TTC: Flexity Streetcars Testing & Delivery (Bombardier)

[nfitz]

No, that's the haters that are doing a good job of that. Such a bunch of whiny, entitled brats. "the world owes me everything"

BBD has made some significant mistakes. And, as they've been doing for decades, are not dealing with vendors (internal and external) well.

I'm not sure why you are so willing to give BBD a free ride on this, and swallow their propaganda, lock, stock, and barrel.

 

[Duck]

So they're currently a few months late on one order out of dozens.

So what?

Toronto has an existing fleet.

This is not a big deal.

 

[Tuscani01]

So they're currently a few months late on one order out of dozens.

So what?

Toronto has an existing fleet.

This is not a big deal.

- Extra cost to extend the life of the existing fleet
- No capacity to add service
- Barely able to maintain existing service

Yea, really... no big deal.

 

[cplchanb]

So they're currently a few months late on one order out of dozens.

So what?

Toronto has an existing fleet.

This is not a big deal.

grounds for breach of contract= huge lawsuit (which is happening already) = bad publicity=damaged reputation=potential loss of future business

could mean a big deal in the long term

 

[DSC]

So they're currently a few months late on one order out of dozens.

So what?

Toronto has an existing fleet.

This is not a big deal.

I am beginning to see why you recently posted on the Presto thread that you "find Presto unnervingly confusing" ......

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

- Extra cost to extend the life of the existing fleet
- No capacity to add service
- Barely able to maintain existing service

Yea, really... no big deal.

It really isn't a big deal if appropriate compensation is offered for breach of contract.

AoD

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

No, that's the haters that are doing a good job of that. Such a bunch of whiny, entitled brats. "the world owes me everything"

Government gimme 1B+ for my late plane just because I am the prodigal son - and no, you don't get to have a say about the ownership structure of the firm!

AoD

 

[Duck]

- Extra cost to extend the life of the existing fleet
- No capacity to add service
- Barely able to maintain existing service

Yea, really... no big deal.

That I see as all Toronto's issue, not Bombardier's. That's like saying your kids are upset because you can't go to Disney World because your car is at the shop. It's not the mechanics fault; it's yours for poor planing and cutting it so close.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

That I see as all Toronto's issue, not Bombardier's. That's like saying your kids are upset because you can't go to Disney World because your car is at the shop. It's not the mechanics fault; it's yours for poor planing and cutting it so close.

Actually, it would be like promising a plane in 5 years and not being able to deliver on time or on budget while your competitors shave your eyebrows off.

AoD

 

[SaugeenJunction]

That I see as all Toronto's issue, not Bombardier's. That's like saying your kids are upset because you can't go to Disney World because your car is at the shop. It's not the mechanics fault; it's yours for poor planing and cutting it so close.

Are you serious?

 

[salsa]

Duck, how much are you paid by Bombardier to be their apologist?

 

[ttk77]

That I see as all Toronto's issue, not Bombardier's. That's like saying your kids are upset because you can't go to Disney World because your car is at the shop. It's not the mechanics fault; it's yours for poor planing and cutting it so close.

Actually, it's more like buying a new car a year in advance of your trip and still not having it delivered on time because the vehicle manufacturer can't manage their supply chain properly.

 

[Tuscani01]

That I see as all Toronto's issue, not Bombardier's. That's like saying your kids are upset because you can't go to Disney World because your car is at the shop. It's not the mechanics fault; it's yours for poor planing and cutting it so close.

If Bombardier couldn't meet the terms and conditions set in their own bid for the project, its their fault and their fault alone.

If I have a trip and take my vehicle to the mechanic for work, and the mechanic can't fix my car in the time he said he would, you bet Mazda would be loaning me a vehicle for my trip. (and they always do!)

 

[W. K. Lis]

Actually, it's more like buying a new car a year in advance of your trip and still not having it delivered on time because the vehicle manufacturer can't manage their supply chain properly.

And your neighbour (Waterloo) is busy building a new garage for a new vehicle from the same manufacturer, and getting worried it would be finished but no new vehicle.

 

[nfitz]

So they're currently a few months late on one order out of dozens.

A few months??

BBD are a few months behind meeting their promises of them starting to roll out every 5 days in September - a promise they made in July!

BBD are a lot more than a few months behind in total. In the schedule BBD released back in mid-2014, they were going have 9 in service by end of 2014, and 36 in service by end of 2015. BBD didn't hit 9 in service until September 2015 - 9 months late - at which point BBD promised there'd be 27 in service by end of 2015. There were only 13 in service by end of 2015.

For many months now, BBD've been promising that they'd be ramping up production to one every 5 days in 2 months time. Such massive lies either demonstrates massive bad faith, or gross incompetence.

Toronto has an existing fleet. This is not a big deal.

I see people left behind by overcrowded streetcars EVERY day. Do they think it's not a big deal?

TTC is currently running 33 buses in rush hour on streetcar routes, to deal with the current shortage. And really, they need to be running a lot more to deal with the overcrowded vehicles.

This is huge deal.

Someone pointed out that given that TTC is captive audience, that from a business perspective, it's better that BBD screw Toronto than a client who has a choice.

And screw us BBD has certainly done! This bad faith (or gross incompetence) is the reason that TTC is going after BBD for more than the $50 million limit stated in the contract.

All the power to TTC!