YRT/Viva Construction Thread (Rapidways, Terminals)

[innsertnamehere]

Young grasshopper, I realize to you, 1988 was only slightly after the die-out of the dinosaurs, LOL.....

But believe it or not, there was extensive development on Yonge, north of Steeles even back then, and regular GO Bus service.

There were towers in Thornhill, and Hillcrest Mall was already old.

Highway 7 was already the main East-West artery through Markham, anchored at the time, by Markville Mall.

The immediate zone of Highway 7/Yonge was country'ish only because it was a protected provincial corridor used to later accommodate #407.

A highway there was no point to building unless one envisioned significant intensification; which one should then have planned for, including pedestrian-friendliness.

I'll concede, the actual project was led by the province, rather than York Region.

Still it was bad planning then, and bad planning now.

I'm well aware. I've read the parkway belt plan before. but in 1988, york region was a heavily suburban municipality, with limited density around a few malls. The idea of intensification was a small one, and suburban sprawl was in full gear. The 407 was constructed and Highway 7 had to be moved out of the way - the province grade separated it to allow it to remain as a sort of "free" alternative to the tolled expressway.

 

[Leo_Chan]

What York Region can't overcome realistically is the hash they made of #7 from Bayview to Bathurst by grade-separating it.

A move made entirely for the benefit of cars, leaves VIVA on #7 very disconnected from any urban fabric (yeah, yeah, what urban fabric, LOL) .......

But there could be one, if the road grid facilitated it.

To the extent there may still be a more urbane Yonge Street near #7, its relationship to VIVA will always be troubled.

I've seen somewhere that there's a possible for the Highway 7 Rapidway to go onto High Tech Rd or the Garden Ave Extension west of Bayview Ave. With the Richmond Hill Centre/Bayview Glen redevelopment of the big box stores, the Rapidway would go through it like Downtown Markham. I don't see the possibility of such a road grid extending west of Yonge St, as they're already building the bus lane on Highway 7 from Yonge to Bathurst, though it's just in the westbound direction. It theoretically could continue west on Garden Ave, through the residential area, have a stop at Langstaff Secondary School, go through the Richmond Hill Golf Club, and turn south onto Bathurst, but that's politically infeasible as the road is too narrow and would need to demolish homes and would abandon the new and in construction Bathurst Station. It also could, however unlikely, to abandon the Bayview Stations and Bayview Towers (not really) and go north a bit east of Bayview to connect with the Bayview/Highway 7 Connector Rd/Garden Ave Extension.

So something like this would be optimal, but just extremely unlikely to be implemented:

 

[hw621]

Did YRT get a bite of the newly announced Fed infrastructure funding?

 

[cplchanb]

Prob not. Iirc all of their current projects have already been funded or still a ways off

 

[hw621]

That is not fun.

 

[Leo_Chan]

That is not fun.

The only project that needs to be completed and is funded is the Rapidway from Birchmount Rd to Unionville GO. It's been stated it will be completed by 2021, but there has been no indication on when construction will start.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

How about some local transit, evening, weekend expansion?

 

[Kyle Campbell]

the rapidways are designed for easy conversion to lrt should the need arises. york region has future proofed itself for the next 30 years

Ask us Ottawan's how "easy conversion" actually worked out as the first example of BRT -> LRT....

Spoiler alert, not at all easy.... Except for having a pre existing ROW.

 

[Leo_Chan]

Ask us Ottawan's how "easy conversion" actually worked out as the first example of BRT -> LRT....

Spoiler alert, not at all easy.... Except for having a pre existing ROW.

Well, the platform lengths are long enough for LRT compared to Ottawa. The canopies are designed to be expanded. Transit signals are already in place, with aggressive transit priority activated easily. There’s probably more good things to point out, but I agree there are there are major growing pains when converting to LRT.

 

[rbt]

Ask us Ottawan's how "easy conversion" actually worked out as the first example of BRT -> LRT....

It's gone pretty smoothly where that ROW existed. Downtown has been a bit of a nightmare but there wasn't anything there to reuse (no dedicated bus ROW).

A York Region conversion would take a couple years for surface LRT but not much more than that. Of course, with current ridership levels it seems overbuilt already.

 

[ShonTron]

It's gone pretty smoothly where that ROW existed. Downtown has been a bit of a nightmare but there wasn't anything there to reuse (no dedicated bus ROW).

A York Region conversion would take a couple years for surface LRT but not much more than that. Of course, with current ridership levels it seems overbuilt already.

A lot of the work involved in LRT construction is utility relocation. The York Region BRTs hopefully got that taken care of if it ever comes to conversion, which I doubt will happen in at least 20 years. As said above, the surface sections of the LRT that didn't need re-engineering were built quickly. The tunnel and a few stations (like Hurdman) required more work.

 

[TOareaFan]

Did YRT get a bite of the newly announced Fed infrastructure funding?

Prob not. Iirc all of their current projects have already been funded or still a ways off

Not YRT directly (but, then again, neither did other transit agencies) but York Region did.

 

[Transportfan]

Young grasshopper, I realize to you, 1988 was only slightly after the die-out of the dinosaurs, LOL.....

But believe it or not, there was extensive development on Yonge, north of Steeles even back then, and regular GO Bus service.

There were towers in Thornhill, and Hillcrest Mall was already old.

Highway 7 was already the main East-West artery through Markham, anchored at the time, by Markville Mall.

The immediate zone of Highway 7/Yonge was country'ish only because it was a protected provincial corridor used to later accommodate #407.

I searched my old VHS collection in response to this post and uploaded this Hwy. 7 drive vid from...1988:

 

[hw621]

Not YRT directly (but, then again, neither did other transit agencies) but York Region did.

Oh yeah? How much and what are they spending it on? I thought that the finding is solely for transit no?

 

[Kyle Campbell]

A lot of the work involved in LRT construction is utility relocation. The York Region BRTs hopefully got that taken care of if it ever comes to conversion, which I doubt will happen in at least 20 years. As said above, the surface sections of the LRT that didn't need re-engineering were built quickly. The tunnel and a few stations (like Hurdman) required more work.

There were also issues like the bridges at Hurdman and Bayview being in much worse condition then expected due to 30 years of salt corrosion. I don't mean it was terrible, but the intention 30 years ago was that the transitway was pretty much a lay rail and your done idea. The platforms seemed long enough at the time. Those assumptions turned out wrong decades later, and if the Viva rapidways get converted on a similar 30 year later thing they'll find that it's less convertible than thought too. Seattle also found that out with their downtown tunnel which had rail installed in the 80s but had to be all redone when they actually introduced the link Lrt