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The Urban Jungle
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TTC: Other Items (catch all)

That paint job is terrible. (But then again, I am not that partial to red.) But everyone else likes it thus far, so I shall fall into line.
 
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APTA-2048 said:
Yes that bus is a refurb.

The TTC is to receive 97 Nova Bus LFS next year. And if approved, over 200 more.
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It's been approved 9 hours ago. 342 buses total in 2017 and 40 more in Q1 2018. TTC will buy a heck of a lot more buses in 2018.

25% of the fleet would be in the new livery within a yeah and a half.
 
The new paint job is still rather bland, but it looks better than the old livery and at least it isn't MTA But Red anymore.
 
Buses look great. More red is definitely welcome. From an everyday perspective a major bonus is that grime will show less overtop red than the current white. Might agree with another poster about using the older cream colour, but matching the Outlook livery works good imo.
 
salsa said:
Brad Ross posted these pics of the new paint scheme for buses, which is similar to the new streetcars. It will only be applied to newly-acquired buses, or those that were rebuilt and needed a new paint job.
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A welcome change, but IMO they couldve been more creative. The colour transitions are all straight lines done out of the convenience where the panel joins are. If you look carefully at the front lights, the lines dont line up because they simply just painted the entire front shroud. Kind of speaks to their conservative nature of running things. If you look at MiWay or YRT, their paint schemes are much more creative.
 
First we eliminate fares for kids, now we offer reduced fares for the poor. We already offer seniors a lower price. Aren't we going about this all wrong - you don't offer your captive customers a discount, they don't need an incentive to use the system - kids, old or poor folks have no choice, they're using the TTC regardless of the price. It's the people with low switching costs and options, those with money and private transport that need an incentive to switch to the TTC.
 
Admiral Beez said:
First we eliminate fares for kids, now we offer reduced fares for the poor. We already offer seniors a lower price. Aren't we going about this all wrong - you don't offer your captive customers a discount, they don't need an incentive to use the system - kids, old or poor folks have no choice, they're using the TTC regardless of the price. It's the people with low switching costs and options, those with money and private transport that need an incentive to switch to the TTC.
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Disagree with having a kids fare, but the argument for reduced fares for the poor less about them being captive customers but more about insulating them from fare increases.

As to incentivizing those with options to switch to TTC - fares one way or another won't be the way to do it - convenience, service quality would be, and that's capital with a capital B.

AoD
 
From The Star, at this link:

Mayor’s executive approves discounts for low-income TTC riders

Committee unanimously endorsed the plan, which would see the TTC give eligible residents 33 per cent off of single adult fare and 21 per cent off an adult monthly pass.

The mayor’s executive committee has approved a plan to give discounts to low-income transit users, but without the amendments pushed for by anti-poverty activists.

During a late evening session on Thursday, the committee unanimously endorsed the plan, which would see the TTC give eligible residents 33 per cent off of single adult fare and 21 per cent off an adult monthly pass.

The landmark Fair Pass Program has been under development for years and would radically shake up the TTC’s concession system by linking fare discounts to riders’ ability to pay.

More than a dozen anti-poverty advocates spoke at the committee, and, while most lauded the policy, they also urged the mayor’s inner circle to make it more robust.

“We are requesting that the discounts are deeper, the rollout is faster,” said Jessica Bell of TTCriders and the Fair Fare Coalition.

She asked that the discount fare program, which would cost $48 million a year when fully phased in by 2021, not be paid for by reducing concession fares to other groups.

The city currently spends $72 million on discounts for seniors, secondary and post-secondary students and children under 13 years of age.

The mayor has suggested the cost of the low-income discount could be offset by “reviewing” the existing programs.

Several deputants asked that people on social assistance be given free transit passes, and that the Fair Pass program, which won’t start being phased in until 2018, be implemented right away.

“Why keep 193,000 low-income citizens waiting when the need has been identified and the solution is right here?” asked Yvette Roberts, coordinator of Young Parents With No Fixed Address. She said economically marginalized residents are forgoing job opportunities and medical appointments because they can’t afford transit.

“We’re seeking immediate implementation. No more delays. Do the right thing now!” she said.

City staff told the committee that the fare plan couldn’t be implemented until the Presto fare program is in place. The TTC’s full network will be Presto-enabled by the end of the year, but the agency won’t phase out its other payment methods until sometime in 2017.

In a speech to the committee, Mayor John Tory said he understood the deputants’ urgency.

“It’s never fast enough. It’s never enough. The discount is never deep enough. I understand that. We’d like to do a lot more. But, at the end of the day, I think we’re doing something substantial here,” he said.

Under the policy, which still has to be approved by city council, Toronto adults who make less than 15 per cent above the low-income measure would be eligible for the fare discount. The cutoff would be $45,075 for a two-parent, two-child household; $31,522 for a single-parent, one-child household, and $22,537 for a single person.

Slightly fewer than 200,000 transit users would qualify, according to a report by city staff. Residents already receiving provincial transportation supports wouldn’t qualify.

The program would be rolled out in three phases, starting in 2018 with Ontario Disability Support Program and Ontario Works clients, followed by residents who receive housing and child care subsidies in 2019, and all others in 2020 and 2021. Most eligible transit users wouldn’t get the discount until the third phase.

The plan will be debated at council’s next meeting, scheduled for Dec. 13 and 14.
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Would prefer to see the province and federal governments kick in a subsidy to help pay for this operational budget item (revenue? expense?). Since the executive approved this, then John Tory's demand for a 2.6% budget cut for the TTC is now moot, and should be ignored. If however, the budget cut demand is still on the table, then no low-income discount.
 
W. K. Lis said:
From The Star, at this link:

Mayor’s executive approves discounts for low-income TTC riders

Committee unanimously endorsed the plan, which would see the TTC give eligible residents 33 per cent off of single adult fare and 21 per cent off an adult monthly pass.



Would prefer to see the province and federal governments kick in a subsidy to help pay for this operational budget item (revenue? expense?). Since the executive approved this, then John Tory's demand for a 2.6% budget cut for the TTC is now moot, and should be ignored. If however, the budget cut demand is still on the table, then no low-income discount.
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As to the particulars. The anti-poverty strategy suggests a phase-in of the low-income pass, beginning in 2018, I thought, over 2-3 years. (different categories of riders).

Given that, it is not directly in conflict w/operating budget changes this year. (though, yes, these work at cross purposes.

***

Here it should be said, I personally oppose all concession fares, including age-based ones.

Such discounts invariably help lots of families that don't particularly need it..

Income-based discounts address this, in a way; but they add administrative complexity, leave someone having to qualify for/apply for said discount; and typically reduce
the affordability of the system over all.

***

I would like to see more affordable fares.

And in that spirit, I observe the following.

From 1990-2016, TTC fares rose 200%

From $1 per ride, for tokens, to $3 per ride, eff. 2017

Actual inflation, according the the Bank of Canada was 62% over the same period.

Had TTC fares risen in line w/inflation; 10 tokens, would cost $1.62 per ride ($16.20)

Note that this is lower than the proposed low-income fare, and lower than current concession fares for students and seniors.

Why not just banish all the administrative complexity. The resulting costs in equipment, planning, marketing, staffing and get rid of accepting cash all together while were at it;
then price rides at $2 per ride when buying 10+ ; and reset the metro pass to the same model based on 50 fares, so $100 per month, $95 if you commit to the full year.

No low-income extra needed, transit more affordable to everyone.
 
One of the parking lots at Wilson Station was shut down yesterday. It was considered surplus place, along with some other lots. The lot is to be redeveloped for retail use.

It was a decision made a while back, and when the lot at Yorkdale re-opens in February, that should more than make up for the lost spaces.

Anyways, I came across an article which I think maybe gets some information wrong about future lot closures. Namely, that the Wilson South lot is closing next year and that Downsview lot is closing in a couple of years. Some other stations are mentioned...

Thoughts??

http://www.citynews.ca/2016/12/01/five-ttc-commuter-lots-shut/
 
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