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TTC: Flexity Streetcars Testing & Delivery (Bombardier)

W. K. Lis said:
When I look up the bus routes that will be replaced by Transit City on the Service Summary reports, I get worried with the possible headways. A hybrid bus seats 36 people with a crush load of 53. Compare that with just a CLRV with a crush load of 132, and a possible crush load 260 on a LFLRV, we do have to wonder what the headways will be.

I would like to make sure that the current headways will be the minimum headways of Transit City, but I would prefer to see headways that match the subway's headways.
Click to expand...

Service planning is not based on crush loads, and it never is because service cannot be sustained at crush load, and everybody in the industry is well aware of that. They have a loading standard for regular service far below crush load to use for calculating service levels as per demand along a given route. The loading standard for the new LFLRVs has a design target of 130, half of the crush load. Sure, headways might drop to every 3.5 minutes at peak, but they're trying to schedule 1.5 minute frequencies today with the buses, which just isn't doable even in dedicated lanes, nevermind mixed traffic (the result is, of course, 6-8 minute frequencies in packs of 3 or 5). While that's over double the headway, but I hardly think that's anything to worry about. You can handle 3-4 minutes, right?
 
W. K. Lis said:
When I look up the bus routes that will be replaced by Transit City on the Service Summary reports, I get worried with the possible headways. A hybrid bus seats 36 people with a crush load of 53. Compare that with just a CLRV with a crush load of 132, and a possible crush load 260 on a LFLRV, we do have to wonder what the headways will be.

I would like to make sure that the current headways will be the minimum headways of Transit City, but I would prefer to see headways that match the subway's headways.
Click to expand...

That will never happen and that's the problem with the current system.

Take the 36 (Finch west) with sub 2min headways supposedly. Instead we get 3-4-5 (even 6 in the worse times) bunched together every 10 min or so followed by large gaps where a huge crowd forms until the 4 buses come together.

Using larger streetcars will allow the hypothetical headway in the past to be increased which sounds bad but in reality ... this will likely lead to better actual headways!!
 
Alstom has bowed out.

http://www.tbtv.com/News-Story.aspx?cid=116359

Bombardier still fighting for TTC contract
TB News Source
Web Posted: 3/2/2009 7:58:36 PM
Click Camera To Watch This Newscast Bombardier still fighting for TTC contract

Nearly 300 local workers could benefit if Bombardier is successful in netting a 10-year deal to create as many as 600 streetcars.

Bombardier has only one competitor left in the bid – German-based Siemens. The winner of the contract would be creating streetcars for the Toronto Transit Commission. It is the largest light-rail contract in North American history, worth a potential $3 billion.

'We’re calling on all (levels) of government to bare in mind that in the midst of the worst economic downturn since the 1930s’ depression, this is not a good time to be shipping these jobs off shore,' said Paul Pugh, CAW Local 1075 president.

'What’s involved is up to 250-to-300 jobs for approximately 10 years.'

Pugh made that call to all levels of government at a Monday press conference.

The TTC light-rail contract calls for an initial order of 204 vehicles with an approximate value of $1.23 billion. The total order is for more than 600 vehicles, and is worth an estimated $3 billion.

David Slack, spokesperson with Bombardier in Montreal, confirmed the company’s bid was submitted before the Friday Feb. 27 deadline. Brad Ross, director of communications with the Toronto Transit Commission, also confirmed that Bombardier and Siemens are now the only two companies being considered.

Pugh, however is concerned that this opportunity may be lost if Canadian political leaders do not display strong leadership to protect manufacturing jobs.

'This is an opportunity actually for governments to show some leadership, and to use this contract as a way to help regenerate growth in the Canadian economy,' he said. 'Much as President Obama is doing in the United States to try to re-energize their economy.'

Ross also confirmed that TTC staff will be making they're recommendation to the commission at a presentation in Toronto on April 27.
 
These cars will be require to handle 8% grades as there is no plan to redue current grades of 7.2% at Union or Spadina now or 30 years from now.

A new 7.2% grade track will come into service in about 4 years if current timetable for it stays on track.
 
Workers pleading to build TTC streetcar
Contract would be boon to Thunder Bay

Tess Kalinowski
TRANSPORTATION REPORTER

Workers in Thunder Bay are pleading with the TTC to let them build Toronto's new streetcar.

Their pitch, that their city needs the work, is similar to one that sent Toronto's $710 million subway car contract to Bombardier's Thunder Bay plant three years ago.

Quebec-based Bombardier and Siemens Canada, a division of a German-based company, are the only two bidders on the TTC contract, worth between $1.25 billion and $3 billion.

Bids closed Friday and the TTC expects to approve the winning bid at its April 27 meeting.

The commission has worked hard to avoid any appearance of favouritism around the procurement, after the decision to sole-source the subway cars in Thunder Bay raised questions about whether taxpayers would have got a better deal under a competitive bidding process.

The move that saved 300 jobs in Thunder Bay was greeted, however, with tears of gratitude by that city's Mayor Lynn Peterson.

Although the TTC has specified its new light rail vehicles must contain at least 25 per cent Canadian content, it would be unconscionable for the work to go to a foreign company, said Paul Pugh, president of CAW Local 1075, which has about 520 members in Thunder Bay.

The contract could guarantee 250 to 300 jobs for 10 years, said Pugh, adding that's especially important in Thunder Bay. "Bombardier is almost the only thing left running."

But Siemens Canada officials said their company would be subject to the same Canadian content rules, so the money, about $300 million, will remain in Canada anyway.

If the Siemens bid is successful, the company would open a new assembly plant in Canada, said its director of mobility, Mario Péloquin.

Siemens has 13 other Canadian plants, with about 5,000 workers including 1,000 unionized employees, some of them also CAW members.

Source
 
Siemens has a fantastic reputation worldwide - they were the original leaders in light rail technology, back in the DuWag days. I would prefer Siemens being selected - their promise to build an assembly plant here will be far more beneficial in the long run with better competition. It's not like Bombardier Thunder Bay won't be busy - they have the rest of the Toronto Rocket order to fulfill, not to mention the need for even more of them once the DRL is approved ;)
 
Also, they have the bilevel car contracts with GO and other commuter railways. It's not like the streetcar contract decision will determine whether Thunder Bay will live or die.
 
Actually, if the DRL only goes east of the core, and doesn't go north of Danforth in its first phase, additional cars wouldn't be necessary - TTC is on track to having a surplus of T1 cars after all of them are kicked off YUS. Future phases of the DRL would require additional fleet, but that wouldn't necessarily be TRs. To avoid costly and unnecessary overhauls at the system-critical Greenwood facility, I wouldn't be surprised at all if the TTC designs a new car specially for B-D-DRL (both of which would presumably be running out of Greenwood).
 
ShonTron said:
Also, they have the bilevel car contracts with GO and other commuter railways. It's not like the streetcar contract decision will determine whether Thunder Bay will live or die.
Click to expand...

Some of those other companies are going off shore now and less work for Thunder Bay.

With all the new Rockets and other subway cars to be built over the next 10 years will keep the workforce busy.

Depending on what take place for GO on EMU's, it could be more work or less work for TB.
 
I want Siemens to win. Bombardier already hold monopoly on transit vehicles in Canada. Some competition would be nice.
The new assembly plan is great! If they open it in Oshawa, it might actually convince politicians that bailing out auto companies isn't the only was to stimulate the manufacturing sector.
 
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