Unions!

[mangasparky]

The law handles that situation: employees can be terminated without cause given severance pay. That's fine with me. If you think the severance pay is not generous enough, that is a case for a stronger law, not more unionization.

So naive.. Meanwhile, the worker is out of a job with no support or cash flow to fight for that law given right of severance. If you think for one second that an employer won't take advantage of this situation, you are absolutely WRONG.

Stronger laws? How long can you twiddle your thumbs? Unions fight these battles and WIN, every single day. Unions prevent employers from even attempting to screw over a worker.

What about workplace injury claims? Unions fight and win those battles too.

Scenario: Buddy Shmuckface slips on a stapler and is unable to work for a half month. Whoops, lets be sneaky and pay Buddy to sit at home for a few weeks. Nope, Buddy has seen that poster in the lunch room, he knows he should file an injury report, he does. Inotech's insurance premiums are now going up. They wait until he is healed, maybe a few months after even. Then WHACK, they lay Buddy off. This creates a rumor whirlwind amongst Buddy's former co-workers. They now know what to do to keep their jobs.

Buddy can't twiddle his thumbs, like every one of us, he has financial responsibilities and needs a round of upgrades, because he has twins on the way. Union lawyers protect their workers from these situations.

Somebody bring up banking sick days to change the subject.

 

[kEiThZ]

^ Good points. But again, care to explain then why unionization isn't significantly higher in the private sector? Big labour seems to go for the low hanging fruit in the public sector. But can you tell me how much a sincere effort they've made to unionize the service sector? There maybe a few genuine union types out there that care about workers. But actions speak louder than words. In general, all I see are public sector unions demanding over the top pay and benefits and claiming these as 'rights', while unionized companies drop left, right and centre in the private sector. I am not against unions but I'd like to see them at least take some responsibility for the fates of their employers (both public and private).

 

[adma]

What about the fine folks at Irving Tissue? Are they part of the Serviet Union?

 

[unimaginative2]

^ Good points. But again, care to explain then why unionization isn't significantly higher in the private sector? Big labour seems to go for the low hanging fruit in the public sector. But can you tell me how much a sincere effort they've made to unionize the service sector? There maybe a few genuine union types out there that care about workers. But actions speak louder than words. In general, all I see are public sector unions demanding over the top pay and benefits and claiming these as 'rights', while unionized companies drop left, right and centre in the private sector. I am not against unions but I'd like to see them at least take some responsibility for the fates of their employers (both public and private).

I agree that we need a collaborative rather than adversarial approach between labour and management.

I tried to answer your first question by mentioning that the private sector and public sector workers are represented by different unions. Because of its success and the low hanging fruit it enjoys, CUPE, OPSEU, OSSTF and the like have a lot of resources to organize workplaces and bargain aggressively. Private sector unions have far fewer resources because of their past failures and the closures of many of the companies they previously organized. That makes it much harder to organize new workplaces.

 

[afransen]

So naive.. Meanwhile, the worker is out of a job with no support or cash flow to fight for that law given right of severance. If you think for one second that an employer won't take advantage of this situation, you are absolutely WRONG.

Stronger laws? How long can you twiddle your thumbs? Unions fight these battles and WIN, every single day. Unions prevent employers from even attempting to screw over a worker.

What about workplace injury claims? Unions fight and win those battles too.

Scenario: Buddy Shmuckface slips on a stapler and is unable to work for a half month. Whoops, lets be sneaky and pay Buddy to sit at home for a few weeks. Nope, Buddy has seen that poster in the lunch room, he knows he should file an injury report, he does. Inotech's insurance premiums are now going up. They wait until he is healed, maybe a few months after even. Then WHACK, they lay Buddy off. This creates a rumor whirlwind amongst Buddy's former co-workers. They now know what to do to keep their jobs.

Buddy can't twiddle his thumbs, like every one of us, he has financial responsibilities and needs a round of upgrades, because he has twins on the way. Union lawyers protect their workers from these situations.

Somebody bring up banking sick days to change the subject.

Ah, so we shouldn't bother improving the lot of the majority of us who work in non-unionized workplaces? If these employees have a difficult time asserting their rights under the law, surely the system should be modified to ameliorate the situation. Surely if we're willing to let leeches like unions tax away three percent of our income to provide what should be the right of every worker, we'd support a little public money to ensure justice in employment law.

Being terminated without cause qualifies one for EI, from my understanding.

I'm not going to shed too many tears for the people who get paper cuts and don't file an accident report. Any significant workplace injury will be reported.

 

[Maggie]

Being terminated without cause qualifies one for EI, from my understanding.

And maybe a big fat law suit. I'm pretty sure you can't collect anything but you would have the right to appeal as if that would get you anything.

Anyways I'm glad I work for a Union for the following reasons which I would not receive in the private sector. I can afford a house, I can afford a new car, I have extreme health benefits, I have a pension plan. I make 4x the money my counter part in a private company makes and yet the counter parts company charges the exact same amount of money for the service as our union does.

 

[afransen]

You're very lucky that your firm doesn't face significant competition.

 

[Maggie]

You're very lucky that your firm doesn't face significant competition.

Sounds funny but our major competition are other Unions. Unions right now seem to be on a blitz to take over other unions BIZZAR .

 

[Dilla]

I make 4x the money my counter part in a private company makes...

So you work in the public sector, I assume. Well, I for one am thrilled to hear my money is keeping you in such an extravagant lifestyle when compared to your vocational counterparts in the private (aka. sucker) sector. That's just great news - for you.

yet the counter parts company charges the exact same amount of money for the service as our union does.

I would be very, very, interested to see some proof for this. Very interested.

 

[lordmandeep]

I think most people do not really care that much about private sector unions my friend. There is the stereotype that they are lazy and mean and angry but they really do not effect us and most likely some and most will get eliminated through outsourcing anyways. In the private sector there are ways to break them.

Its the Public sector unions that have now have gone from protecting workers to becoming like cartels. They are almost impossible to break because they have the power such as cutting off garbage or stopping transit. They are getting paid far to much and now are the main reason why the city budget is exploding and heading for a brick wall.

I think you should stop concerning yourself about the workers, because trust me most are doing well. Its time to think about yourself as the tax payer and need to see how much more will you have to pay to support this madness?

I think to many you think to much about others and especially about those who really do not give a damn about you.

 

[Maggie]

So you work in the public sector, I assume. Well, I for one am thrilled to hear my money is keeping you in such an extravagant lifestyle when compared to your vocational counterparts in the private (aka. sucker) sector. That's just great news - for you.

don't assume anything because I don't work in the public sector but the public sector does use us. I don't mean to be vague but I must to keep confidential my unions business



I would be very, very, interested to see some proof for this. Very interested.

How would I provide proof without losing my card? Take it or leave it, just relating my experiences. I'm sure in the private sector confidentiality is just as strict.

 

[kEiThZ]

Anyways I'm glad I work for a Union for the following reasons which I would not receive in the private sector. I can afford a house, I can afford a new car, I have extreme health benefits, I have a pension plan. I make 4x the money my counter part in a private company makes and yet the counter parts company charges the exact same amount of money for the service as our union does.

So basically your employer has significantly higher labour costs than its competitors with no value added coming from its unionized workforce (that you have admitted to). Must be great for your employer's profitability. Good luck with that plan. I hear it worked out well for the big 3 auto manufacturers.

 

[Dilla]

How would I provide proof without losing my card? Take it or leave it, just relating my experiences. I'm sure in the private sector confidentiality is just as strict.

I was hoping there was an example of a public union outbidding a private one, like in Etobicoke's garbage pick-up scenario. I just don't see it happening.

 

[Dilla]

So basically your employer has significantly higher labour costs than its competitors with no value added coming from its unionized workforce (that you have admitted to). Must be great for your employer's profitability. Good luck with that plan. I hear it worked out well for the big 3 auto manufacturers.

Maggie's employer is the public sector, so she needn't worry about profitablility. As long as people who pay taxes work productively enough to actually produce more wealth from their labour, then she/he will continue to be pampered.

 

[afransen]

Dilla, we should all work for the government... that would solve everything.