Willybru21
Senior Member
The third proposed GO Urban network:
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Aplus23
Active Member
May I ask where exactly was it located before they developed over it.?
Around what year were there tracks ?
Any remaining track anywhere?
Bureaucromancer
Active Member
I don't know the year of abandonment off the top of my head, but its the Canadian Northern corridor; it was abandoned as mainline long before subway construction (definitely pre-war) and never formally protected. There has obviously been massive residential encroachment into the remnants of the corridor that wasn't there when this might have been a real possibility. With that said, consisder that even between 1968 and 1980 we went from being able to use that corridor on the surface to Warden Station to building Warden - Kennedy underground.
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Aplus23
Active Member
Ohhhhh okok thanks for the answer. Those last few sentences painted the picture actually
robmausser
Senior Member
Heres the route (dotted brown line)
Notice the Bloor line already follows/uses it to Kennedy. Had the corridor not been sold off to detached single family homes, it could have been continued at-grade along it to near Scarborough Centre, and then on top Malvern Town Centre (where it says Neilsons)
JSF-1
Active Member
To be fair the reason Warden - Kennedy is underground is because the GN GECO subdivision is in the way and a mixture of CN being uncooperative and local resident opposition forced the TTC to build that extension underground for something like $75 Million (for perspective the entirety of Line 2 from Keele to Woodbine only costed like $60 Million just a decade prior). Had CN been more willing to work with the TTC and local residents not complained the extension to Kennedy could have absolutely been built on the surface/in a trench. Anything beyond though was a lost cause since the old Canadian Northern Line beyond Kennedy had already be redeveloped. It was in fact the high cost of the extensions to Kennedy and Kipling that soured the TTC and Metro on further subway construction and instead look at LRT going forward; at least until Network 2011 came along in the mid-80's. It was also this high cost the stopped the subway from going any deeper into Scarborough as well. Had the extension to Kennedy been built at the surface its quite possible the TTC and Metro may have been more willing to extend the line further, likely along the Stouffville line like the RT does today.
yrt+viva=1system
Senior Member
So I can't find a suitable thread for discussing this hence leaving it here.
After the construction of the Ontario Line, GO Expansion and Scarborough extension etc. what other transit plans are being looked at? The city/region is most certainly not going to stop growing and traffic is already at a hellish level. Are there are plans to keep continuous construction for transit going instead of "off and on" while we have the momentum and so that we keep those with transit construction expertise from departing the region (eg. Spanish cities with continuous construction).
Feel free to create a new thread if it's needed.
After the construction of the Ontario Line, GO Expansion and Scarborough extension etc. what other transit plans are being looked at? The city/region is most certainly not going to stop growing and traffic is already at a hellish level. Are there are plans to keep continuous construction for transit going instead of "off and on" while we have the momentum and so that we keep those with transit construction expertise from departing the region (eg. Spanish cities with continuous construction).
Feel free to create a new thread if it's needed.
Leo_Chan
Senior Member
I think once GO Expansion is fully rolled out on the 4 main corridors, people will finally see that GO Transit is a viable option to travel inside the City of Toronto and adding service to Milton and Richmond Hill Lines would be the next step. However, the Midtown Line could be a much more beneficial service than the previous two.
As long as there are planned extensions to the Ontario Line with funding secured before the initial Exhibition to Science Centre section are finished construction, the off and on status of transit expansion could be ended, at least for this one line.
However, I don't see it likely that there will be another new underground line that goes through Downtown Toronto very soon.
Bureaucromancer
Active Member
Bear in mind that the premier would appear to be rather fond of something in the 407 corridor.
JSF-1
Active Member
Are there any plans being looked at? Maybe but nothing is set in stone atm since we are fully focused on the projects being built right now. What I think the next phase of expansion will be:
Ontario Line North Extension to Don Mills as this has been on Metrolinx's wish list since 2015 as the DRL.
Eglinton Crosstown Airport Extension to Pearson which for all intents and purposes has the green light, we are just waiting on GTAA to get their affairs in order.
Sheppard Line Extension to Scarborough Centre/McCowan (and maybe Sheppard West). Like it or not it will happen its just a matter of when and where, but I can definitely see it being part of the next phase of construction.
I can see the Milton Line being a priority as well but CP is a big obstacle and will stone wall any attempt at electrifying the line without getting something in return. Electrifying the Kitchener Line to Kitchener as well should be a priority but we have to deal with CN Rail which we were actually on the way to doing until the conservatives decided to cancel the "Missing Link" project. Honestly we shouldn't even be having this discussion and Kitchener should already be getting expanded RER service.
Lastly there is the Eglinton East LRT which as it stands now won't receive a penny from the Province so long as Doug is in office, so either the City and the Feds will have to split the bill and go it alone with out the Province or the City will just have to hope for a change in government in 2026.
rbt
Senior Member
I realize this is a fantasy map thread but I wouldn't expect Ford to fund any additional major transit projects.
Even if he wanted to send funds to it it would be extremely difficult to find someone to build it. Existing transportation contractors are already aggressively bidding against each-other for staff. The price of the new tender would need to be high enough to poach crews from other Metrolinx transit projects already under construction.
Designs and land assembly are practical and should be encouraged.
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urbancog
Active Member
Solutions are already available to bridge the CN-owned non-electrified gap on the Kitchener line.
Alstom is due to deliver BEMU trains, this year, that will operate an 80km line in battery mode, with charging from catenary:
www.alstom.com
And, Hitachi Rail's "UK Regional Battery Train", which will also recharge in motion "under wires", is proposed to and travel up to 90 km on batteries.
www.hitachirail.com
Alstom is due to deliver BEMU trains, this year, that will operate an 80km line in battery mode, with charging from catenary:
Alstom signs first contract for battery-electric regional trains in Germany
A complete range of emission-free traction drives
And, Hitachi Rail's "UK Regional Battery Train", which will also recharge in motion "under wires", is proposed to and travel up to 90 km on batteries.
Battery and Hybrid I Global - Hitachi Rail | Hitachi Rail
Explore Hitachi Rail's hybrid and battery-powered trains, a zero-emission solution to replace diesel trains and work towards the future of battery rail.
www.hitachirail.com
Sunnyside
Active Member
I would love if there were more discussion on the 407 BRT/LRT to talk about this idea more seriously, but I’ll leave my comments here.
Imo, the main issue behind getting the line built is exactly what you have described- construction capacity. I think the value-for-money of building something along the 407 (incl. the 403 through Sauga here) is tremendous, and in a good construction environment would be cheap and quick to build. The main challenge is the queue of other projects needing attention- I can’t think of any transit line planned [to start] from now to the mid 2030’s that could be curtailed to build the line. This raises a few thoughts for me:
First, apparently the OL contract is structured to make extensions easy and seamless- if true, then a continuous work cycle of sending it to Sheppard, then Hwy 407 to begin the 407 Line should be easy.
Secondly, I think the 407 line has moved up in priority since before COVID. If anything has obviously changed in transit use, it is certainly non-downtown bound trips, which typically are recovering to/exceeding pre-pandemic levels. The line might be more urgent than once thought.
Third, the project is spearheaded by the MTO, not Metrolinx. They can probably tap into the construction contractors that typically do highways instead of anything transit related. It likely is much closer to a highway in construction, too.
A good thing to ponder is that the 407 line can very easily be phased in small chunks. I think it can start either in the east from the OL N, or as some kind of UPX V2 from Pearson to MCC. The latter lets us start the line as a way to bring rail service to MCC along one of the busiest sections of the route. Phase 2 to VMC/407 Station, etc…
And of course the line has EAs already complete. In typical MTO fashion.
EddyMCD
Active Member
After the OL Phase 1 is complete the next logical step would be OL Phase 2 extension to Don Mills and the Sheppard Subway East/West extensions (from Sheppard West to STC). This would close a few loops on the network and make everything so much more efficient. At that point, there would be almost no densely populated areas of the City that are inaccessible by rapid transit (except maybe the Humber Bay/Queensway area). I do see this is a likely outcome, though OL Phase 2 probably happens before the Sheppard Subway extension.
After this point, probably sometime beyond 2045, the next Subway expansion we will likely see is a Line 2 extension into Mississauga and/or a Phase 3 westward expansion (or off-shoot) of the Ontario Line.
After this point, probably sometime beyond 2045, the next Subway expansion we will likely see is a Line 2 extension into Mississauga and/or a Phase 3 westward expansion (or off-shoot) of the Ontario Line.
robmausser
Senior Member
The Ontario governments long term plans include the Sheppard Extension East and West, some unknown extensions of the Ontario Line, and the 407 Transitway, off the top of my head.
The city wants Eglinton East LRT and the Waterfront LRT.