles change. You don't need to go out of the country for a vacation every year.
$400k mortgage on $100k income is highly irresponsible. And that's your cheapest place with 20% down. Average downpayment is under 10% these days. That ratio is especially bad if you have kids. Would the bank even allow that debt-income ratio?
$60,000 is just about right for a comfortable living style. You don't need two cars in Toronto, nor change the car model every one or two or three or four years. You don't need to eat out every day at a fast food restaurant. You don't need to smoke. You don't need new clothing every change of season, because the styles change. You don't need to go out of the country for a vacation every year.