A
ahrvojic
Guest
Thanks for posting that, sp. 
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B
Brighter Hell
Guest
You are aware of the concept of regional rail, right? You know, the type of transit that has brought rapid transit to suburban areas around the world? It doesn't exist in Toronto but it easily could. The farthest corners of Toronto do NOT need subways.
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unimaginative2
Guest
Haha. So true, spmarshall. I really don't get the point of the chain-link fences around the parking lots. They seem like a complete waste of money. There's definitely some kind of transit fan working at the Simpsons.
You don't seem to understand that it's not the railway line that I think is the problem. It's the massive suburban development that would be needed in Rouge Park to generate riders for your two-subway Zoo station. Do you understand that? You need to have people in the area to use the station. A few pages ago, you said that Rouge Park would be developed and a High Park-size remnant would remain. You seem to switch back and forth every post. Which is it? Pave the world's largest urban park to create riders for two subway lines? Or preserve the park with only two rail corridors running through it, generating about a hundred riders a day?
Okay, the streetcar ROWs are hardly major rapid transit projects, as you said your self a few moments later, the Spadina line was built way back in the 70s, and the other three you mentioned have never been built.
I don't get it...one second you say how the RT is crumbling and the manufacturer's out of business (by the way, Bombardier is hardly out of business) and the next you say that the city should be wallpapered with ICTS.
You don't seem to understand that it's not the railway line that I think is the problem. It's the massive suburban development that would be needed in Rouge Park to generate riders for your two-subway Zoo station. Do you understand that? You need to have people in the area to use the station. A few pages ago, you said that Rouge Park would be developed and a High Park-size remnant would remain. You seem to switch back and forth every post. Which is it? Pave the world's largest urban park to create riders for two subway lines? Or preserve the park with only two rail corridors running through it, generating about a hundred riders a day?
Okay, the streetcar ROWs are hardly major rapid transit projects, as you said your self a few moments later, the Spadina line was built way back in the 70s, and the other three you mentioned have never been built.
I don't get it...one second you say how the RT is crumbling and the manufacturer's out of business (by the way, Bombardier is hardly out of business) and the next you say that the city should be wallpapered with ICTS.
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scarberiankhatru
Guest
There, you've just eliminated whatever respectability you had left. All you care about is serving land, not people. If Toronto annexed Durham Region, you'd recommend a subway to Uxbridge - and a monorail to Beaverton.
Can't you read? It's one subway extension - we could easily pay for the RT replacement by cutting the Spadina extension.
And where's the money for one inch of your plan going to come from? Monorails don't grow on trees. Why propose tens of billions of dollars in expansion in one breath and then criticize any other opinion (even if it's also included in your plan) as impossible? Remember, you started this thread and posted the crazy map.
Both are on your map.
Port Union already has rapid transit - GO trains. You deserve to be laughed at if you think abandoning GO in favour of monorails is a wise option.
The TTC's priority is moving people, that's why we have, by pretty much any measurement, a spectacular surface network. We don't have monorails to the Rouge Park because there's no people there that need to be moved. I don't believe that any transit system in the world is operationally profitable (hasn't it been suggested that even Hong Kong's is profitable solely due to real estate?). GO's trains are often standing room only even while charging an arm and a leg and they're, what, barely 90% of the way there?
Why must you always compare apples to orangutans? Are you trying to be difficult or do you not know the difference? You don't seem to understand what a node is if you think Morningside is home to several of them. UTSC is not a major node. Sorry, it's just not big enough and it's surrounded by tons of parkland and sprawlly bungalows. If they have plans to expand to house 25,000 students, then maybe there's potential but if not, express buses are all that will ever be warranted. Why must Rouge Hill be connected to Kennedy, anyway? There's a GO train that could probably get people across the city and into Mississauga in 45 minutes (since you're sooo concerned with connecting the corners), while a subway would take twice as long.
Malvern to STC = express buses and a Midtown GO line. Pearson to Y&E is far less important than Pearson to downtown. As for the Beaches/Long Branch, they are already about a concession away from subways...in other posts, when I said that being one concession away from subways for Jane & Finch and Don Mills & Finch isn't good enough, you said it was. Why the double standard? Albion Mall - I told you several times I'd connect it directly to NYCC with the Sheppard subway and directly with Pearson, too (and possibly with the Weston line, but its routing is more up for grabs). Rexdale in your plan would not be directly connected with either place. You can't grasp that I do support wildly extensive expansions of the subway system, it's just that I don't support circuitous extensions to the greenbelt or exurbia or to exclusively low density areas. I also support massive GO improvements to help more distant areas, while you ignore them completely or recommend monorails.
Yonge Street north of Finch sees 120 buses per hour...of course a subway extension would slash that, allowing bus service to be boosted elsewhere.
As for Malvern, it does not take over an hour to get to STC...if the 133C on occasion takes almost that long it is solely because the routing is so ridiculous. Rerouting it could cut the time in half - buses could travel west along Passmore/McNicoll to Brimley or Middlefield and get to STC in 20 minutes, but the TTC is so inflexible that this will never happen.
Take the complaints from Morningside Heights away and there'd be no one from the public calling for Malvern subway extensions, just politicians, who want to give one to Malvern because it's "underprivileged." Oh, and I forgot to mention - the Malvern to STC corridor is served by about 25-30 buses. 30 vs 120...yeah, that sounds comparable to me!
Did you miss the 19 other times where I said I'd boost all GO train lines and build maybe 80km of subway lines? And believe me, you're not in a good position to be lecturing on what constitutes good planning.
So four condos at Guildwood, a college with a few hundred students (that is smaller than every high school, by the way), a university campus that only sees riders when classes are in session (yet if I suggest bringing a subway to Seneca
College, a college with more students than UTSC, you laugh), a hospital (one or two crescents of townhouses generates more trips), and the sprawlly bungalows and huge swaths of parkland around West Hill don't render a subway useless?
I guess travel times, cost, and access don't affect ridership. How are two lines to the Zoo efficient?
You suggestions are almost all bad...and they're getting worse (monorail, etc.).
It's not cheaper...the existing Sheppard line doesn't make it cheaper to tunnel around Front Street or build a line in the median of Don Mills. If Sheppard cannot support a subway, then Malvern cannot, Rexdale cannot, York U cannot, West Hill cannot, etc., etc., etc. Simple as that.
The York Mills bus will fill a station there, just as buses bring in the majority of riders to most suburban stations. If Lawrence doesn't need a subway station, than the Beach doesn't need one either.
Go ahead, waste your time.
I bet your shuttle plan would mean the complete dismantlement of the surface network. And I sure hope you've accounted in your plan for escalators to move.
Well, the subway's on Sheppard, so deal with it. And the RT would have terminated at Markham & Sheppard (actually aligning towards the NW, possibly preventing further expansions).
The ridership for a subway is already there...the SRT's numbers don't show it because they can't - it's been at capacity for years despite significant population growth nearby.
How bout none? How bout more deserving areas first? Why waste billions on areas that can't support rapid transit or areas that already have or could very, very, very easily have great GO access?
Just because Steve Munro says someone 20 years ago brought the subject up, it doesn't change the fact that it's never been seriously proposed.
Yet the owners of three condos at Guildwood deserve a subway. Your limited intellect probably compromises your vision, so I'll tell you that the McCowan area is infested with 25x125 foot lots with a persons per household rate well above the city average, along with a linear spread of high-rise clusters and malls, AKA a perfect recipe for rapid transit. Your perfect recipe includes parkland, hospitals, and bungalows on quarter acre lots.
If the DRL was built up to Eglinton both in the east and the west, almost everyone along Eglinton would be less than 10 minutes away from a station by bus.
People travelling from Durham to Peel can take the 401 or get on a GO train...the TTC should not be subsidizing epic commutes for people that don't even live or work in Toronto. If a few bus routes were altered and a few GO lines were improved, a cross-town Eglinton route would be a ghost town unless Eglinton saw massive "Avenues" redevelopment.
Don't bother telling me unless you spell his name correctly.
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socialwoe
Guest
PART ONE
Um, GO? Anything else you're suggesting could easy well follow the subway/RT alignments based in my map. I never said they had to be subways, I think I've said this on numerous occasions.
What about the Morningview area where the 131 terminates? Riders there. And if a line to the Zoo would be such a colossal failure without development, what if it were controlled development, limited only to the immediate surrounding, about 200-300m off Old Finch in the vinicity of the line between Littles Rd and Meadowvale? You have to understand I based my idea on the Zoo and the massive Morningside Heights housing development being more than enough to attract ridership, I certainly didn't anticipate these discrepancies would arise.
I've long conceded a full-length Zoo line on either Sheppard or through Malvern and definitely not both, its just some people *cough* Scarberian *cough* refuse to understand that and move on. My new hope is for the inner loop (Sheppard-Markham) to be completed whereby all Malvern bound buses can terminate and hence shave mins off the commute from STC.
To paraphrase you- Stew on this grasshopper...
"Build it, and they will come!"
Oh and by the way I'd run it to the Metro East Convention Centre on Brock Road near Finch/Pickering Pkwy hitting Rougemount Sq., Dunbarton Plaza, PTC and every major/minor cross-intersection en route!
I was referring to both Spadina North and BD East extensions.
Yes it's ironic how I've sustained this discussion thread for so long playing possum with even my own ideologies isn't it eh? As expensive as you claim ITCS or monorails are, I'm certain they're not as costly as tunnel excavation and that'll be the killer of any expansion anywhere in the GTA sans a busway. Again if we can get more kms of usable transit in less time, with more concentrated station ratio and for less money why are you bullying me to the point of mental defragmentation!?!
In the same alignment as SRT and as an upgraded subway NOT the Gulliver's Travel route you're advocating!
Not abandon, as an alternative. What if the inner-416 GO stops were shut down to speed up commutes, what choice would these people have. If you revisit my map, every Toronto GO stop except Old Cummer would have it's own subway/RT stop.
I'm assuming if a third freight line were proposed for the park none of you would mind since you're so certain Malvern, Morningside Hts, Rouge Valley residents and 000s of Zoo patrons would not ride a commuter line here. Since you guys were disscussing the 54 bus the other day, I suggest someone clock start to finish how long it takes to get from Rouge Hill to the Yonge Subway via either the 54 or 85 and come back here and tell me something isn't seriously wrong with East Scarborough connectivity.
You don't seem to realize a good reason why the west developed a whole lot sooner than the east is because good transit systems and connections were implemented in the pioneering days. Again build it, they will come. One cross-town line is all I asked for, not the Holy Grail or something. There a wallop of land north of UTSC that could house 000s more students easily, instead of the half-empty parking lots seen there today. The parkland? Spectacular! Ever heard of garden cities? People will flock it and don't worry they'll be enviro-friendly set I know you econuts relish!
:rollin
The double standard? Downtown urban areas in the heart of the action get the same treatment from you as a far-flung dentrificated slum ghetto and an intersection surrounded by sprawling parklands on the north side? And here I was wondering why the Queen line was backwatered into extinction, silly me!
As for Albion Mall, my way hits it within the same duration as yours but already serves Sheppard West residential, Humberlea residential, Albion road twice, Rexdale Centre& Blvd (Brampton will like that), 2 GO stations, a congress and convention centre, a major industrial employment zone, a viable link to Pearson, fosters new development at southside of Woodbine Racetrack, Woodbine Racetrack itself, Woodbine Fantasy Fair, Humber Regional Hosp., Humber College, Woodbridge Shuttle/Rocket at the same time. Your way: virtually zippo between Jane and Kipling but heh I guess running billion dollar subways through open field and industrial wasteland only to pass a cluster of chain malls at Weston en route is the modern and logical thing to do!
Um, GO? Anything else you're suggesting could easy well follow the subway/RT alignments based in my map. I never said they had to be subways, I think I've said this on numerous occasions.
What about the Morningview area where the 131 terminates? Riders there. And if a line to the Zoo would be such a colossal failure without development, what if it were controlled development, limited only to the immediate surrounding, about 200-300m off Old Finch in the vinicity of the line between Littles Rd and Meadowvale? You have to understand I based my idea on the Zoo and the massive Morningside Heights housing development being more than enough to attract ridership, I certainly didn't anticipate these discrepancies would arise.
I've long conceded a full-length Zoo line on either Sheppard or through Malvern and definitely not both, its just some people *cough* Scarberian *cough* refuse to understand that and move on. My new hope is for the inner loop (Sheppard-Markham) to be completed whereby all Malvern bound buses can terminate and hence shave mins off the commute from STC.
To paraphrase you- Stew on this grasshopper...
"Build it, and they will come!"
Oh and by the way I'd run it to the Metro East Convention Centre on Brock Road near Finch/Pickering Pkwy hitting Rougemount Sq., Dunbarton Plaza, PTC and every major/minor cross-intersection en route!
I was referring to both Spadina North and BD East extensions.
Yes it's ironic how I've sustained this discussion thread for so long playing possum with even my own ideologies isn't it eh? As expensive as you claim ITCS or monorails are, I'm certain they're not as costly as tunnel excavation and that'll be the killer of any expansion anywhere in the GTA sans a busway. Again if we can get more kms of usable transit in less time, with more concentrated station ratio and for less money why are you bullying me to the point of mental defragmentation!?!
In the same alignment as SRT and as an upgraded subway NOT the Gulliver's Travel route you're advocating!
Not abandon, as an alternative. What if the inner-416 GO stops were shut down to speed up commutes, what choice would these people have. If you revisit my map, every Toronto GO stop except Old Cummer would have it's own subway/RT stop.
I'm assuming if a third freight line were proposed for the park none of you would mind since you're so certain Malvern, Morningside Hts, Rouge Valley residents and 000s of Zoo patrons would not ride a commuter line here. Since you guys were disscussing the 54 bus the other day, I suggest someone clock start to finish how long it takes to get from Rouge Hill to the Yonge Subway via either the 54 or 85 and come back here and tell me something isn't seriously wrong with East Scarborough connectivity.
You don't seem to realize a good reason why the west developed a whole lot sooner than the east is because good transit systems and connections were implemented in the pioneering days. Again build it, they will come. One cross-town line is all I asked for, not the Holy Grail or something. There a wallop of land north of UTSC that could house 000s more students easily, instead of the half-empty parking lots seen there today. The parkland? Spectacular! Ever heard of garden cities? People will flock it and don't worry they'll be enviro-friendly set I know you econuts relish!
:rollin
The double standard? Downtown urban areas in the heart of the action get the same treatment from you as a far-flung dentrificated slum ghetto and an intersection surrounded by sprawling parklands on the north side? And here I was wondering why the Queen line was backwatered into extinction, silly me!
As for Albion Mall, my way hits it within the same duration as yours but already serves Sheppard West residential, Humberlea residential, Albion road twice, Rexdale Centre& Blvd (Brampton will like that), 2 GO stations, a congress and convention centre, a major industrial employment zone, a viable link to Pearson, fosters new development at southside of Woodbine Racetrack, Woodbine Racetrack itself, Woodbine Fantasy Fair, Humber Regional Hosp., Humber College, Woodbridge Shuttle/Rocket at the same time. Your way: virtually zippo between Jane and Kipling but heh I guess running billion dollar subways through open field and industrial wasteland only to pass a cluster of chain malls at Weston en route is the modern and logical thing to do!
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socialwoe
Guest
It is upwards of an hour, especially if you have to make a second transfer once in Malvern e.g. onto the Finch or Morningside buses. That shuttle between the subway and Centenary Hosp. I envisioned could just as well be an elevated guideway over the park for buses. Another plus for the Eglinton Line. Hence 133 reroute to West Hill Stn. And before you shoot this proposal down think: 124 Sunnybrook.
I meant the nine TTC routes that serve a single small area in contrast to the city as a whole, not regional GO, VIVA and YRT routes. So comparatively it's a heavy concentration of routes. That whole stretch of Yonge you describe in constrast isn't for local use, just a feeder route into York Region.
Well good for you. I sincerely mean that. And where's that full cross-town connection we need? Oh yeah that's right you're too busy squandering that 80km through a 10 line rail corridor miles away from the density-every-three-blocks that lies on Queen St. Or bypassing several trippers/nodes to dead end at STC and ditto for Finch West! Oh and good luck convincing the CP/CN people to annex their most heavily utilized rail corridor im the nation to give you your precious Midtown Line whilst my 2km extension would've been elevated over the tracks, not harming a soul.
Collectively and with rapid transit facilitating further growth, minimum 40,000 ppd within the first five years and an additonal 20,000 within the 20 years to follow.
Alright if I gave you the BD line to run upto Georgina Bay for all I care would you try to understand that the Zoo loop is apart of the same continuous line because it requires no one to have to leave one train to board another. You should know by now travel times of the commuters living farthest from the CBD, cost of using the most inexpensive technology and hence preventing further fare hikes, and access to 000s who would use subway/RT in their daily commute for the first time because the lines finally actually run into or near their communities does afect ridership.
Well that only means you believe in at least some of my suggestions and hence prompt me to continue detailing them. The monorail arose when reality set in that the most rapid transit we'll see in our lifetimes is the lousy VCC extension, monorail keeps the hope alive (this applies to your DRL and suburban lines as well).
Given the ridership levels of the Sheppard subway, 190 Rocket and the 85 bus it's safe to say my assertion about elevated ICTS is the appropiate course of action to take for the rest of Sheppard East (sorry Agincourt couldn't make the cut dude). Get why I didn't feel now was the time for a STC 'stubway', let the ICTS/similar technology matrix begin! I thought the greatest selling point of your DRL was that it'd be largely a surface RT hence avoiding costly tunneling? Further proof it's a dud. Oh and those nodes are immaterial to Sheppard so what's your point? Complicated as that!
I'm just saying, you're grasping at hypothetical straws trying to convince me the DRL is necessitious. An Eglinton line would redefine not only the topography but the routing of surface transit as well. Imagine the 54 becoming a streetcar route between Flemingdon Park and Rouge Hill. It enters a portal at Lawrence/Don Mills serving the mall underground a la Queens Quay Ferry Docks LRT. So in all a 60 sec zoom down to the subway, not bad eh?
Yeah, it would be a waste of time if you're unwilling to listen. If you weren't so gung-ho to argue you'd realize my plans really are good and my intentions are in the right place. The Beach you bring up as an example of here not to put a subway would get a California-style beach park built right out to the Boardwalk. Yup, designed with platform/mezzanine at the same level like Dundas, an open retail/recreational space underneath Beech Ave. linked to Fox Beaches cinema and right down to the end of the boardwalk. Imagine rollerblading right into a grotto that leads to the subway in the Beaches, my plans are a bit far-fetched aren't they?
Nope, a km of underground connectivity, just not a full line's worth! Streetcars would dismantle the 54 bus route since you're so adament under no uncertain terms must a subway/RT penetrate in too deep into East Scarborough.
I'm not the one who wanted to jog the subway up a whole km to serve a handful of people at Driftwood. I'm the one who wanted a full Sheppard subway from Weston (Hwy 27) to Meadowvale. And you've just proven you came across articles suggesting both Sheppard and BD (SRT) meet at Sheppard East rather than STC so why the blasting earlier on in the thread for this suggestion?
Deserving like what, your circuitous Hydro Corridor and McCowan marlstone, sage grass wacky-teerings? Give me stats that prove how much an extension to Hwy 2 would cost. I'm guessing around 1.5-2.0 at most. Midland, SGC and Galloway could be filled in later. Lawson/Port Union would come alot later if at all. On the Malvern flipside if Ellesmere, Progress and Milner are major trippers and Sheppard itself has a mall, Burrows Hall, a Chinese Cultural Centre, a Islamic Centre, Brownes Corners industrial zone, a TTC yard nearby, developable land on site, potential for regional BRT and LRT via CN tracks to the Zoo via Malvern TC at it's disposal, I don't know what amount of $ you think is not worth spending for such a dense node?
Except you conveniently forget the path of my Eglinton East subway is also lined with high-rise clusters and malls. If your plan has merit then mine does as well. Those parklands, medical centres and uniquely-styled artitecture for habitation along with two tertiary campuses on the docket, are just pluses I'd use as selling points for my subway as a gateway to East Toronto's garden city enclaves.
Hah! You relish in human suffering don't you :\ ? When was the last time it took you the 32 from Eglinton West to Yonge and it only took 10 mins? Or would Renforth be ten mins away from Black Creek? Are points along Kingston Rd north of Eglinton 10 mins from Kennedy?
An epic route that exceed 100,000+ ppd and Torontonians themselves would ride as alternatives to both the 401 and BD. Even myself who lives closer to BD sees the value of such a thing and think of all the mins that'd be shaved off my commute if it existed. All the GO service in the world don't excuse the gaps that'd remain in between and on the periphery along Eglinton, the geographic median of Toronto.
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scarberiankhatru
Guest
I'm trying to read your response, so the answer clearly is......
......yes.
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doady
Guest
Eglinton is a major corridor not only because of the lack of GO but also because of the fact it is the only continuous east-west arterial road between Bloor and Wilson/York Mills. If the TTC does not build a rapid transit line along Eglinton, GO will buidl their own, that's how important Eglinton is.
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unimaginative2
Guest
I think that the midtown rail line is the best route for frequent regional rail in the whole GTA. I'd like to see it run right from western Mississauga (or even Brampton), ideally re-routed through Mississauga City Centre, past multiple subway connections at Kipling, Dupont, Summerhill, and on through Leaside to Agincourt, Malvern, and potentially Seaton. A re-route through Scarborough Centre might also be in order. It would likely cost a couple billion to add an extra pair of tracks, build the stations, and re-route through MCC, but the route's utility would be immense.
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socialwoe
Guest
You call that a comeback? You should really reply again, without your usual tirades it's been kinda bland around here!
Gosh, how I wish they would. Any corridor capable of intersecting 30 bus routes, some forever lengths from Bloor to Steeles and beyond (Islington, Jane, Don Mills, VP) plus run pass major nodes should not have been and continue to be overlooked. I think the biggest problem is the lack of public interest, if more of us heckled politicians (case in point SOS) more would be done. Lack of organization seems to also delay things. Given the topography of the Eglinton area, elevated lines jutting in and out of the hills would be very effective.
Or instead of creating a full-length Midtown line why couldn't it be incorporated into the BD line? Dupont's too close to Bloor to make it very effective. BD already follows this alignment west of Islington and could easily continue so into Mississauga. To the east, if people were willing to listen, extend the BD line to Malvern via Markham Rd meeting with Midtown just north of Sheppard.
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unimaginative2
Guest
The advantage of the Midtown line on the CP North Toronto route is that it would provide a much quicker trip than the BD, and would relieve pressure on that subway line. Bloor-Danforth is already close to capacity from both directions into downtown. Replacing the RT with subway would likely fill the cars coming from the east, and any extension to the west would likely push that section into overcrowding as well. The only section of subway in the city that is operating significantly below capacity during peak periods is the Spadina line, and the Midtown GO line would funnel many passengers that way.
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scarberiankhatru
Guest
If you're not careful, we'll stop responding to your stupid ideas...the GO train would be at least three times as fast as the subway for people coming in from far out, that's why.
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socialwoe
Guest
"The advantage of the Midtown line on the CP North Toronto route is that it would provide a much quicker trip than the BD, and would relieve pressure on that subway line. Bloor-Danforth is already close to capacity from both directions into downtown...the Spadina line, and the Midtown GO line would funnel many passengers that way."
But this wouldn't be an all-day service route I'm assuming. It also would have to compete directly with freight trains on CN's most heavily used corridor. BD 's only at capacity during rush hour and if you're telling that's Mississauga's fault you think another GO line's gonna deter them from riding MT to BD when they already have three feeders into the city? I'm all for the revitalization such a line would instigate but all day service is a better option. I'll know when BD's at capacity when I witness it with my own eyes. Most of the stations east of Yonge are always sparsely filled, no more than 10 people if even. The west is slightly a different story at least to Keele, but, and I can't believe I'm saying this, couldn't the DRL be explored more before this route? If anything was done on Midtown I'd keep it more subwaylike than commuter trainlike spacing stops equivilent to 3-4 BD stations apart.
From Yonge heading west:
Summerhill
Dupont
Christie
Lansdowne
Junction (Keele or Runnymede)
Lambton (Scarlett)
Kipling
Cloverdale
Dixie
Cawthra
Cooksville
Burnhamthrope
Square One
From Yonge heading east:
Governor's Bridge
Leaside
Willket Creek (Eglinton)
Barber Greene (Don Mills)
Wexford (Lawrence/VP)
Ellesmere (Warden)
Kennedy Commons
Agincourt
Nugget
Browne's Corners
Malvern
Morningside Heights
Zoo (monorail reopened from station to main entrance)
Pickering Airport
Uxbridge
Seaton
"If you're not careful, we'll stop responding to your stupid ideas...the GO train would be at least three times as fast as the subway for people coming in from far out, that's why."
Only during rush hour and it piggybacks on another GO line that goes, whodathunk, directly into the downtown core! And you expect Malvern, one of the poorest neighbourhoods in the GTA, to afford daily TTC AND GO fares? Wow, Scarb everything's about speed, no wonder you push for lines where it's not possible to maintain station proximity even if such density is warranted.
The only stupid idea is the unsung, unheard one because then it won't have any instrinsic value since no one has the opportunity to evaulate and if need be critique it, hence fostering discussion and conducting a flow of knowledge 8o !
But this wouldn't be an all-day service route I'm assuming. It also would have to compete directly with freight trains on CN's most heavily used corridor. BD 's only at capacity during rush hour and if you're telling that's Mississauga's fault you think another GO line's gonna deter them from riding MT to BD when they already have three feeders into the city? I'm all for the revitalization such a line would instigate but all day service is a better option. I'll know when BD's at capacity when I witness it with my own eyes. Most of the stations east of Yonge are always sparsely filled, no more than 10 people if even. The west is slightly a different story at least to Keele, but, and I can't believe I'm saying this, couldn't the DRL be explored more before this route? If anything was done on Midtown I'd keep it more subwaylike than commuter trainlike spacing stops equivilent to 3-4 BD stations apart.
From Yonge heading west:
Summerhill
Dupont
Christie
Lansdowne
Junction (Keele or Runnymede)
Lambton (Scarlett)
Kipling
Cloverdale
Dixie
Cawthra
Cooksville
Burnhamthrope
Square One
From Yonge heading east:
Governor's Bridge
Leaside
Willket Creek (Eglinton)
Barber Greene (Don Mills)
Wexford (Lawrence/VP)
Ellesmere (Warden)
Kennedy Commons
Agincourt
Nugget
Browne's Corners
Malvern
Morningside Heights
Zoo (monorail reopened from station to main entrance)
Pickering Airport
Uxbridge
Seaton
"If you're not careful, we'll stop responding to your stupid ideas...the GO train would be at least three times as fast as the subway for people coming in from far out, that's why."
Only during rush hour and it piggybacks on another GO line that goes, whodathunk, directly into the downtown core! And you expect Malvern, one of the poorest neighbourhoods in the GTA, to afford daily TTC AND GO fares? Wow, Scarb everything's about speed, no wonder you push for lines where it's not possible to maintain station proximity even if such density is warranted.
The only stupid idea is the unsung, unheard one because then it won't have any instrinsic value since no one has the opportunity to evaulate and if need be critique it, hence fostering discussion and conducting a flow of knowledge 8o !
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scarberiankhatru
Guest
That makes no sense...speed is always crucial or no one except for the dirt poor (and Malvern is not at all a particularly poor area, FYI) will take it.
In your future world, a Midtown GO line would have dozens of stops, only run during rush hour, and still require a separate fare...no wonder you think it won't be useful.
You might want to find these places on a map...this is an impossible sequence of stations. The only railtracks anywhere near the Pickering airport are the ones that would be removed for the runways. Uxbridge is not where you think it is, either.
Trying to impart you with even the slightest bit of knowledge is like a dead salmon trying to swim upstream.
U
unimaginative2
Guest
Obviously it would be a frequent service route.
Read the post you're quoting. It's CP. Again, read the previous post and you'll see that I said that one or two extra tracks would needed. Alternatively, CP could shift some or all of its traffic up to CN's York Sub.
Of course it's at capacity during rush hour. No route in the world is at capacity for the whole day. Obviously this route isn't going to take all Mississauga residents off the BD, but it will take some of them, freeing up space for ridership growth on BD.
DRL would definitely be an effective way to relieve BD east of Dundas West.
3 to 4 BD stations apart isn't unreasonable within the city, but you want to make sure that it stays an express trip. Most of your stop ideas are reasonable, but there wouldn't be many people at Governor's Bridge, and I might shift around some of the west-of-Yonge stops.
Fare integration would clearly be necessary if such a route were ever implemented.