With the benefit of hindsight, how to change Canada's immigration policy?

[theowne]

I am proud to be a white, male living in one of the richest countries on earth that was built on Judeo-Christian principles (even though I am an atheist, I can live with that, too). The fact that everyone wants to live here must be an example that 'we' are doing something right

And again, there you go. I mean, isn't sort of meaningless to be "proud" of an accident of birth? Have you invented anything recently? Discovered any new scientific principles? What is it "you" are doing right? It all sounds so ridiculous.

And by the way, I also answer "I am Canadian" to the nationality question. The only difference is that being non-white, I, a few times, would get an odd look. It's like I can't win.

IntranetUSA:

One of the main reasons why we have racial tensions is because too many people play the race card. People need to stop screaming out racism every time they hear something they don't like.

And in return, people need to stop playing the anti-PC card for every single comment related to race that is brought up.

 

[theowne]

Oh, I can definitely admit to that. One of the very best things about Canada's multiculturalism is the improvement in the quality and variety of the Canadian women. Myself, I've dated an FOB Chinese, East Indian, Maltese, Ukranian and Italian. Being English-myself, I have to admit that my country's womanfolk are not the best of Europe.

Love the accent though. In my opinion, the British accent immediately makes the woman in question more attractive

 

[Dichotomy]

And again, there you go. I mean, isn't sort of meaningless to be "proud" of an accident of birth? Have you invented anything recently? Discovered any new scientific principles? What is it "you" are doing right? It all sounds so ridiculous.

And by the way, I also answer "I am Canadian" to the nationality question. The only difference is that being non-white, I, a few times, would get an odd look. It's like I can't win.

IntranetUSA:


And in return, people need to stop playing the anti-PC card for every single comment related to race that is brought up.

Race is irrelevant, my friend. It's all about culture. The Chinese and the Mesopotamians had the first kick at the can - and blew it. Europe became more competitive and the free-flow of ideas accelerated Europe's rise throughout the last half of the last millenium.
Multiculturalism is a crock. At it's core is a lie: that all cultures are equally valid. There is the automatic assumption that Western 'culture' is merely the sum of all its parts; whereas, non-Western culture is somehow immutable or primal. Funny that those who promote this line of logic would never want to live anywhere except a Western country. I wonder why is that? The placard waving, bumper sticker wearing champagne socialists should go to the countries where people are fleeing from and do their 'good' work over there. Good luck with that!

And, theone, how do you know that I haven't invented something? I haven't paraded my resume, nor my accomplishments on this board, have I?

 

[theowne]

It's almost amusing to me how you completely and utterly miss the point every single time I say it.

I really don't care about your ramblings about socialism and all that, just the idiotic notion of "being proud of my noble ancestors and western history". It's like being proud of having black hair. Or being proud of not having been born with a birthmark. The same notion which fuels all of the racial violence in the world, the idea of having some sort of higher status because you happened to be born in a geographic area where other, more talented people were also born. None of this has anything to do with all your ramblings about history and culture. And Re: Chinese and Mesopotamians, there were a lot more than those two, in case you didn't know.

 

[Dichotomy]

Well, at least I am adding to this discussion and not just making personal attacks. But that's far easier than having to come up with an original thought, isn't it?

 

[syn]

You're wasting your time theowne. Dichotomy doesn't get it and I don't think he ever will. As they say, ignorance is bliss.

 

[ganjavih]

Multiculturalism is a crock. At it's core is a lie: that all cultures are equally valid.

You're living in the wrong country, dude.

 

[GraphicMatt]

You're living in the wrong country, dude.

The whole 'multiculturalism is terrible!' meme is big amongst the small-but-loud very-right-wing Canadian contingent online. They hang out at smalldeadanimals.com and the freedominion.com forums, and also manage to politicize every single comment thread at the CBC.

I'm not even really sure what their argument is based on, honestly. There are very few first-world countries that can lay claim to a monoculture these days, and for good reasons. Multiculturalism surely does lead to some issues when cultures clash, but the benefits outweight the drawbacks. And, besides, short of isolationism and/or mind control, how would you ever stop it?

 

[afransen]

I was banned from 'free' dominion for questioning some of their logic (and it was all canuckistan this, and Lie-beral that). And I mean with in a matter of a couple of hours. I was impressed--they managed to lower my opinion of them more than after merely reading their ideas.

I guess I should say that I'm happy UT isn't so insecure. I have to admit that this forum is quite liberal. I almost miss Are Be.

 

[syn]

I was banned from 'free' dominion for questioning some of their logic (and it was all canuckistan this, and Lie-beral that). And I mean with in a matter of a couple of hours. I was impressed--they managed to lower my opinion of them more than after merely reading their ideas.

I guess I should say that I'm happy UT isn't so insecure. I have to admit that this forum is quite liberal. I almost miss Are Be.

They seem to have an Admiral Beez too:

homeandnativeland wrote:
I genuinely believe there is a bias against Canadian born whites (if I am white).

That was one of the reasons I left the GTA for New Brunswick. Provided you live in the predominantly Anglo-south or NS, PEI or Nfld, you'll very much experience Canada as it once was.

I'm a caucasian, male, England-born immigrant, having come to Mississauga, Ontario in 1976 as a 5-year old with my parents from the UK. When I grew up in Ontario, my people were dominanthttp://www.freedominion.com.pa/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=61363&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=15#, but it seemed normal to me. Now Mississauga and Ontario vastly different, and I don't care for it.

Get out of Ontario, BC and Alberta and you'll see that the Canada you once knew still exists. Don't try to get a government job unless your French or at least bi, but that's another topic. NB is trying its best to attract immigrants from China, but as soon as they land they head straight for Mahw'kam, Ontario.

He sure reads just like ours.

 

[adma]

The whole 'multiculturalism is terrible!' meme is big amongst the small-but-loud very-right-wing Canadian contingent online. They hang out at smalldeadanimals.com and the freedominion.com forums, and also manage to politicize every single comment thread at the CBC.

Well, Dichotomy speaks of other forums he's participated in--I wonder if these are what he has in mind...

 

[dowlingm]

Before deciding what immigration policy should be, disconnecting it from politics at the constituency level must be looked at. Ignatieff says dealing with immigration queries - which at present is an appropriate activity for MPs under the Immigration Acts - takes up 1/3 of his office's time.

For parties like the Liberals who rely on immigrant voting blocs discussion of any changes to non-spousal family reunification threatens their hold on those communities.

The Tories want the British cops for Calgary police (1 in 10 cops now) but not "brown people" in Toronto who might turn around and vote Liberal.

Jack Layton wants to immigrate a billion people into Canada knowing he will never have to pass a law and deal with the consequences.

The BQ don't want anyone in Quebec - even immigrants from France are finding themselves shut out and many are returning home.

Immigration is tricky for the Greens as anyone coming from even a European country to Canada will inevitably cause an increase in CO2 emissions both through Canadian life and travel home - someone coming from poor African states drive theirs up by an order of magnitude.

For me sport could be a good way of bringing at least some of our immigrant communities further under the banner. We have several Indian-descent players in the Canadian field hockey team apparently. We should have top tier athletes in sports like cricket, soccer and badminton but many of the sports immigrants teach their kids are "Summer Olympics" events which get little funding from any level of government.

 

[theowne]

Well, Dichotomy speaks of other forums he's participated in--I wonder if these are what he has in mind...

I wouldn't be surprised, really. There are also a few other less tolerable forums where his line of thought would fit in. I visit these sometimes to be amused at people gloating to each other about how superior, talented and intelligent they are because they-have-grandparents-from-the-same-place-where-Newton-was-born.

Re: dowlingm. I've heard that Quebec is hesitant to immigrants because they are very protective of the French language and they feel like immigrants who come to Canada don't pay attention to the idea of Quebec being a French province when they settle there. I have a few relatives in Quebec and they speak French, so I don't know how widely this problem exists in reality.

Anyways, don't be so hard on Beez, syn. He may say a few..... undesirable things every now and then, but it could be a lot, lot worse.

 

[Dichotomy]

Well, Dichotomy speaks of other forums he's participated in--I wonder if these are what he has in mind...

Nope. Never been on any of the political forums. Guess I'll check those out, too. I actually haunt many of the car forums.

As I said in an earlier post, I was apolitical until recently. I did all my placard waving in the early '80s (against Anita Bryant, Roy McMurtry, et al), but left all that behind me to go aloft and make my fortune.

Now it's too obvious the lunatics are in charge of the asylum and something must be done.

 

[Mot]

Doesn't this support my statement? If it's randomly selected that means the U.S. isn't only accepting top-notch educated immigrants and nothing else (which would the only way to explain why their immigrant success is so much higher than Canada). They also have a family reunification program which acounts for 2/3 of immigration each year. If the United States had a policy that said "You can only immigrate here if you have X amount of money and X amount of education" than that would be an example of being more restrictive. When I say restricted I don't mean that more or less immigrants come in. I mean that the U.S. is less restrictive on the kind of immigrants coming in compared to Canada with our points system. And yet, the immigrant communities in the U.S. do far better. In my opinion this is a result of what "whatever" was talking about, recognition of foreign education and it's just a wasted opportunity here in Canada because the U.S. gains a lot from it's immigrant population, notably the ones I mentioned before.

The biggest caveat for family class immigration is; "Except if you are gay"
and it's despicable what they put us through. If they're going to treat natural born citizens with such contempt, you can imagine how foreign born immigrants are treated. I've seen open hostility to immigrants in the US much worse than the original posting of this thread.

Also in the US they have doctor's selling slurpees and lawyer's driving cabs. Not all foreign education is accepted. In addition it's much harder and takes way longer to gain permanent residency and citizenship in the US than in Canada. I believe Canada treats it's immigrants much better in the long run.

I do agree with most of your thoughts on this subject. The Papua point was brilliant.